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Aaron
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 18, 2002 - 01:51 pm: | 
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X1G: sure, no problem |
X1glider
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 18, 2002 - 02:31 pm: |
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Ok, the doc is on its way to your home e-mail. Thanks, Bob |
X1glider
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 19, 2002 - 11:52 am: |
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Aaron: Thanks for the input. The one I have is a bolt in but it's great for touring and climbing steep grades. Be proud, I'm going to try out the longer duration HQ-0033. I've got clearance for up to .640 lift and the springs are progressive rate, so they tell me. Here's to better breathing and more top end! |
Ara
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 19, 2002 - 02:00 pm: |
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Has anybody run a dyno comparison between the H-D carb venturi ring and the ASB venturi ring? I have the H-D part and am wondering if the ASB part is worth the expense.
Russ |
Jmartz
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 19, 2002 - 03:19 pm: |
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Ara:
Tat has told me it cuts down on the top end power. If you are an M2 owner cocerned mostly with the midrange it might help you. I ran the device for a while but was concerned with air flow since it sits close to the ham can's outter shell.
No seat of the pants feel one way or another. The device sought to increase the velocity of the intake air at lower rpm like when you squeeze a hose. |
Rattler
| | Posted on Thursday, June 20, 2002 - 05:20 am: |
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X1Glider: ****Aaron: Thanks for the input. The one I have is a bolt in but it's great for touring and climbing steep grades. Be proud, I'm going to try out the longer duration HQ-0033. I've got clearance for up to .640 lift and the ****
X1 be aware the HQ0033 cams will not have enough clearance between the valve guide oil seal & the valve spring retainer with stock valve guides. This is for 883 heads though more than anything & I don't have a clue if their is any difference with the valve guide in Buell T-Storm Heads as far as the same length or not. Anyway, the valve to piston clearance isn't the issue with these cams with their low TDC as much as the valve spring retainer to the valve guide seal is. I would want at least .100" clearance here myself. The fix is to use a shorter length aftermarket valve guide usually, or pound the oil seal down on the valve guide a little harder than what HD sets them at to get the clearance.
Dale A.
LSR#1012 |
Rattler
| | Posted on Thursday, June 20, 2002 - 05:22 am: |
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PS, just make sure you check this clearance before using HQ0033 cams is what I'm saying more than anything...I don't think it would be an issue with a Buell head though with bigger ports.
Dale A.
LSR#1012 |
Ara
| | Posted on Thursday, June 20, 2002 - 08:05 am: |
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Thanks Jmartz! I have an S3 and run the original breadbox air intake (with significant internal modifications, of course). I think I'll stick with the H-D venuri. Thanks for your help.
Russ |
X1glider
| | Posted on Thursday, June 20, 2002 - 11:02 am: |
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Rattler: it's for my TC95 with well worked over heads, by Headquarters no less. All above concerns were addressed at the time of machining. Thanks anyway. |
Aaron
| | Posted on Saturday, June 22, 2002 - 03:02 pm: |
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Okay ... told you I had a couple things I needed to optimize yet on my M2 ... today I tried a borrowed Force exhaust system ...
To recap:
1999 M2 owned by yours truly
Head work by Wes Brown at Cycle-Rama
Stock cylinders prepared by Axtell's cylinder reconditioning service - .010 over
Ross custom pistons as specified by Cycle-Rama - 11:1 compression
Red Shift 585's
S&S travel limiter kit in the stock lifters
Crane adjustable pushrods
S&S roller tip rockers
Mikuni HSR42
Crane Hi-4E in single fire mode
Stock header
Force exhaust system (replaced stock header w/Supertrapp IDS)
I'm still trying to decide if the extra noise is worth it.
I've got one more thing to do to this bike that I think should help some more ... waiting on the parts and time to put'em in.
But 115hp on stock displacement ain't bad  |
Court
| | Posted on Saturday, June 22, 2002 - 03:08 pm: |
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Yeeeeeeeeeegads ! |
Aaron
| | Posted on Saturday, June 22, 2002 - 03:11 pm: |
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Here it is with Torque ...
Wes is a genius. |
Peter
| | Posted on Saturday, June 22, 2002 - 03:41 pm: |
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Aaron,
I was planning on selling my M2 when I've got the turbo done on the S1, but I'm starting to think about talking to Wes and Pammy about prices and keeping it as well.....
Oooh, I wonder how much difference head work makes with a turbo?
PPiA |
Smadd
| | Posted on Saturday, June 22, 2002 - 04:22 pm: |
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Oh no! You have me beat, Aaron!  Wait. You're in Colorado! Wonder what it would do tuned at sea level!
Other than my bike having the stock pistons, our mods appear to be very similar. I wonder if a Force would improve my performance. I'm still running the old Borla slip-on. But alas, I'm in Ohio, and Cycle-Rama is 19 hours away. And besides, my bike now serves double duty as a backroads SUV. So, I'll just remain satisfied with what I've got. (Which ain't too shabby.) Oh, I've installed a PTO shaft. So now the Buell bales hay, and performs many other tasks on "the farm". 
Nice work, Aaron. And of course, Wes.
Steve
P.S. I just read the "Genius" comment at the bottom of the chart. There won't be a helmet that'll fit his head after he reads that. I knew he was good when I met him in 1981. I always told him, some day he'll do some mods for me. Every bike I ever owned, he'd smile (jokingly) and say "Pull it around back, Steve. Let's take that thing apart and see what it'll do." The blown head gasket (at Homecoming a couple of years ago) was the "excuse" I needed to let him have at it. |
Aaron
| | Posted on Saturday, June 22, 2002 - 05:59 pm: |
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Steve: yeah, but that's a corrected result, supposedly it'd pull the same result at sea level or thereabouts.
I bet yours would do that too with a different exhaust. Makes a big difference.
When I asked for this work, I said "give me the Steve Madden treatment". Word came back to the effect that Wes would like to try a few new ideas, would I mind? Took me about a millisecond to ponder that!
Anyhoo, it's not all the way there yet. A parts vendor made a mistake (NOT Cycle-Rama) ... without going into a whole lot of detail, I discovered it during my initial mock assemblies and measurements. Since there was a lead time to get it replaced, and it's something that would only cost a little power and not threaten the motor, I made the decision to put it together anyway. But I *should* be able to improve on this result once I get the replacement hardware and have a day or so to take it apart and put it back together again. Sh*t happens. Guess I'll just have to live with 115hp until then  |
Blake
| | Posted on Sunday, June 23, 2002 - 12:11 am: |
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Aaron,
That's awesome. Your parts that turned out to be a bit off... cams?
Imagine your power gains when you get it broken in and loosened up some. 
Sounds like a potential salt demon. |
Smadd
| | Posted on Sunday, June 23, 2002 - 10:55 am: |
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"The Steve Madden treatment"? You mean aging and bald?? 
Some day soon, I hope to get my bike back on the dyno since I've put almost 15,000 miles on the mods. It's not easy, though. The nearest dyno is 2 hours away! The local HD dealer is talking about getting one though. It'll be a great scene if it pulls anything like it did when it was built. My 45,000 mile, mud-caked, S3 putting on a dyno show again!
Sorry to hear you have to live with only 115 HP. Sometimes life just doesn't seem fair.
Steve |
Aaron
| | Posted on Sunday, June 23, 2002 - 11:56 am: |
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Hey Steve, your bike is legendary. Hell, it caused an international incident! I figured if I could just get into the same range, I'd be ecstatic. I think it's basically there, plus or minus dyno differences and the exhaust system difference. I ain't complaining!
Blake: this'll be a 150 club bike, although I won't close the door on having it pull backup duty in a class or two if folks have trouble and it looks like it could do it. |
Smadd
| | Posted on Sunday, June 23, 2002 - 09:55 pm: |
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"Hell, it caused an international incident!"
Ah yes, the Glory Days!  |
Josh
| | Posted on Monday, June 24, 2002 - 10:33 am: |
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>I'm still trying to decide if the extra noise is worth it.
Ha Ha Ha from the guy who's truck is so loud he has to shut it down before ordering drivethru and who once made me an exhaust system for my bike using a 4" *resonator tip* I'm not sure I believe that statement
Josh |
M2cyclone00
| | Posted on Monday, June 24, 2002 - 02:36 pm: |
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Aaron, that looks great! What a nice increase all along the power curve. I had you beat up to about 5300rpm, but now you've got me from 4300rpm to redline. I may have to go back to Wes for those big cams.
What air intake are you using? The Force? |
Aaron
| | Posted on Monday, June 24, 2002 - 04:56 pm: |
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Josh, don't get me wrong, personally I LOVE the raspy loud sound. Kinda like a loud snarl, reminds me of my old race car. But it attracts SO much attention that I find myself really reluctant to open it up. Damn thing is probably good for my driving record and gas mileage. But what fun is that?
Dave: thanks for the comments ... but those pulls (both of'em) are sans air cleaner. I do use the Force in the bike's non-dyno life. Costs 3-4 peak hp on the dyno. |
Sarodude
| | Posted on Monday, June 24, 2002 - 05:11 pm: |
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Aaron-
What happens when you run the Force sans air cleaner?
-Saro |
Aaron
| | Posted on Monday, June 24, 2002 - 05:43 pm: |
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Saro: haven't tried it, maybe next time. |
Leeaw
| | Posted on Friday, June 28, 2002 - 09:18 am: |
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Aaron,
First off, thanks for the B2W article, as now I understand squish. I wish I could allot the money you probably spent to hit 115hp. I am looking at the Nallin Stage2 heads, and keeping the stock cams for the great low-end. My wife just put up a $2,600 playset for the kids, so money is an issue.
I am hoping you might have some first-hand experience with my this setup. Question is what HP increase might I see with the heads, and how much can Hurricane pistons and add on top of that. $300 plus installation adds alot to the equation. Additionally, what timeframe is required to remove and reinstall the heads?
As of this point, I have a Sidewinder, V&H and jetted carb.
Much appreciated, and I apologize if this was discussed earlier. |
Aaron
| | Posted on Friday, June 28, 2002 - 10:04 am: |
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Lee, I've never tried that, but I betcha Brian has a customer who has. Brian is your best resource. Best of luck. |
Leeaw
| | Posted on Friday, June 28, 2002 - 11:18 am: |
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Aaron,
He gave me info with the Stage2 head and Hurricane pistons of about 89-92 RWHP with stock M2 cams which is pretty impressive. He did not get back to me about the stock pistons as of yet.
May I ask what 115 RWHP costs.
Thanks.
Lee |
Aaron
| | Posted on Friday, June 28, 2002 - 11:25 am: |
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I make it a point not to add up what this stuff costs me ... call Cycle-Rama and talk to Pammy, (727) 546-0889 |
Road_Thing
| | Posted on Friday, June 28, 2002 - 03:46 pm: |
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Aaron: You're right. I once tried to calculate what a pound of quail breasts costs--believe me, you don't want to know...
r-t |
Blake
| | Posted on Friday, June 28, 2002 - 07:27 pm: |
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If you go with the Red Shifts, a performance ignition module, and the Nallin 1250 package you will end up spending close to $3K. Add a carburetor, and performance exhaust... I like Aaron's accounting method.
I cannot upload pictures yet. Still have software to reinstall after my HDD crash.
But... I can say that the folks at Nallin Racing gave me exactly what I was after and more. I asked for low end and midrange and was willing to sacrifice top end to get it.
Here is a summary of the dyno, or "pump" as Brian likes to say, results.
STD Corrected Dyno Results
(Note that humidity was 80 to 90% which tends to hurt even the corrected pump results.)
3000-6500 rpm: Torque is at or above 80 FT-LB
35oo-5300 rpm: Torque is at or above 87 FT-LB
Peak torque is 89.1 FT-LB @ 4600 rpm (was 74.1 FT-LB SAE @ 4600)
Peak RWHP is 102.5 @ 6750 rpm (was 74.4 @ 6000).
102.5/74.4=1.38 (38% increase in RWHP)
'97 M2 Cyclone
Buell Race Intake with K&N Filter
Stock Kehein CV40 carb
45 Pilot Jet
190 Main Jet
Shimmed Needle
Ported/Matched Intake Manifold
NRHS Stage 2 T-Storm Heads
NRHS Hurricane Pistons (1250 cc kit)
Millenium Nicasil Cylinders (1250 cc kit)
S1W SS Header
Insulative Header Wrap
Borla CF muffler
Carl's CM580 cams
Dyna-2000 Ignition Module set on Curve 3
Static timing: 3 degrees retarded
Mobil-1 20W50
Royal Purple 75W90
The next iteration will include the race header/muffler and a CV44 carb.
I love the fact that at 3000 rpm she has already climbed to 80 FT-LB and still ends up breaching three figures for peak rwhp with the stock CV carburetor.
THANK YOU NALLIN RACING! |
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