| Author | Message | ||
     Tpoppa |
My manual states that the oil should be inspected every 2,500 miles and changed 5,000 miles. Those numbers are assuming dino oil is used. Many articles about synthetic oil says that, if you use synthetic oil the change interval can be extended due to improved wear protection. I have seen claims that synthetics oil can extend the change interval up to 2 or 3 times. I have been using Mobile 1 V-twin synthetic and changing around 3,500 miles. I suspect that I could extend the interval to 6,000+ miles with little or no impact on my motor. ...I don't commute on my bike, and rarely ride less than 60 miles. My usual rides are more like 300-500 miles. Any thoughts? | ||
| Barkandbite |
I commute 100-120 miles a day on my 03 XB9R. I use Mobil-1 V-Twin Synthetic and change my oil (myself) every 2500 miles. Given the weather in Cali., the stop/go and such, the refuse oil is usually very dark and viscous. Oil is cheap, my engine is not. I have also just changed to the 35 micron billet (reusable) oil filter that American Sport Bike sells. CHris | ||
| Ingemar |
Oil is cheap, my engine is not. Check! | ||
| Trojan |
Maybe I'm just paranoid, but I have always changed the engine oil on our Buells at 1500 miles and the filter at 3000. | ||
| Gentleman_jon |
Trojan, I think you might do better by changing your filters every 1500 miles, and the oil at three thousand. The reason is this. The contaminants are in the filter, not the oil. The oil is merely using up its additives, and when you change the filter, you will also add a little oil, ( if you remember to half fill the filter), which will replenish the additives. This is the system that commercial fleets, who have studied this matter extensively, rely on. | ||
| Trojan |
Hmm, never thought of it that way before  Thanks | ||
| Glitch |
I've been doing what Gentleman suggests for quite some time now. Didn't know all the facts as stated, but the logic was the same. | ||
| Reepicheep |
On the Cyclone, I just used any full synthetic 20w50 oil that I could find at a good price, and changed the oil and filter every 3500 miles or so. The engine was still running perfectly after 25k miles, great compression, no problems. On the new 9sx, I think I will just run Mobil 1 15-50 and change it and the filter every 3500 miles. The price is fair, its easy to find, and the oil should still be very close to 100% effective at that milage. Interestingly, my 9sx manual is much less "threatening" about both viscosity and brand. In my cyclone manual, using anything but Harley 20w50 oil was described as some terrible disaster waiting to happen. In the 9sx, if I am reading it right, it looks like they have full blessing for any diesel rated 20w50 in summer, and any diesel rated 10w40 in winter. I plan on just using 15-50 year around. Though I did see that Castrol full synthetic 10w50 floating around, if that ends up cost comparible to the Mobil 1, and gets some good independent reviews I can find somewhere, I would probably go that route. | ||
| Wyckedflesh |
Oil is cheap, my engine is not. Check! Double Check. Ok call me anal, but even though I run synthetic, I still change both oil and filter at the 2500 mark. An old habit from my older bikes I have had. | ||
| Xbolt12 |
Triple Check, If you run your bike very hard, oil is cheap insurance. I change oil and filter every 2500 miles. Just for reference, my YZ400F motocrosser service manual says change oil and filter after every race. I haven't quite done that, but do change it very frequently and now I have many hundreds of extremely hard riding hours with only one ring change and no other engine work. I frequently hit the rev limited with this bike (11,500 rpm on a single cylinder). I quit checking the lash as it always seems to stay the same (good metalurgy or good wear). Anyway, I am a believer and I'm even considering changing more often to limit high rpm wear (10k miles on an '04-all on mountain roads). Love the Yamaha and love the Buell Both are revolutionary. xbolt12 | ||
| Xbolt12 |
BTW- I am running SYN-3 in the '04 xb12r Buell and standard Yamalube (non synthetic) in the '99 YZ400F (Four Stroke Double Overhead Cam). xbolt12 | ||
| Aesquire |
Synthetics can indeed let you run them for extended intervals. Don't. The main advantages that synthetic oil give you are.... 1-viscosity lasts longer. Dino oil is about half used up in under 1000 miles, Synth is about half used up in about 2502 miles. That means your Dino is crud if you change it at 2500, but the synth is still pretty good. Viscosity speaking. 2- Synthetic foams less & vaporises less. So, it pukes less. 3- bragging rights. The reason you change at close intervals, is to remove the dirt & combustion products. The Volvo Club guys change filters & use the oil for way too long. They get away with it because the synthetic stuff does indeed work better. I think you need to get the crud out of your engine. IMHO Change the filter when you change the oil, it's a pain, but you don't want a 1/2 quart of dirt in your fresh oil. Heck, you only need 3 quarts, so it's cheap insurance. 1500-3000 miles, depending on habits. | ||
| Xb9srider |
I change my oil every 1500 miles or so on all my bikes. Oil is cheap. Plus, they get fresh oil before winter. Lately, that's been all I ride in a season on any one bike anyway. So, before I put them down for their long winter's nap, they get fresh oil & filter, a good cleaning and maintenance, good polishing, wheel stands and a bike cover for sleeping in the corner of the garage. The Ducati got that stuff Sunday. The Buell will be ready for the warmish fall days ahead. Mark  Never Give Up! (Message edited by XB9SRider on October 12, 2004) | ||
| Bomber |
'nother reason to change yer oil is that it creates a good opportunity to go walk-about and visit all the bits -- I understand XB series sccots have far fewer problems than tubers, but I've found a regular inspection of my MaDeuece has led me to discover potential disasters, and let me fix em before they strand me -- regualr inspections are a good idea, in any event, but waiting for the oil to drain is a great time to do, and I'm in the garage with wrenches in my hand (which makes a strong bike shake in fear, I"m sure) | ||
| Reepicheep |
Aesquire... Excellent info, have any references to lab tests for the half gone at 2500 miles figure? I thought it was longer then that. Your non synthetic figure is about what I remember though, at least when used in motorcycle engines. And you missed one. Full synthetic has a MUCH higher "catastrophic failure" temperature. I believe normal non synthetic is within about 50 or 100 degrees F of being destroyed in a Buell when things are perfect. If things get less then perfect, it could get ugly. I believe full synthetic adds like a 100 degree F margin. That was the main reason I ran full synthetic in my Cyclone. I am far less worried about temperature on the XB, it has a much better temperature margin (forced air and oil cooler), but still want the viscosity life benefits. This is from memory, but I would love to see solid references to real tests if anyone has 'em. | ||
| Bluebuellxb9r |
I know its overkill, but, I change mine before every trackday and after any longer trip ( espically during the summer mnths. ). Its total over kill , but, like stated above, its cheaper than a new motor. Plus it takes like 30 minutes and I can feel better about beating it @ the track. | ||
| Glitch |
The reason I've been changing mine the way I have is so I only have to do it three times a month, and the oil and filter once a month. During the summer months I load on the miles. The oil is still clean, real clean, dark honey color. Just to keep in the habit I change the gear oil every other week. | ||
| Buellgator |
I change oil and filter every 2500 miles. As has been stated the oil is a hell of a lot cheaper than a new motor. I run the H-D Syn3 and the oil is still pretty good looking after 2500, but I still change it anyway. | ||
| Gentleman_jon |
Good thinking Glitch. One simply can not get too much practice when it comes to the lubrafication & filtration situation. I certainly understand why you like that clean dark honey color. Reminds me of an old girlfriend, Gabriella. However, with my modified dipstick,( see knowledge vault), I can read oil levels even when the Mobil One 15W50 is totally clean!! My memory just ain't as great as I remember it, so I just change the oil every morning before going to work, and do the filter at lunch time, instead of going to Mc Donalds. A great way to keep the weight under control, know what I mean? I sure don't need my leathers to get any tighter, that's for darn sure. keep the shiny side up, good buddy:-) | ||
| 2bbuell |
I'm with you Gentle J!! I've now made it a habit to change both the engine and primary oil before every start up!! I'm glad I found those extra large hard saddle bags that will hold 8 quarts of Mobile 1 in one side, and the 5 gallon gear lube in the other.  | ||
| Ingemar |
Pfew. I was afraid to admit it, I thought I was the only one who changed my oil daily. Next to that, I change my spark plugs too before every ride. Better be safe than sorry you know.  | ||
| Jpl9sx |
Call me crazy but I am going to follow the recommended intervals in the manual; 1K, 5K, and every 5K thereafter. I did switch to Syn3 at the 1K service. I suppose I can be the "test" case on whether the Buell engineers know best about maintenance intervals. At least I am covered for two years. I will keep the group posted if my engine blows up. | ||
| Tpoppa |
Oil companies & lube stops are the ones who say you should change oil at 2,500--3,000 miles, not motor manufacturers. If oil will last 5,000 miles, but you can convince people to change it at 2,500--you just doubled your sales. Think about it...motor manufacturers all want a reputation for long lasting, trouble-free motors. If it made a difference why wouldn't they recommend changing oil every 1,000 miles or every 500? The truth is that engineers have already taken the guess work out of it through extensive wear testing. Buell engineers state that 5,000 mile intervals are sufficient (7,500 on my truck), and that is with Dino oil. At 2,500 my oil looks extremely clean at 3,500 it is still very clean, so 5,000 seems pretty accurate. It doesn't hurt to 'overmaintain' your motor, but why give more money to OPEC or an oil company. If you race, drive in bumper to bumper traffic, constant stop & go, etc...you are running at higher temperatures and placing higher demands on your motor & oil. In those cases, a shorter interval is recommended. | ||
| Ingemar |
Of course that makes sense Tpoppa. And you're right. I have once read a test on two identical cars on which one the oil was changed according to the regular interval, and the other WAS NOT CHANGED AT ALL, just added to it to keep it at level. After I-dont-know-how-many-miles-but-a-lot-i-asure-you, the engines were taken apart and there was hardly a difference, and the difference that was there could not be contributed to the oil. But the point is, I'm not testing my bike. I play safe. The dealer and my manual says many things I don't agree on (like break in). Changing it daily is of course a load of bull (unless you do 2500 miles a day), but common sense is always a good thing to use. The manual says inspect after 2500 miles, but if I have ridden it hard, had extreme weather changes (can create condense) or see the oil is foamy, starts to shift bad etc, I'm not gonna wait for another 2500 miles. I change the oil. It's the least you can do and it's not expensive. Just my 2 cents. | ||
| Gearhead |
Lot of good points. Remember that the oil never really breaks down, it's the additives that go south. Today's oils are far superior to what was available just 10 years ago so following the manufacturers recommendations have been proven. (They get paid the BIG BUCKS to figure this out) I too run Syn-3 in the XB and have had to reteach myself about oil change intervals. I agree you must consider your riding conditions, stop and go, dusty conditions and yes, track days to determine your intervals but under normal riding 3000 - 5000 miles is now the NEW normal. We're all showing our age!! But, oil and filters are cheap!! | ||
| Darthane |
It costs me $40 for a full fluid swap and filter. Every 2500 miles, that's nothing, and sure as hell beats the possibility, HOWEVER REMOTE, of engine damage. Nothing other than the primary cover's been off on my bike's engine after over 16K and I intend to keep it that way. | ||
| Joele |
Has anyone sent their oil off to be analyzed? Some labs do this for free and it will help bring some science to the question of how the oil is really holding up. | ||
| Brucelee |
Mobil 15-50 and filter, Mobil 75-90 in trans. Every 2500 miles. | ||
| Aesquire |
Change @ after first weekend? 100 miles, 500, 1000, then every 2000-3000 there after, AND before winter storage. ( if you ride less than 3000 a year, then change every fall before storage. ) The reasons for the early frequent changes are to get the metal flakes out of the engine, before they do damage. Also to give you early & often "zen" time with the bike to pick up loose bolts etc. & learn where to focus preventative attention. When the bike is new ( or with a fresh ring job ) you get more blow by, and want to clean out the combustion products (acid) before they rot your motor. YMMV IMHO, I could be wrong. | ||
| Joele |
I don't know if Buell does this - but some automakers use a specially restrictive filter when they manufacture a vehicle - this is designed to deal with the metal that is deposited in oil while the vehicle is breaking in - it is advised to leave this filter on during the break-in process to achieve a proper break-in. Any chance Buell does this as well? Is the factory oil filter exactly the same part number as what you use to replace it with? | ||
| Xb9er |
Tpoppa said: My manual states that the oil should be inspected every 2,500 miles and changed 5,000 miles. Those numbers are assuming dino oil is used. They assume dino oil is used AND used under "regular" motorcycle operation. The regular maintenance intervals are shortened under "adverse" conditions. In my mind, regular operation means following the speed limit, no engine braking, no higher than 3000 rpm, easy roll ons, coasting to stops, etc. A majority of Buell XB riders probably don't fall in that category (wild guess). So off the bat, if you use dino oil, you are looking at no more than 3,000 mile oil change intervals for street riding. Now if you use synthetic, the change interval is lengthened due to the superior lubricating and thermal properties. So, for the same type of riding, you are looking at 5,000 mile oil change intervals, but no longer than that. The preceding was based solely on UNscientific reasoning and is just one person's opinion. Inspect the oil every 2,500 miles or more and change it if it looks like it needs to be changed. I don't do oil changes at specific mileage points, but after numerous oil changes (5 or 6 times-the first was switching to synthetic) during the first 4,500 miles I am on a plan where I change the oil, filter and primary oil sometime between 3,000 and 5,000 miles without any worries. Joele -I highly doubt Buell uses a special break-in filter but I really don't know for sure. Mike. | ||
| Flick |
After reading all this, I think I'll just have an "oil-hauling helicopter" follow me with a delivery tube attached to the oil filler holes, and leave the drain plugs off! That way, the oil will always be FRESH! That way the engine will never wear out...sure it won't!!!!!!!! I'll glue sandpaper to the rear wheel so I maintain traction! Don't follow too close! I guess I'll have to avoid overpasses/tunnels as well???  | ||
| Signguyxb12 |
Helicopter guys will tell you that they never change the Syn in the transmissions (unless the lab sends back bad contaminants report) i heard that tractor trailers do the same. So when my v-6 maxima hit 100k i put mobile 1 in it i never changed it (added a little now and then) i sold it at 186k... no problems ????? | ||
| Rockbiter1 |
Had a buddy with an '89 Pymouth Horizon..never changed the oil for the year and a half he had it..course, it burnt a quart a week, so it got a "full change" every month... | ||
| Jpl9sx |
While reading the service manual I found this info that is a bit different than what is stated in the owners manual. "After a new engine has run its first 1000 miles and at 5000 miles intervals or annually thereafter, completely drain oil reservoir or used oil. If riding habits include severe dust conditions, operations at temperatures above 80 F, extensive idling, speeds in excess of 65 mph, and/or extensive two up riding or similar loads the oil should be change at 2500 mile intervals. Refill with fresh oil. Always change oil filter when changing engine oil." I don't know about you but ever since my 500 mile break in I can't recall any ride on my XB where I didn't exceed 65 mph. Also, while it is cool this time of year in my part of Florida I would estimate 75% of my riding is in temperatures above 80 degrees. I guess I will have to retract my "test case 5000 mile interval claim" and follow a 2500 mile interval. Although with synthetic I could probably push it to 5000. This bugs me in that the long maintenance intervals is one of the reasons I bought this bike. I hate having to plan maintenance stops on a long trip. I can also picture a warranty claim at the dealership. Did you exceed 65 mph on this bike ? How much riding do you do in hot weather ? I think they should update the owners manual to match the service manual. |
