| Author | Message | ||
     Ratbuell |
I'll post the chart tomorrow. BYO crack if that's what you're into...and we got the bike mid-day Friday, ran it first thing Saturday. What on god's green earth could we have possibly done to it to make it "not stock"? Or shall I run an XB12 immediately after, same conditions, just to show it's not a dyno that's being generous? I fail to see why it's so hard for folks to believe that this bike just plain WORKS. <sigh> | ||
| Ratbuell |
..and the offer to run back to back with a 1098 stands. I'll even pay the shop time out of my own pockets. | ||
| Dalton_gang |
"You're on crack if you believe 141 stock" I don`t know what Rocket is on but I sure don`t ever want to try it.(I`m not talking about bikes) | ||
| Elvis |
So Ducati claims 160 hp and it looks like rwhp is in the ballpark of 143. That's about 89% of the claimed power. Not bad. Probably about what most of us would expect for a claimed 160. Anony claims the 1125R will pull a better percentage of claimed power than the 1098. That means the 1125R needs to pull a little over 89% of 146 or a little over 130 hp on average if we assume the 143 value is about average for the 1098. Sounds reasonable to me. If nothing else, I think we have some evidence that the 146 Buell claims isn't outrageously over-inflated. Thanks Ratbuell! Seems like you're the first person to post any dyno info. It's a shame people can't just accept your information for what it is - one dyno pull on one bike under specific conditions that you've been very up-front about. Around here people will find ways to take simple information like that and twist it into some kind of statement about penis size. | ||
| Zac4mac |
Bingo Elvis Z | ||
| Metalstorm |
Once others have the opportunity to dyno theirs and share the results we'll be able to get an average number. Then the truth shall be known and undisputed. I can't wait. Ratbuell, thank you for the good work. Keep it up  | ||
| Ratbuell |
+1 on Elvis. If I was running my own personal 1125r (of which there will be none for the forseeable future since my wife and I are rehabbing a 150 year old log cabin to live in), I could see how people would interpret it as bragging about "my dork is longer than your dork". BUT. It's not my bike. Hell, I didn't even sell it, one of my co-workers did. I could care less what it pulled, but wanted to get our information out there since "what'll she do" has been a big question from the beginning and nobody has run one yet. I'm sure more will follow. Some higher, some lower. I'm guessing they'll all, as a group, be higher than expected because of this: the final configuration is a little better than when certain tests were run. We all know they were making changes to the EFI throughout the Inside Pass schedule. A byproduct of smoother operation and no stuttering has got to be more HP. Happier engines run more smoothly. Happier engines make more power. Perhaps for 2009 we'll see revised HP specs...even without any hardware changes. | ||
| Jimidan |
And while rear wheel dynos vary, there's another thing to consider: a new 1125R doesn't make peak power until it's had well over 1000 miles on it to get a really good ring seal . . . You mean after the engine has been broken in, right? Not after it has been ridden for 10 miles or heat cycled, right? I would think (from what I have read from real experts like Ron Dickey) that a dealer that pulled a new bike off of the sales floor and dynoed it would be voiding the warranty, and for good reason. If a dealer pulled that kind of crap they could be insuring that the rings would never seat and doom the engine to mediocrity. If I bought a new 1125R and found out that some clowns that say that they "know what they are doing", by letting the new engine warm up before they start making 4th gear pulls on it, I would be so pissed that I would be demanding a new bike. | ||
| Ceejay |
Jimi-tour a honda plant sometime... | ||
| Dalton_gang |
I see dyno sheets on lots of brand new crate motors that have`nt been "broken in". | ||
| Ratbuell |
Eight minutes isn't going to doom your rings to "never seat". We've been doing baselines for years, and have yet to see a bike come back (ANY bike) with baseline-induced engine failure. And we have yet to see (or even hear of) engine failure during the baseline. I'd think if it were a real problem as opposed to an owner preference, Anony would have chimed in with "don't do that" or our service manager would have gotten a phone call, not "141 is a cold air reading from one dyno". As mentioned above - tour a manufacturing plant sometime and watch them not dyno bikes before they're crated and shipped. | ||
| Josh_ |
Don't they dyno every bike when it comes off the line at the plant? Or it just every couple of bikes? | ||
| Ratbuell |
Dunno if it's every, or most, or some...but it's enough to make this point. They line 'em up at York, have five or six bays, roll on, no straps (crazy stuff, wagging all over the place - fun to watch 'em run the CVO baggers!), fuel I.V. into the tank, about a 3 minute run I think and then next in line. Looks like a freaky do-it-yourself car wash! And wow...they don't grenade. Hm. | ||
| Blake |
Wow! The fact that a Buell engine is outperforming Ducati really tortures some people. People are funny. | ||
| Buellnick |
Show us the numbers...when you get them. | ||
| Madduck |
The dyno is one of the best inventions for engine builders ever. You now have total control of running in an engine after assembly. Race engines in particular respond incredibly well when "run in" on a dyno by someone who knows what hes doing. Dyno tuning on the other hand needs to wait for "break in" miles to accumulate. Running a "fresh" engine under prescribed load conditions makes for a very happy motor. | ||
| Zac4mac |
Old Skool - break in nice and easy. That's what I learned several decades ago. Hone the cylinders - break 'em in, let the rings seat. New Skool - at least according to my little brother who is a trained GM wrench - Smoke the tires off, she's ready to roll. That was his advice when I got my Shovelhead with a fresh motor. I didn't follow his suggestion, but that's another story. I'm Old Skool and always will be. Z | ||
| Cobralightning |
Those dyno numbers are AWSOME! With the ability of this bike to be an everyday rider and not a track bike, that makes it more impressive. I can not wait to get home and start riding. My 1125R will going to a dyno shop to get run also after I drive around and use up a tank of gas. Looks like I will taking mine to get dyno'd at the Car Shop in Killeen, Texas. Is a MD-1100se a good dyno? And can it dyno a motorcycle? What kind of dyno should I look for? | ||
| Cobralightning |
I think I have answered my own question. I found AF1 racing in Austin, with a EC997a eddy-current low-inertia dynamometer. Is this what you used Ratbuell?? Just wondering, I will give you all the numbers after my bike gets here and I put about 300 miles on it. Which is one day since the dyno is 180 miles away. | ||
| Court |
>>>>Wow! The fact that a Buell engine is outperforming Ducati really tortures some people. Get used to it . . . you ain't seen anything yet.  | ||
| Rocketman |
Wow! The fact that a Buell engine is outperforming Ducati really tortures some people. If there were any truth in that statement, Buell would be fielding a bike in WSB next season  Official Buell press release EAST TROY, Wis. (July 8, 2007) The most-powerful street-legal engine ever offered by Buell, the Helicon engine is rated at 146 crankshaft horsepower, and is designed to deliver optimized usable power, with a broad powerband across its 10500 rpm range............ KTM RC8 (1149cc) 155 crank HP. Rocket | ||
| Cobralightning |
I love seeing the street 1125R being compared to race bikes like the 1098 and the RC8. Considering cost and avalability of the 1125R over the Duc and the KTM. Focus of the 1125R is the street ride and how comfortable it is. So to give all that streetablility (is that even a word?) and still stand next to other race bikes is awesome. I have never been on the new Duc but I can tell you the 998 was not a comfortable bike for more then 30 minutes and I am only 5'9" at 200. To top it all off the Buell cost less about $3000- $4000 less and has more dealerships for service and questions. Cobralightning | ||
| Jlnance |
Don't they dyno every bike when it comes off the line at the plant? Or it just every couple of bikes? I've heard they put the bike on the dyno and redline it in every gear. I didn't see it myself, so I may have the details wrong. But I've talked to lots of people how have toured the HD factory, and come away being much less concerned with break in procedures. | ||
| Dave_bogue |
A logical question- Why does every motorcycle manufacturer specify a 'break-in' procedure in the owner's manual? | ||
| Zac4mac |
CYA They also say "don't ride without a helmet" and "obey the speed limit" I know, non sequitur logic... but it's logic none the less. Z | ||
| Nevrenuf |
the guy that sold me my m2L said to break it in like your gonna ride it. just make sure to warm it up properly first. and that meant getting the cylinders warm to the touch. i had way over 23k showing on speedometer and don't know how many more because the speedometer wasn't working before the bike got totalled and the only problems i had were the rockerbox gaskets leaking and the sensor problems. i would think if there is gonna be a problem with the motor it would happen at the factory from the start and not anytime afterwards. just as long as it was warmed up properly. just my .001 cents worth. | ||
| Court |
>>>Considering cost and availability of the 1125R over the Duc and the KTM. Therein lies the magic. The 1125r is:
If you need an example try to test ride a KTM . . . you have 72 hours. Ready . . GO! There are over 15,000, presumably sport bike riding, freaks on badweb. How many of you have ordered and are waiting on 1098's? Did you get the plain 1098 (I've been to a number of dealers and have yet to see the base 1098) or did you choose the S? What, in your opinion, justified the additional thousands of dollars? Talk, particularly on the internet, is cheap. I tend to go with what people buy. . . not what they say. Every 1125r that has hit Liberty has a SOLD sign on it . . not so with the 1098 at their sister store. Don't get me wrong . . . I think the 1098 is a dandy . . . . but make no mistake it's an expensive motorcycle. Part of elegant design is in making the thing perform and be obtainable. Buell excelled. | ||
| Court |
Buell does NOT dyno bikes coming off the line. They pass through a "rolls test" with an IV fuel line and are tested to insure all systems perform. | ||
| Rocketman |
If you need an example try to test ride a KTM . . . you have 72 hours. Ready . . GO! No problem in the UK, except for the 1125. Us Brit's have only seen one 1125, on a stand at the NEC show two weeks ago. KTM have every model on test at all their dealers, and you can buy them. The 'base' 1098's are all S models. The homologation 1098R is not yet available. 1098S's have sold like hot cakes here. KTM are taking orders for their RC8. I presume Buell are taking orders for the 1125 too? No problem telling who's order books will be fuller. Over here people are talking with their wallets, except where the 1125 is concerned. It's the 1125 that's confined to Internet talk. I doubt that will change much even when one can buy one. You think a 1098 is an expensive motorcycle? You should see the price of Harleys over here. And frankly, 2 or 3 thousand pounds in the sportsbike market is pretty irrelevant over here as a saving. If you want a sports bike, you wouldn't buy an 1125 simply to save a couple of grand. Rocket | ||
| Chadhargis |
Go tour the factory sometime. As soon as the bike gets to the end of the assembly line, it's put on a two wheeled dyno (yep...two wheeled!) and run hard in every gear. The key to "running in" a motor (not "breaking") is to vary the RPM, and keep it under load (no free revving). That includes running to redline and letting the bike engine brake back down. I would say the very best way to run in a motor is on a dyno since you can control speeds and load a lot better than you can on the street. Most people also ignore the fact that you need to knock the new off of other parts too like the brakes and transmission. Remember, ride it hard, change the oil. Ride it hard, change the oil. Ride it hard, change the oil. Can't emphasize enough, change the oil. Gets all the metal flakes and crap out of your engine. Motoman proceedure forever! |
