| Author | Message | ||
     New12r |
dont bother reading your manual, it is all useless info..  | ||
| Spatten1 |
I'm with Bob. I've owned about 20 street motorcycles and none required the kill switch to be used. I always use the key. Why not just make the thing user friendly? Why make the starting/stopping procedure different than all other motorcycles? Some basic things should be kept simple and standard. I think this whole key off thing is something that was overlooked in design and testing (assuming that is really the source of the battery drain). Nobody in their right mind would design it that way intentionally. (Message edited by spatten1 on April 23, 2008) | ||
| Doerman |
If Buell expects the dealerships to inform the owners, it is WAY delusional of its dealer network. Mine did. I got a letter in the mail with a copy of the corrected oil checking/capacity page. My relationship is with my dealer. The dealer furthermore has a contract with BMC. The lines of communication would therefore be: Works:  Don't work:  | ||
| Spatten1 |
Sounds like you have an exemplary dealer. | ||
| Doerman |
I know I do and I really appreciate it. I can't say enough good about Glendale. They are not a discount store. They are all experts and enthusiasts and do what is needed to ensure the owners has a good experience. I also know that there are just a handful of dealers that operate at that level. But I also sense/feel/intuit that there are more dealers that are upping the ante on Buell. I think the 1125R has revived dealers' faith in Buell. | ||
| Brad1445 |
You are blessed Doerman. | ||
| Spatten1 |
Not surprising that a shop near the base of the Crest would be full of enthusiasts! | ||
| Fresnobuell |
I feel like I have a dedicated service manager--he has sent numerous emails and made several phone calls to BMC. I believe he wants to help. He has also expressed frustration about the communication, or lack thereof. I don't believe the lines of communication between the dealer/BMC are as open as they need to be. Do some dealers have secret methods to access information that other dealers are not privy to? I don't know. I do remember a recent post referring to a secret "backdoor" phone number to BMC and the suggestion to inform your dealer, should your dealer be in the dark about it. That doesn't seem right to me. | ||
| Doerman |
My dealer refers to it as the "Initial Care Program" I don't believe it is a secret number or something (kept secret from owners, but not dealers). If your service manager don't have it I am sure he/she can get guidance from the district manager. | ||
| Fresnobuell |
You should find an Buell forum and endlessly crusade that point of view right into the ground. Or you can ignore it and pretend that BMC has handled the release of the 1125r perfectly. | ||
| Fresnobuell |
What severe consequences? Share your intimate knowledge and describe the severe consequences you imagine? Quote from Service Bulletin B-070 "Do not overfill oil tank. Doing so can result in oil carryover to the air cleaner leading to equipment damage and/ or equipment malfunction." Sorry boss, straight from BMC. | ||
| Fresnobuell |
The difference between the two procedures is more on the order of a pint. Is that before or after the oil level markings on the dipstick changed or the total oil capacity of the engine changed? BTW, my bike was overfilled by appx. 1.5 quarts from the factory. I KNOW that there are similar stories here. Yes, I am a bit pissed at the dealer from letting it slip by... for $325 setup fee, it should have been caught. | ||
| Tasmaniac |
G'day all Looks like i inadvertantly upset a couple of fellow Buellers with the word whinging not what i was attempting to do, Asbjorn has shown the correct protocol for handling any issues that arise with our bikes. If you have an issue with the bike by all means post the symptoms and the fix here informaion is good but don't bad mouth your Dealer or BMC on the web it does get anyone anywhere except maybe a day in court for slander. If you are having a problem getting satisfactory service from your parts guy or sevice manager then take it up with the owner of the Dealership, i think it is too much to expect BMC to deal with individual customers thats why they don't sell directly to the public. I do apologise if anyone thought my whinging remark was directed at them personally as this was not the case. I have read quite a few threads here that obviously from quite intelligent people and i have also read some from people that are misleading and anyone following these instructions could end up hurt, Regards Brett | ||
| Trojan |
Japanese bike manufactures do not just make bikes. They own and manufacture almost every part on their brand of bike. If they have a problem with a batch of ECM’s they send an engineer down from their microelectronic division to fix the problem. Buell is forced to pick up the phone and complain to a sales manager. Please be careful about comparing a great personal brand with growing pains to mass distributed Jap bikes. That would be a fine argument if Buell were alone in buying components from outside their own empire. BMW, Ducati, KTM and many other 'small' volume manufacturers also buy in their components from other manufacturers (in KTM's case almost everything except the engine & frame, although they also own White Power suspension). Repeated and similar component failures on production bikes is not uncommon, but it certainly seems to hit Buell far more than other manufacturers when you look at the relative sales volumes compared to problems. I don't know the reasons for this, but maybe it is because of lack of testing, or maybe specifying components that were not strong enough for the job, or one of many reasons. What I do know is that unless Buell get a grip on the small problems now they will suffer long term because of 'unreliability' comments in the press and on forums such as this. It doesn't take long for a bike to gain a bad reputation, even if it is largely unwarranted. Look what happened to the Suzuki TL1000S when the press labelled it 'dangerous'. Sales bombed and the bike was withdrawn. Likewise, Ducati sales suffered for years because of the perception of unreliabilty, although every Ducati owner I have ever met was very happy with is bike and provided it was serviced properly have covered big mileages no problem. Buell still suffers (certainly here in Europe) from the image of unreliability and recalls suffered by the old tube frame models, and has still not recovered to the point where customers have forgotten that era or fully trust the reliability like they would with a Honyakawazuki. For this reason alone they need to be 120% sure of being reliable straight from the launch, because another model beset with problems will be meat & gravy to the gutter motorcycle press and it won't take long for the jibes to start. (Message edited by trojan on April 24, 2008) | ||
| Blake |
"Repeated and similar component failures on production bikes is not uncommon, but it certainly seems to hit Buell far more than other manufacturers when you look at the relative sales volumes compared to problems." That is pure speculation unless you have some actual supporting data. Spending most of one's time on a Buell forum and in the Buell aftermarket business could lead to such an impression, but I don't think it will stand up to scrutiny. The good news is that Buell has always been quick to respond and "get a grip" on virtually any problem that comes to their attention. There have been a precious few exceptions to that, but not many. The XBR headlight issues is one. Maybe you prefer Honda's approach, the "dear customer, please take your new $20K motorcycle down to the local welder and let him burn some more metal onto it, else the frame may fracture in two"? | ||
| Buellgator |
I had a customer who had to be towed in, not a couple of weeks ago, the tow truck driver specialized in motorcycles specifically. When the driver was asked what motorcycle brand broke down the most, his reply was "All of them". Buell really does go above and beyond for its customers. I have personally witnessed them take bikes that were 4+ years out of warranty and help the owner come to a resolution. I don't know of another company that would do something like that. | ||
| Blake |
"Do not overfill oil tank. Doing so can result in oil carryover Your intepretation of the meaning of "severe" is quite different from mine and that of the dictionary. 1.Unsparing or harsh, as in treatment of others; strict. Okay. I see where you are coming from. I was thinking "severe" as in the bike is going to catch on fire, explode, blow up or something. Having oil misting into the intake and causing, over time, problematic deposits on the valves is a problem for sure. Are the consequences severe? No. They are problematic. But I know how you love the drama. | ||
| Fresnobuell |
equipment damage and or equipment malfunction." Sounds severe to me. | ||
| Court |
>>>>but it certainly seems to hit Buell far more than other manufacturers when you look at the relative sales volumes compared to problems." Yes, yes . . . that explains why the Buell XB has the one of the lowest warranty $$/per unit made. Internet chatter. . . barroom banter is not what I'd base a purchase on. | ||
| Bearly |
Good point Court, And why they are free to offer a 2 year unlimited mile warranty! | ||
| Brad1445 |
Yes, yes . . . that explains why the Buell XB has the one of the lowest warranty $$/per unit made. Internet chatter. . . barroom banter is not what I'd base a purchase on. I have had issues I thought should have been covered under warranty that they said was not, I wonder if their is a correlation? | ||
| Reepicheep |
Yeah, certainly no other manufacturer might have issues that people thought should have been covered under warranty, but weren't.  | ||
| Blake |
"Sounds severe to me." Yes, we get that. Drama rules and so everything is a crisis or impending disaster demanding unprecedented and sweeping action never before witnessed by humankind. (Message edited by blake on April 24, 2008) | ||
| Gtmg |
warranty dollar per unit is one measure so is occurrence per unit. I am fairly sure that buell will be higher than the jap brands on this one though it has been a while since I have seen the numbers. Buell on the other hand is better than almost all European brands including the famed BMW. | ||
| Diablo1 |
Okay. I see where you are coming from. I was thinking "severe" as in the bike is going to catch on fire, explode, blow up or something. Having oil misting into the intake and causing, over time, problematic deposits on the valves is a problem for sure. Are the consequences severe? No. They are problematic. But I know how you love the drama. You're correct. Overfilled oil level won't cause the bike to catch on fire. That would be due to the boiling fuel problem.} | ||
| Court |
>>>I am fairly sure that buell will be higher than the jap brands Without arguing the point, is that based on anything other than perception? Don't get me wrong. I'd not take you to task. I've owned (cough. . . cough. . at the same time) a Honda, Yamaha and Suzuki in the last couple years. Their reputation for quality is not without basis. Similarly most the claims made about Buells "lack" of reliability are largely conjecture based on recalls. . . . even those recalls that impacted less than 100 bikes. Buell is the single most reliable product of ALL MODELS manufactured under the HD umbrella. Many Buell processes, procedures and engineering protocols have been adopted by HD. Similarly some nice people have come here from far away lands and are amazed that human beings . . . assembling Buells by hand can produce such consistent quality. It's not accidental. Judging the reliability of a motorcycle is like making sweeping generalizations about the health of society by sitting in an emergency room on a Saturday night gathering statistics. About this time someone will chirp up about the "but when it's your bike" and to them I say "Hooray and I agree". If it were my motorcycle and it didn't work, I'd want it fixed and I'd not have much compunction about expecting the responsible party to step up. Buell has done a stellar job. Similarly they've dropped the ball on a couple . . . you can read about those occurrences here daily. Buell however is set apart by the fact that whenever (at least in the 20+ years I've been riding them) ALWAYS comes back and picks up their fumbles. Court | ||
| Brad1445 |
Buell however is set apart by the fact that whenever (at least in the 20+ years I've been riding them) ALWAYS comes back and picks up their fumbles. Court _____________________ Thats why I'm hanging in there waiting for my Rotax powered Buell. (Message edited by brad1445 on April 25, 2008) (Message edited by brad1445 on April 25, 2008) | ||
| Trojan |
>>>>but it certainly seems to hit Buell far more than other manufacturers when you look at the relative sales volumes compared to problems." Yes, yes . . . that explains why the Buell XB has the one of the lowest warranty $$/per unit made. Internet chatter. . . barroom banter is not what I'd base a purchase on. It really doesn't matter what the ACTUAL warranty figures etc are. The fact is that Buell is perceived as an unreliable bike here in the UK by almost every non-Buell owning rider I speak to (and a lot of Buell owners too!). This started when Buell had very public issues with the tube framers, carried on with long term press fleet XB's, and has already started with the 1125R withthese 'minor niggles'. There are probably thousands of owners who have never had a thing go wrong and are extremely happy with their bikes, but they are not the ones that contact teh press or vocalise their woes in public are they? We should all know how easy it is to get a bad reputation, and how hard it can be to then redeem that reputation and just how long that can take (Just look at the way that Bimota/Benelli/Ducati's name still suffer from unreliable early models, despite progress obver the last few years). The only way to combat this and change perception is to make sure that the new models are as close to pefect as humanly possible (and then some), yet the 1125 still seems to have it's fair share of problems. So far I only know two UK owners of the 1125, and BOTH have suffered from battery problems within the first week of owning the bike. The press and some European race teams report brake problems and other 'niggles', and now it appears tha Buell UK will not give the press long term loan bikes but only 'extended tests'. Whilst I am sure that Buell UK are hurt by the negaive comments in the press so far, surely holding bikes back from the press will not do anything to solve this or change mind sets? If you think that I am beiing over critical of Buell here, go onto a few other forums such as the KTM or Kawasaki owners, and ask what they think of Buell. While you are there, look around for long threads on drive chain failures or battery charging problems on brand new bikes, you won't find much I'm afraid (in fact you'll have to look very hard for any faults on the KTM boards). I want the 1125R and future Buell models to succeed as much (probably more) than most, given that my livelihood is so closely connected with Buell's fortunes or otherwise, so am probably more acutely aware of the damage that some small 'issues' may have on the firms reputation and sales, certainly here in the UK & Europe. Unfortunately Court, Internet chatter and bar room banter are just the things that can and do turn prospective customers away, regardless of facts & figures. | ||
| Fresnobuell |
Seems to me that all the track testing done on the 1125r did not translate well to real-world ownership--especially for a bike that was touted as a streetbike first and trackday weapon second. | ||
| Ccryder |
So you are presuming that an equal or greater amount of street testing was not done. By "track" testing do you mean "racetrack" or proving ground track (Buell previously shared proving ground tracks with a little known "F" company). Harlan: Your bottom line is what? In 2-3 sentences what do you expect from Buell? Don't hold back, just don't get long winded and let all of know what you really think. ;+} Time2Work. |
