| Author | Message | ||
     Scott_in_nh |
My brother called me early Saturday morning and asked If I wanted to go out and make some passes at NED. I hadn't been all season so why not? Signed in, went through tech and the bikes were just pulling out of the lanes into the starting area. No time to adjust my rear suspension, pull the front end strap tight and head out. Couple of spins of the back tire to clean it, stage, launch, SPIN! There is a lot of traction there for bikes with our level of HP, so spinning this hard is rare. Still ran a 12.15 at about 111 mph. Go back to the pits, take all of the preload out of Penske, as well as set the compression damping to the lowest setting and the rebound on the highest. No more traction problems, but it was getting warmer to. Still only running 12.0's thought the air was a little better than that. Undid the strap and went for a ride down the road at about 3500 rpm in 3rd gear to get the ECM to adjust. Came back and went right to 11.95. Eventually got down to a 11.91 It really should have been a tenth quicker but the rider was holding the bike back by wheelying, hitting the rev limiter, wheelying until he hit the rev limiter, and missing 4th gear. ![: ]](http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/clipart/proud.gif)   In my defense, I was getting there and probably would have made it into the 11.80's but then I heard a noise....  I am going to try a left handed drill bit 1st - what size? I have access to the Jim's tool if needed. I want to see what better choices there might be for standard size studs. I know it is 5/16" dia. - does anybody know all of the dimensions + pitch? What are the stock ones made of?  Thanks, Scott | ||
| Ducxl |
Great job Scott.Proud of you and your endeavor. The exposed portion of the stud is 5/16-24 with the part in the head likely 5/16-18 with a minor diameter of .2443". a 3/16" LH STUBBY or #7 (.201") LH STUBBY drill could work best.Maybe soak it first with "PB Blaster" penetrating oil before applying the drill.I do it at work often with good results. Sometimes i use a prick punch and drive the broken stud in a ccw motion.That can work too. It get's a little pricey if you get too far off center and ruin the female thread.Good part is,aluminium is easy to fill weld and re-drill/tap.I repaired a set of cases once that way.But you'd be pulling the head then.It's really comming on the off season anyway,take it slow. | ||
| Littlebuggles |
I know PreyBird1 up-sized his header studs on his bike this last year. Can't remember the size though. I'll try to find it for you. | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
Thanks Greg, as always you should think about coming out and making some passes next year. My brother ran a 11.25 on his 916 powered street Monster (not the stretched one). Buggles I know the PreyBird1 saga well. I am not going to take the heads off for this (unless something goes wrong and I have no choice). I'm not convinced yet that better studs aren't available in the stock size. | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
Found! Grade 8 polished SS  Here are the parts you need to replace those old rusted exhaust studs and nuts on your Harley Davidson engine. This kit fits all Harleys with the 2 5/16 studs per pipe. These studs have a 5/16-18 thread on one end and a 5/16-24 thread on the other. They have a unique ball lead to prevent cross threading. The nuts have a 3/8 12 point hex head. ARP grade 8 stainless bolts, studs, and nuts are virtually impervious to rust and corrosion. Rated at 170,000 psi makes these stronger than regular grade 8 fasteners. These are maintenance free fasteners and come with a polished finish. | ||
| Fahren |
Nice. I just hope I never need them! | ||
| Lager |
Hey Scott, Think you did quite well ! Most riders cant even come close to what the bike magazines post up as their best times after a day of flogging the poor bike at the track. You ran some good times that compare with some of the best 1/4 mile racers the Bike Magazine's employ to test the bikes on the track. | ||
| Littlebuggles |
NEAT!! How much are those gonna cost? | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
I may be wrong, but Lafayette's experience aside, I think it is not a question of if, but when. They rust, they go through heating and cooling cycles and they shake, a lot - what makes you have any hope they won't fatigue and break? | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
Thanks Lager, I've done better when I ran more and had better air with a best of 11.66 at over 114 mph! Buggles they are $42.50 shipped | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
So, while I'm at it I want to replace the exhaust flanges because they are pitted and somewhat rusty. Obviously I can put new chrome ones on and watch them rust too so I went on a search for SS and came up with nothing. Searching further, it looks like XB's use aluminum ones and that they fit - anybody see anything wrong with going that route? Anybody have a couple of XB flanges laying around? | ||
| Preybird1 |
When my studs kept breaking. I got sick of it and had the heads modified to take 10mm studs instead if the stock 7mm junk Hd made for these bikes. Here is the link. http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/476 23/562349.html#POST1811005 | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
Hi Russ, I followed your tale of woe live and would consider that route, but I am not willing to take the heads off of a perfectly good running bike unless I have too. Since I have owned the bike 5 years without incident, I hope these better than grade 8 studs will solve the problem permanently - we'll see! I ordered one of these from Grainger I'll let you guys know how it works.  Screw Extractor Drill Bit, Left Hand, Drill Size 3/16 In., Overall Length 3 In., Steel, Used For Removing Broken Bolts, Easy Outs, Threaded Fasteners (Message edited by scott_in_nh on November 01, 2010) | ||
| Littlebuggles |
Thanks for the info, I hope we'll get to hear a report at some point that they are holding up fine. I imagine they'll do better since stainless is less brittle than the standard steel grade 8. Now you've got me considering them as a PM part just to keep form having this issue in the future. Broken header studs seem to be a common enough problem, and it would be nice to have parts on there that won't be rusting. It really should have been a tenth quicker but the rider was holding the bike back by wheelying, hitting the rev limiter, wheelying until he hit the rev limiter, and missing 4th gear. Sounds fun! Your S3 is looking sharp, I don't recall reading about any motor work, is it still stock with the race intake and pipe? | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
Stock with race ecm, ham can and slip on. Strapped front end, foot shifting. Yeah, since my bike is now 11 years old, and I've put over 100 passes on it, I thought I was immune to it. Now in hindsight I should have done this last time I had the exhaust off. For those who recall the cutting a stock rear pulley controversy, I can't say it will never break, I can say it is difficult to abuse it more than with burnouts and high traction launches!  | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
for the flanges - i didnt know they were different on XB and if they will work the same then thats cool, i'll keep that in mind for future. as for buying them - call dealership, they are probably pretty cheap to get. truthfully a lot of HD parts are cheap to buy, some are overly expensive (like well nuts etc for XB fairings) but most is very reasonable | ||
| Ducxl |
Thanks for the cool picture Scott.thanks a lot.Now i have a picture to lust over all winter until i get my own PENSKE!! YAY! | ||
| Hootowl |
Make sure you use anti seize on those. SS and aluminum don't get along. | ||
| Buellbozo |
Not to be argumentative, but in some cases, adding the copper of most anti-sieze compounds can worsen the dis-similar metals problem by adding a third element. Galling is the main threat with ss into aluminum, threadlock can be the preferable choice in many situations. I've had good service with the studs and nuts from Al @ American Sport Bike. | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
Thanks for the cool picture Scott Not going to say anything about that bad ass YELLOW bike? | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
adding the copper of most anti-sieze compounds can worsen the dis-similar metals I've been wondering about that myself. From work I know copper and aluminum don't play well together. I'll have to do some research. | ||
| Blue_pipe |
I had my header off just recently. I shoud've gone that route.  | ||
| Buellbozo |
The last "straight" job I had was with Lockeed-Martin at the Michoud plant where the shuttle tanks were built. Didn't touch any flight hardware, but was in the tooling dept building jigs and fixtures. There were books and standards for EVERY imaginable procedure, and the use of copper based anti-sieze compounds were forbidden anywhere except ferrous to ferrous applications. | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
I am a Application Specialist for liquid based temperature control systems and Lockheed Martin is a good sized customer of ours. We hate it when a customer uses aluminum in their systems as it causes substantial galvanic corrosion with the small amount of copper in our cooling systems. That said, from Wikipedia: Galvanic corrosion is an electrochemical process in which one metal corrodes preferentially to another when both metals are in electrical contact and immersed in an electrolyte. Well coated threads would have no electrolyte and therefore no galvanic corrosion? | ||
| Buellbozo |
Not positive, but I believe in this case, the copper functions as the electrolyte. Jes' my .02, ymmv. | ||
| Buellbozo |
Many of you are familiar with the threaded on exhaust clamps used on airhead BMWs. Normal practice is to slather on the anti-seize because the threads are alum to alum. No problem. No matter how closely matched and well cut a set of m/f threads are, in the case of steel into aluminum the most important purpose of the chosen goop is to prevent galling and tearing on installation. This can create flaws and stress points that show up later as snapped studs. Whether or not the stud comes out easily later on is secondary. If I were to purchase those gorgeous grade 8 studs and nuts, I wouldn't go near them with copper based anti-seize. I'd use high temp threadlock, and worry about gettin' 'em out later. But they won't break from galling on installation, or rot from adding copper to the mix. Just a grumpy olfart in the morning here... | ||
| Buellistic |
BUELLbozo: IMHO, correct assembly is the answer ... Copper compound torque'ing compound, proper assembly, and proper torque'ing sequence ... Have 110,400.9 miles as of the last ride and have never had an broke an OEM exhaust stud ... Will send you my EXHAUST SYSTEM Class 101, just PM me and you can review/proof read it ... | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
Lafayette, I torqued my exhaust studs per your method, I adjust my belt per your method, I adjust my primary chain per your method. Most of us do appreciate your advice. That said, I have broken both a drive belt and an exhaust stud. You have to allow that some of us ride harder than you and if we rode your bike the way we ride our bikes - something would break! If you don't believe me, bring your bike on over and I'll prove it to you! | ||
| Buellistic |
Used to ride hard and was FAST years ago, remember being faster than "i" probably actually was, "BUT" now my body can not move as fast as my mind used to make it move ... Really miss the thrill of racing ... | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
Really miss the thrill of racing ... Easy fix - go to your local drag strip. it is safe, fun, challenging and can be done by anybody who can ride. edit: I should add affordable to the list. (Message edited by scott_in_nh on November 02, 2010) | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
Update: I drilled a pilot hole by hand and was less than 1/16" off center, not too bad. Then tried to use a 3/16" x 3" LH Extractor Bit I purchased from Grainger. I was going easy and slow and it never really grabbed the hole it was drilling and the tip broke anyway. Luckily it is not like an easy out and the broken piece pulled right out. For $14 plus shipping I am very disappointed. Unless maybe I was using it wrong? Next I tried an easy out type of device that is tapered with a left hand thread that catches the stud as you turn it. This bit in very well, but it became obvious that this was not going to work and the bit was going to break if I tried any harder. So I borrowed the Jims tool from Duceater (thanks) and bought a fresh 1/4" bit. I Installed the Jims tool and drilled out the hole nice and straight, but now what? I can see the threads past the end of the stud and a little where it broke off internally, but in between there is just a smooth hole through what is left of the stud. I don't have a really good pick tool but I have picked at it and it doesn't want to budge or come apart.  | ||
| Jramsey |
Use a spiral point tap(gun tap) and carefully start it. Go 1/2 to 3/4 turn at a time and back out then repeat. Use a good tapping fluid. Also the original hole was most likely drilled .257 letter drill "F" that is why you are seeing a smooth hole and not the top crest of the threads. |
