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Nillaice
| Posted on Friday, June 24, 2011 - 10:45 pm: |
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new to me 07 uly. 14K mi. bone stock save levers and muffler well, i took it out and got it stuck in some dirt/muck. gave it hell and pretty much roasted the clutch getting it un-stuck, up an incline and back up on to the road. i knew what i had done was bad i leaned the bike up against a tree and re-adjusted the clutch (damn near burning off my finger tips), and dialed it in by feel so the friction zone is just where i like it. rode it home slow and steady. but in the last few days, i've noticed that the motor will still 'slip' at WOT in 5th and 4th gear. 1-3 don't feel as 'jerky' as they used to be last week or as on my 03 XB9. from all this; i've come to the conclusion that the clutch is burnt/the friction plates are worn out. i know i'll need to replace the gasket and shift shaft seal, but dunno if there's any other parts i'll need to have on hand to get the job done. and i am unsure as to how exactly to 'tackle' the clutch. i have lent out my service manual and will have to reclaim it for this job. any body have any experience with this? tips? pointers? advice? how about part #'s? PART #'S WOULD BE AWESOME !!!!!!กกกกกก!!!!!! |
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Syonyk
| Posted on Saturday, June 25, 2011 - 02:45 pm: |
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Sounds like a clutch to me! Get your service manual back and start from there - it should go through everything you'll need to replace, and everything you probably should replace. I'm fairly certain it just involves removing the primary case & going at it, but I've not done one on an XB, so I'm not terribly sure what details exist beyond that. You might want to look at throwing in a good synthetic fluid when you put stuff back together. Also, in general, my understanding (which may be wrong) is that heat kills clutches - so if you're stuck, if there are places to rest & let the clutch cool for a bit, it's usually worth doing so. |
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Nillaice
| Posted on Saturday, June 25, 2011 - 06:19 pm: |
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will a clutch basket from an '03 drop-in? ... or is are the clutch stack thicknesses different or something? |
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Gunut75
| Posted on Sunday, June 26, 2011 - 09:39 pm: |
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I'm not sure about the 03 basket compatibility. You dont have to follow the manual to the T. Remove the primary cover. Remove the clutch adjustment piece from the middle of the clutch pack by removing the C-clip. Remove the Clutch nut and washer. The clutch pack will now come out of the middle of the primary sprocket. It can then be compressed in an arbor press for disassembly instead of needing the clutch compression tool. Simple as pie. I'll be watching if you run into any snags. Cheers! |
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Cycleaddict
| Posted on Sunday, June 26, 2011 - 10:46 pm: |
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try adjusting the clutch again ,now that the clutch parts have cooled down . |
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Natexlh1000
| Posted on Monday, June 27, 2011 - 07:48 am: |
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Wait. Why would you remove the whole assembly? A clutch spring compressor can be made from scrappy parts on hand. The retaining ring popped out with a dental pick. The basic design is the same as the tuber clutches, right? http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/476 23/193459.html |
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Nillaice
| Posted on Monday, June 27, 2011 - 03:46 pm: |
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i'll adjust the clutch one more time, but i'm fairly certain the dammage has been done from what i can find to read, the 03 clutch pack would have a different spring, but other than that; the friction/steel discs are the same. if the seller would just reply to me, i'll see about getting it from him. otherwise, i think i'm gonna get a barnett CF one ... i love your $300 tool! is that a tin can you used? (Message edited by nillaice on June 27, 2011) |
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Fast1075
| Posted on Monday, June 27, 2011 - 04:35 pm: |
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It does not take much to roast the clutch. The numerically low primary ratio really puts the heat in the clutch when you have to slip it very much. Rev the engine to 4k and slip the clutch to get moving and the clutch is slipping at 2,666 rpm. 1.5 to 1 primary reduction (for a 1200. Most imports run nearly double the primary reduction to reduce clutch problems. |
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Natexlh1000
| Posted on Monday, June 27, 2011 - 08:21 pm: |
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The $300 tool is made of: 1) A hunk of aluminum from the street. 2) A section of a cherry bomb I was trying to mod for my X1. 3) The adjustment nut from the clutch itself. Someone here gave me the idea after I was fuming over the real tool costing....wait for it..... $300 from H-D. Others here have shown that PVC pipe of the correct diameter can work too. |
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Nillaice
| Posted on Tuesday, June 28, 2011 - 09:47 am: |
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awesome. i got some 2.25 dia scrap piping under my shed. now i just gotta get a clutch set but i can't seem to get the 03 clutch pack from this seller for less than it would cost for a new Barnett set of equivelant ratings... and the wife doesnt like seeing all this money i'm spending. can't blame her, tho |
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Jont
| Posted on Tuesday, June 28, 2011 - 09:52 am: |
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pm sent |
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Nillaice
| Posted on Tuesday, June 28, 2011 - 11:26 am: |
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replied |
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Greg_e
| Posted on Tuesday, June 28, 2011 - 11:31 am: |
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Is this the tool: http://www.americansportbike.com/shoponline/ccp0-p rodshow/5493.html |
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Nillaice
| Posted on Wednesday, June 29, 2011 - 11:50 pm: |
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re-adjusted the clutch, and it still slips in 5th when cold and almost every gear when hot |
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Natexlh1000
| Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2011 - 07:27 am: |
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The reason I called it a $300 tool is I took down the part number in my manual for the tool and went in to the dealer and asked for it. Looked really fancy in the pictures with a big handle and what looked like bearings. I can't remember how much it was exactly, but I do remember that it cost more than a set of clutch plates. |
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Greg_e
| Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2011 - 10:19 am: |
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Yes the HD tool is stupidly expensive for what it does. I was just pointing out that for $56 it doesn't seem like it is worth trying to build something that may or may not work. Even some of these third party tools are a bit expensive, I just bought the gear holder so I can remove the nut to change the oil pump drive gear, for the small chunk of metal that it is and the few cuts made it certainly is expensive. |
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Nillaice
| Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2011 - 11:24 am: |
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anybody got some jelly or jam for my stack of toast?
energy one clutch and spring is on order. it should be here by the 11th. gotta love UPS. i slipped off the primary cover with out destroying the priamry gasket, so i'll be re-using that, and the shift-shaft seal. making tools is sometimes more fun than using them. |
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Fast1075
| Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2011 - 12:46 pm: |
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The energy one spring is stronger than the stock PRE-06 spring. It will take a mighty grip to pull the lever with the energy one spring. '03-'05 Buells used the same spring as the XL...in '06 they went to a lighter spring because it was found the heavy spring was not needed (as possibly contributing to the lip in the primary cracking)... I installed an '06+ spring in my '04 to get a much lighter lever pull...and I have no problems with clutch slippage. |
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Natexlh1000
| Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2011 - 02:53 pm: |
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Sweet tool It even organizes your circlip. |
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Greg_e
| Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2011 - 02:58 pm: |
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I didn't know they changed the spring and that the newer lighter style will work in the old clutches, I may have to consider that as my hand gets a little tired in city stop and go traffic. It's also only a 9 so should be plenty of grip on the plates. |
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Nillaice
| Posted on Monday, July 11, 2011 - 11:37 pm: |
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and this whole 'extra plate' seems like energy one/barnett just didn't wanna carry a special 'narrow' (first) friction plate. mine is discolored and visibly worn. no way i'm putting it back in there ... this energy one clutch stack seems kinda thick... anyone know the stock clutch stack height? |
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Greg_e
| Posted on Tuesday, July 12, 2011 - 01:25 am: |
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My 03 manual just says that minimum is 0.661 inch 16.789mm. It also lists each friction plate as 0.0866 + 0.0031 inch thick and the steel plate as 0.0629 + 0.0020 thick so I guess you could add them up to get the new part total thickness. |
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Nillaice
| Posted on Wednesday, July 13, 2011 - 04:00 pm: |
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i think the math works out. seems that thier metal plates are thinner, and thier friction plates are thicker than OEM late last night, i installed the energy one clutch set (sans judder spring and plate; per instructions) with thier 15% stronger spring plate i thought i noticed some slipping as i left for a shake-down run, but once i got going; i couldnt make it slip. rode it to work today. i can feel the stronger spring pull at the lever, but i kinda like it. reminds me of my 03, but snappier. i still gotta get the friction zone adjusted 'by feel' to how i like it. but for now; i purposely left some extra slack in the cable, and i'd think the plates will compress/bed-in just a touch |
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Arcticktm
| Posted on Monday, July 18, 2011 - 01:29 pm: |
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Nilla, Just saw your post. May be too late, but you should read my detailed experience from a few years ago when my '06 Uly clutch fried off-pavement. I bouth Energy One, and learned the hard way that they do NOT know how a modern Buell clutch is set up. I made it work well, eventually, and all is detailed in my post under Knowlege Vault\Clutch and look for Enery One in my title. I give measurements and details of my 3X tearing into the clutch. I eventually bought the stock "judder plate" setup (the narrow friction and belleville washer/spacer) and put it back in to get a smoother engagment. Also, the Energy One steel plates were NOT the same thickness as my stock plates. Again, full details in my knowledge vault post. Hope it is not too late to help. |
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Arcticktm
| Posted on Monday, July 18, 2011 - 01:31 pm: |
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Link to post described above to make it easy: http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/384 2/456488.html?1272473363 |
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Nillaice
| Posted on Tuesday, July 19, 2011 - 10:55 am: |
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Arctic, i read your post a few times. once before and several more after i ordered from energy one. searching yeilded no similar threads/accounts or flooded the page with common terms in the search criteria i did measure the stock plates thicker than the EnergyOne's. of course the burnt stockers were thinner than the new EnergyOne's. ... i've only put a few hundred miles on it and i'm just happy that it's not slipping; so i still havent adjusted the ramp/cable 'by feel' to my liking. and so far, i haven't experienced any 'grabbing' on slow take offs, but i do notice that it seems to have a snappier engagement than other clutches. if it gets 'grabby' on me; i'll follow suit and put the judder plate, spring and narrow friction plate back in |
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Nillaice
| Posted on Wednesday, July 20, 2011 - 12:22 pm: |
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today i came to the conclusion that not only is the engagement 'snappier' but the friction zone seems smaller, and has less 'feel'. ... and i'm getting better at clutching it up |
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Nillaice
| Posted on Tuesday, December 03, 2013 - 03:41 am: |
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aside from a muffled 'squeak' noise when starting hard off the line (presumably from energy one not using/providing a judder plate and spring in their 'extra-plate' clutch packs), the energy one clutch pack has been working very well for me. now with some 33 Kmi on the clock |