| Author | Message | ||
     Clayman08 |
I have a 2008 uly and im wondering if I can put the stock exhaust back on without the servo motor hooked up. Will it run ok? thanks | ||
| Dmcutter |
At the risk of incurring the scorn of Ratbuell, I will share my experience. My 08 came with a Jardine muffler and an EBR ecm, presumably programmed for the Jardine. I found it to be obnoxiously loud so I found an XB muffler and had my local HD/former Buell shop install it. I asked that they wire open the exhaust valve, and whether they actually did or not, I cannot say. I have not gotten around to doing anything with the ecm so I am running a stock muffler with maybe the valve wired open and an ecm not likely programmed to operate it if it isn't wired open. I was getting a miss at constant throttle between 2k and 3k and did a TPS reset and the stumble is mostly gone. Constant throttle cruising at 3.5k is as smooth as buttah and I have noticed no issues with acceleration all the way up to close to redline. Honestly, I seldom run it over 4.5k because it is so strong down low and so blissfully quiet. So with my mixed bag, it is certainly serviceable and generally very good. I have no idea how it would run if you have a stock ecm. | ||
| Ratbuell |
No scorn...but if your bike runs well down low and is "blissfully quiet"...my guess is, they did not wire the valve open. To the OP - if you have the stock ECM, and have the stock muffler...why not hook up the valve? | ||
| Clayman08 |
Thanks for the input. Ratbuell I have both stock exhaust and ecm. So what your saying is wire the valve open and then run the stock exhaust and ecm? Thanks | ||
| Ratbuell |
No...what I'm saying is hook the valve up and run it properly. Use the servo. They designed it for a reason  | ||
| Hughlysses |
I think he's saying run the stock ECM, run the stock exhaust, and hook the valve up. These bikes run noticeably better with it working; that's why they have them. | ||
| Dmcutter |
Ratbuell is saying hook up the servo and run it all stock the way God and EB intended, I believe. I would do that if I had a stock ECM . | ||
| Clayman08 |
The bike doesn't have the cable anymore that is why im wondering if I can run it without the servo motor. | ||
| Desertjeff |
My servo died and I ran for a while with it closed but seemed to load up bit or something it missed down low and stumbled a bit. So I wired it open. The stumble cleared up and it was only a little louder but missing was the wonderful bottom end I really enjoy about this bike. I found a used servo on ebay and replaced it as soon as I could. Now I have all the low end back. Really love this bike. | ||
| Griffmeister |
D-jeff said it in a nutshell. The stock ECM and exhaust work together to give you low end torque with the valve closed and quick throttle response with it open. You can order an EBR ECM that is programmed to work with a specific aftermarket exhaust. They change the fuel map to make up for the lack of a valve as well as the change in flow characteristics. So yeah, with the stock setup you will be missing something in performance with the muffler valve fixed in the open or closed position. | ||
| Clayman08 |
Ok thanks for the input, that's what I was looking for. I will see if I can find a cable now. | ||
| Uly_man |
"At the risk of incurring the scorn of Ratbuell, I will share my experience". I wired my 06 bikes valve open, the short route through the can, and I had no problems as I recall. Saying that I did TURN OFF the AMC (Active Muffler Control) in the ECM. If you do not do this the ECM will still think that valve is in a certain position and adjust the timing/fueling to suit. At the end of the day if you are going to run the OEM can it would be better to run the bike as it was designed. | ||
| Mark_weiss |
When my servomotor died the bike ran fine under all conditions but had a very notable decrease in power anywhere above 1/2 throttle. I tried wiring the valve open while I awaited the new motor. This solved the power issue, but gutted throttle response and low end power. Notably louder, but not as bad as I'd expected. I went back to a closed valve for the remainder of the wait for the new servo. | ||
| Uly_man |
"At the risk of incurring the scorn of Ratbuell". This system was fitted to the bike to conform with EPA, and other parts of the world, sound emissions law. To do that, I think, and still make the bike run right they used the AMC system. It works great and there is nothing wrong with it. It is NOT however the "power valve" type system like a Yamaha which was designed to boost the power output. You should be able to run most any can, even none, but you need to make sure that the fueling is right and while many think that just "slapping on" an after market can that they say is good for the bike that is NOT the case at all. The whole thing is very complicated as is, for that matter, the AMC system itself. Buell must have spent a lot of money developing it. After market cans on this bike, from what I have found if set up right, are lighter, do not rust if SS and give a better sound. It will not "go" any better and I only did it for the sound as I like that, but not over loud, V-Twin "burble" and feel. The OEM system is fine if that is what you like. | ||
| Ratbuell |
It is NOT however the "power valve" type system like a Yamaha which was designed to boost the power output. Incorrect. The Buell "InterActive Exhaust" is a variable-length system. Valve closed, you have a long-path exhaust for torque. Valve open (and computer-controlled based on various criteria), you have a short-path exhaust for free breathing and HP. I had a Drummer on my bike for a while, when I was looking for "that sound". I ran it with a "race" ECM. Going back to stock was the best thing I ever did to eliminate flat spots, hiccups, and hesitation. The Drummer is a quality product and Kevin a good person...but the OEM exhaust just plain works. The ONLY non-stock can that I found to work well on the bike was (surprise, surprise) the Buell race muffler when paired with the race ECM and filter. Still has low-RPM flat spots compared to stock, but does breathe a bit better at WFO. | ||
| Nobuell |
The other day, I had the intake cover off and noticed the actuator did not cycle when testing. I checked the grounds at the plug in and they were ok. The actuator makes no noise when doing the test cycle procedure. I wired the exhaust valve open to feel how it runs. There was a noticeable decrease in low end torque. It does have a slightly better sound but it is not worth the loss of torque. I need to replace the actuator but have not had the chance yet. | ||
| Arry |
Check the fuse first. Mine quit working, but made a noise (bad plastic gears). | ||
| Nobuell |
Arry, I did check the fuse and it was ok. I was concerned that I did not hear any gear crunching. I need to check into it further. | ||
| Uly_man |
"power valve". Well we will leave that one because it is more about definitions from the makers than much else. This may be of interest though? "I had a Drummer on my bike for a while, when I was looking for "that sound". I ran it with a "race" ECM. Going back to stock was the best thing I ever did to eliminate flat spots, hiccups, and hesitation. The Drummer is a quality product and Kevin a good person...but the OEM exhaust just plain works. The ONLY non-stock can that I found to work well on the bike was (surprise, surprise) the Buell race muffler when paired with the race ECM and filter. Still has low-RPM flat spots compared to stock, but does breathe a bit better at WFO". On my 06 bike I had a Remus can, K&N air filter and I had opened out the air box. I had NO PROBLEMS at all with the engine running. I then fitted a Remus Powerizer which added fuel to the low and mid range as the 06 bike runs on the lean side. I never had any flat spots in the rev range, hiccups, hesitation or anything else and not even lower mpg either. The Remus can is lighter than OEM, top SS build quality, looks good and you can pick the "sound" you like from the three baffle options it has. I used number two setup and it was fine. The whole setup does cost a bit though but in my opinion is a true "Plug and Play" setup but your bike needs to be right in the first place. On the 10 bike I have a Stealth can, Piper air filter and once a gain I have opened out the air box. I do not have, once the wiring fault to the ECM was fixed, any flat spots in the rev range, hiccups, hesitation or anything else and not even lower mpg either. From cold the engine "idle up" drops to the normal 1050 ish rpm after a couple of miles and the slight engine vibs drop to near nothing once the bike is hot. A lot of that is due to the DDFI-3 this bike has and is much better than the older DDFI-2 in adjusting for engine/other conditions. At the moment I can filter/lane split at 30 mph in 4th gear and it will still pull away with no "lugging" on a hot engine. Amazing. You can use engine braking most of the time and you have to be VERY brave to thrash it trough the gears a 6k rpm. The dam thing is like a missile if you do. I did the breather mod on both bikes and could notice the effect right away. I also did the top plate on the air filter mod on the 06 bike which made no diff and just caused a nasty induction noise from the top of the engine. A waste of time and money. | ||
| Clayman08 |
Thanks for all the input. I put the stock can and ecm back on fired the bike up and the check engine light came on right away. Any idea what it may be? | ||
| Ratbuell |
If you don't have a working servo...there's your light. | ||
| Uly_man |
"I put the stock can and ecm back on fired the bike up and the check engine light came on right away. Any idea what it may be?" The CEL is what we call in my work a "common fault light" indicator. Just because you did what you did does not mean that there is not a fault at another point/place in the system. CEL? A waste of the worlds electric and worse still it makes people THINK it it is going to show you what the faults might be. The thing is total crap. | ||
| Kls |
Need quick help... I'm on a road trip (crossing the country) and the muffler control is acting up. Increasingly bad misfire at steady freeway speeds. Can I disable (open) the muffler control for the next few days until I get somewhere it can be fixed/replaced? This has already cost me a day and I don't know if a local independent Harley shop can do anything with this specific issue since Harleys don't have it. What I want to do is set the valve open so I can cover distance. | ||
| Griffmeister |
I don't see how a muffler valve, good or bad, could cause a misfire. However, you can disconnect the cable and secure it in the open position without harming anything to see what happens. If you suspect some wacky feedback from a failing actuator you can unplug it and you will get "the light" for the duration if you have a stock ECM. Again, this action should cause no further harm. At any rate, you will lose some low end torque but if it improves your running overall then you can keep it like this until you reach more friendly territory. Good luck. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Sounds like something else is going on... Hopefully bad gas and you can ride through it. Do you have the BRAN list printed out and tucked away? Where are you at on your trip? | ||
| Kls |
My apologies for the brevity but my iPhone battery is getting low. Don't mean to be rude. I have the code list and have troubleshot the problem. Im camping and haven't the luxury to discuss what else there may be. Right now I need to set the valve open. Anything else ill deal with as it arises. So...can I set valve open without causing further damage? Any tip on the best way to do so? | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
You really don't want to set the valve open. Closed is how it normally stays except when you hit the throttle wide open. Just to prove it to yourself that the thing only will open under hard throttle conditions here's something you can do very easily. Take off your air box cover so that you can see the interactive exhaust control. Make sure the thing is plugged in electrically so that it works. Go for a ride with the air box cover off so that you can see just when it operates. I've done this myself and remember it only opening when I'd twist wide open throttle. See if it opens when you ride normally and if it opens at the speed you cruise down the highway. Chances are it won't unless you really get on the throttle to get up to speed all the time. If you are confused that it really isn't opening the muffler valve because there is no cable hooked up then you should know that isn't the point of this exercise. The point is that you'll see when the ECM sends the signal to the interactive exhaust control motor up on the airbox top. If you hot rod the engine all the time then the thing is going open that muffler valve but if you ride sedately it just stays closed. Ho.oking up a cable to the muffler so that it works as designed is a good idea but just wiring it open at the muffler is not because it takes away much of the low end grunt when you do that. | ||
| Arcticktm |
Having said all that (I have done the same as Electra, with the same results and view), no, you should not hurt anything by having the valve either permanently closed or open. Go ahead and disconnect the plug at the solenoid as well, so you will at least know that is having no impact (other than the continual code it will throw). Do what you need to and see where your problem lies afterwards. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Just unplug the electrical connection to the servo under the airbox, and ignore the engine light that results. Then come back to us when that proves you found *a* problem, but not *the* problem. Where are you at now? There are Buellers everywhere happy to help, particularly for somebody having problems on the road. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Al Lighton, with American Sportbike, is in Vista California, and has fantastic knowledge and inventory. | ||
| Kls |
Thanks for the input, folks. The sevo is being shipped ahead for me and I'm pretty certain it will be the solution. Oddly enough my last cross-country trip in 2010 started with the same problem. Experience is the best teacher but what are the odds? I'm in NE California now, headed to friends in Sagle, ID. After that it's on to Ohio, NC and back to San Jose by early October. BTW, the temp fix was to disconnect the wire at the servo, pull on it and then tape it in place. Time to get rolling. Seacrest out. | ||
| Reepicheep |
If anything is screwed up by the time you hit Ohio (Cincinnati / Dayton area), look me up in the BRAN. I have well stocked tools / garage / neighbor with a pickup truck. | ||
| Kls |
Wow, thanks for all the advice and personal replies. I've been away from BadWeb for a while and had forgotten how much help there is in the collective. The bike had fewer stumbles after I disabled the servo but the problem didn't go away completely. After another 800 miles over the past two days I think the worst of the problem came from a worn wire: http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/142 838/482464.html?1248391176 I'm still going to update the servo with the upgraded model but those of you who want to say "I told you so" may now chime in. Meanwhile I have another 7000 miles to ride. |
