| Author |
Message |
    
Jneiljr
| | Posted on Saturday, September 04, 2010 - 10:01 pm: | 
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I have a 06 Ulysses that I bought used a year and a half ago. I now have 9,300 miles on it. This morning when I tried to start it it did not start which is very unusual. I cranked it again and it back fired which is even more unusual but it did start. I then noticed that at times the engine would not idle correctly some times idling at 2,000 RPM's and when it did come to a correct idle it seemed to be fluctuating a few hundred RPM's. Other than that it runs fine. I went to the local Harley dealer to inquire about this and was told that I need to replace the plugs and have the TPS calibrated at the dealer. I said that I would replace the plugs and then bring it in to calibrate the TPS. The mechanic that I spoke with said to use the 6R12 plug but I read in the manual that to use the 10R12. Can anyone shed any light on this. I want to make sure that I install the correct plugs. |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Sunday, September 05, 2010 - 10:05 am: |
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The "change the plugs and reset the TPS" sounds like old school thinking. Not to say there is really anything wrong with that... if you know that stuff wouldn't hurt to do anyway (it's time) then why not do it first just to get it out of the way on the off chance it fixes things. I'd add "drain and replace the gas" to the list as well.
But switching types of plugs from the factory recommendation? I'd not do that, unless the factory changed the recommendation (as both Buell and Kawasaki did during the tuber era, so it's not unprecedented).
Here is an interesting chart...
I'm guessing Harley uses the Champion range... so that's going like two heat ranges on an NGK plug... which I think is changing your electrode temperature by like 140 to 200 degrees *** C ***.
Here is your target:
I can't imagine switching heat ranges that far would do anything but make the bike foul plugs, assuming down in range is a cooler plug like champion, and not hotter like NGK.
If going down is hotter (like NGK), I would expect you to melt a plug...
So it sounds like that dealer (or at least that tech) has old school harleys on the brain. Not awful, but perhaps not the best match for a more modern sporting twin. |
Jneiljr
| | Posted on Sunday, September 05, 2010 - 11:19 am: |
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I did fuel up on the 1st of Sept. and rode to work the next day. It ran fine. I didn't use it again till Sat. morning. Rode to work, it sat in the parking lot for five hours and that's when the problem started. I will drain the fuel and get fresh fuel from a different station. How would I find out if Buell has changed the spark plug range for my Ulysses? I didn't feel comfortable with what this tech suggested that's why I created the post. Can I purchase the Digital Technician and perform the TPS calibration myself. Also what other uses will the Digital Technician have. I am a mechanic but not a motorcycle mechanic. This is a new direction for me. I also think that I will order the 10R12 plugs that are recommended in the service manual. Thanks for the input, it is well taken and if you have any other thoughts please feel free to add them I appreciate the help |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Sunday, September 05, 2010 - 01:21 pm: |
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Somebody will chime in if there is a revised plug spec, but I am pretty sure 10R12 is still the right pick.
Car systems and bike systems should be pretty close. Like a car, just follow the factory service manual (which is outstanding for the Buell).
Lots of people have used ECMSpy and a $50 cable to do the TPS reset. I haven't yet, but I should. The bike should run well even with the factory setup, so I wouldn't go messing with maps or anything, just use it to pull codes and monitor values and do the TPS reset. That and change the plugs if they need it anyway... I went 20k miles on my 9sx with the original plugs. Still ran great, I just replaced them because I felt guilty...
Hopefully it will get better or worse. Hard to chase down "just a little wrong"... |
Jneiljr
| | Posted on Sunday, September 05, 2010 - 07:45 pm: |
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I drained the fuel and it looked fine. No water or debris. So I figured since I'm doing this I'd remove the swingarm To get to the fuel filter. Took a couple of hours mostly to set up my work shop to work on the Ulysses. I'm glad I did because I found that my belt is showing signs of dry rot. So I will order a filter and belt as well. I removed the front plug and it looks to be burning fine. It is a light brown dark tan color. I was expecting it to be black and sooty. I'll remove the rear when I get the rear of the bike put back together (don't want too many parts scattered around.)Could it be an oxygen sensor or the air temp sensor? I'll find out when I get the parts in and fire her back up. |
Rays
| | Posted on Monday, September 06, 2010 - 03:50 am: |
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I've run 10R12's in my '06 Uly for 60,000 miles as per the manual. My '09 XT has 10R12X listed for it - not sure what is different with those but it isn't the heat range.
I've never had an issue with the standard plugs and I don't think you could go wrong with the 10R12's. |
Bluzm2
| | Posted on Monday, September 06, 2010 - 10:33 am: |
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Bill, Thanks for the EXCELLENT info on plugs.
I'd not before seen the graphics you posted. Well done!
I've noticed some interesting tid-bits of late regarding HD plugs.
As most know here I've got a few Buell's to keep up and running. I go through a few plugs on our bikes and quite a few others I work on for friends.
That said, I've noticed something lately regarding HD plugs.
FAILURES!!!
I've had at least 3 sets leak. Leak you say? What does that mean?
I've see combustion gasses leak past the internal seal and leave brown streaks on the porcelain where it is crimped into the metal base.
In one instance on my S2, the internal seal completely broke down and left the porcelain rattling around in the base. You could actually slide the core up and down about 1/4". Needless to say, the bike didn't run too well...
I've always run Champion plugs in most motors in the past. Never and any problems with them, no need to change.
But.... I had a problem with 2 different sets in one of our cars. I changed the plugs in my PT Cruiser with a new set of Champions to correct a miss that wouldn't show up on a scan. No fault codes, nothing. One of the only thing that can cause this is plugs or wires. The ECM isn't smart enough on a 2001 to do diags all the way out to the plug.
I changed wires and plugs with top of the line replacements, I don't remember the wire brand but the plugs were Champions.
These wires and plugs are a pain to change out as you have to split the intake manifold for access. I didn't feel like going cheap and having to do it again.
Less than 10,000 miles later the miss came back. Another plug swap was needed to remedy the problem. Like a dope, I used the same brand of plugs..
The set that came out had the same telltale streaks as a couple of the HD plugs I'd seen.
The hosed plug count was now up over 8.
Once again about 8 thousand miles later I started to get a miss. I thought this one was due to spilled power steering fluid leaking into the plug chamber. I'd had considerable issues with the pump spitting all over the place. Once that was taken care of, I needed to change clean out the plug chambers of to of the cylinders. Or so I thought.
I pulled all 4 plugs again and all 4 had leaks... Heavy brown streaks on all 4, this time worse than the last.
The bad plug count by this time was well over 12.
A little research found that HD's plugs were OEM'd by Champion.
I switched to NGK's on the PT and have had no problems since.
Same for the Buell's.
I might have a couple of the plugs laying around. I'll see if I can't post a couple pics.
Brad |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Monday, September 06, 2010 - 12:05 pm: |
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Kudos to NGK, they had the info. And thanks to the two stroke guys over at dirtrider.net... if you have a plug question, ask an old fart riding a two stroke.  |
Jneiljr
| | Posted on Sunday, September 26, 2010 - 10:16 pm: |
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Finally received my parts and replaced the fuel filter and screen. Installed the new NGK spark plugs and K & N air filter. Also checked the adjustment on the interactive exhaust since I had to remove it to replace the plugs. It was a little out of adjustment. Fired her up and everything is running fine. Took it out for a sixty mile ride and everything seems good. I am a little hesitant about bringing it in to check the TPS because the plugs that I removed look like the burn is just right. It is a light brown tan color. The front cylinder is just a tad darker. What do ya'll think? Should I trust the harley shop to make this adjustment correctly? The shop near me is not a Buell dealer anymore. There is one about two hours away. Should I bring it there? What do you think? |
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