| Author | Message | ||
     Trojan |
Another refugee from the diminishing ranks of AMA competitors, Brit Chaz Davies has now officially been announced as riding for BE1 Triumph on WSS in 2010 and will again partner Aussie Gary McCoy. Davies rode for the Trimph team in the last 3 WSS rounds of 2009 and impressed everyone in the team, so it was a pretty open secret that he was going to sign for them this year for a full time ride. Good to see Chaz back on the world stage again and I hope that this can help propel him to bigger and better things   | ||
| Fresnobuell |
Seen as how Chaz could barely finish a race here, maybe it's better. I gotta say you really seem to relish in putting down the AMA, Tojan. That make you feel better about yourself or what? | ||
| Trojan |
Seen as how Chaz could barely finish a race here, maybe it's better. I gotta say you really seem to relish in putting down the AMA, Tojan. That make you feel better about yourself or what? Think what you like, but the exodus of talent and teams for the AMA Superbike series isn't because I don't like it or becaue I put it down (I certainly don't think any of the major teams and riders that have jumped ship read my comments do you?), it's because the series has turned into a second rate poorly paid shambolic relic of what it once was. Fact. if you don't want people putting it down then improve it. As for Chaz hardly finishing a race last year...he was riding an ageing RSV Aprilia that hadn't been developed for racing since 2002. When he did finish he was well placed and has shown in the past that he is a talented rider, so I hope he does well in WSS. | ||
| Buell2001b |
I hope he does well with the Triumph. He did pretty good on the Aprillia unfortunatelly he had lots of mechanical problems with the Aprillia which forced him to DNF in races where he had a chance to get top 5 finishes | ||
| 4cammer |
Good kid, and I do wish him well. Aprilia is a heck of a cool bike and I really hoped to see them do better. KWS is selling their bikes, what a steal. http://www.kwsmotorsports.com/custompage2.htm And Trojan, I do have to echo what Fresno stated, your post did (and does) seem to take a swing at the AMA (again). | ||
| Trojan |
your post did (and does) seem to take a swing at the AMA (again). Your right, having read it again it does read a bit like that, but it wasn't meant to be a swipe at the AMA per se but just a reflection of what is happening in the rider market, particularly in regard to top level riders that were racing in AMA last year. I think I am pretty right in thinking that the professional rider pool has certainly diminished since last year, and with only around 15 Superbikes (half of which will be privateers) expected to make Daytona I can't see it improving any time soon for those currently without a ride. That isn't taking a swipe, but unfortunate fact  | ||
| Eboos |
Here is a few points that I think that critics should consider: Distance between events - The US is a large country. Much larger then any European country that has their own national series. This creates a large expense for travel, lodging and transportation of equipment to each event. Number of riders actually drawing a salary - A large number of AMA pro racers have enjoyed for years, even in 2009, a paid salary. How many riders in other national series can claim that? Number of foreigners who compete in AMA as opposed to number of Americans who compete in a foreign national series - It would seem that the US is the place to race if you are not on the world stage. This is likely due to the increased world coverage, and the greater chance at drawing a salary. You can not compare the AMA to World Superbike. That is an unfair comparison, and as far as talented riders moving to World Superbike, that's awesome. That is what they should have been doing for years. | ||
| Trojan |
You can not compare the AMA to World Superbike. I don't try to compare AMA with World Superbike, but it should bear comparison with other domestic championships such as BSB (British Superbike), especially given the relative resources given to each country's major championship. Sponsorship is (and always has been) very hard to come by in the UK and few riders get paid (or ever did get paid) a salary even in the top class competition. Most riders in UK competition make ends meet and some make a little money from personal sponsorship deals if they can get them. Outside of the factory supported teams riders often pay the team in order to ride! Compared to AMA Superbike the BSB series was always relatively poor in monetary terms but well supported by manufacturers and importers. The geographic size of the US may be a disadvantage for travelling, but is also an advantage for AMA as they have a much larger demographic group of prospective competitors/sponsors/punters to draw from than we do, yet the BSB series goes from strength to strength (even in current recession hit GB) whilst the AMA withers on the vine. To me this seems to have less to do with competitors or resources than with the ability of the management to run a championship that riders, teams and manufacturers are happy to be a part of. The UK BSB championship has faced exactly the same dilemmas and problems that have hit the AMA in recent years. The diference has been in the way they have been dealt with and the attitude of the organisers, and the current AMA/DMG directors could learn a lot from Stuart Higgs, Jonathan Palmer and the other people behind BSB that have made it so successful in recent years. I have little doubt that given a new direction and less antagonistic organising body that the AMA championship could once again be amongst the top domestic Superbike championships in the world. However at the moment I doubt that DMG even want that, but would rather pursue their current path towards 600cc domination of US road racing and the eventual demise of Superbikes altogether (which is what they wanted all along). | ||
| Eboos |
In addition to BSB, how many different clubs are there to race and earn money in? The US has quite a few, and a lot of our talent is content to earn a pretty good living as a bounty hunter for contingency money. | ||
| Buell2001b |
I think the manufacturers should pay a 5% of sale of every bike to the AMA and pay the riders and teams that way. | ||
| Fresnobuell |
I think the manufacturers should pay a 5% of sale of every bike to the AMA and pay the riders and teams that way. That's a great way to get current retail prices bumped by 5%. | ||
| Eboos |
Another thing to consider when talking about manufacturers pulling out of a certain series is: what other actions is that manufacturer taking. Honda made it very public that it has withdrawn it's support for it's AMA teams. What Honda has down played is it's near non-existant support for any roadracing in America. Honda's 2010 contingency is restricted to the USGPRU series running the Moriwaki 250. | ||
| Trojan |
In addition to BSB, how many different clubs are there to race and earn money in? None! The UK race scene is very diverse and very busy, but if you want to earn money from racing in the UK then it is a very shallow pool and BSB (and some supporting races) are the only paying race series around. Some big club race teams may just make ends meet from generous sponsors, but there is no prize money or start money to be had outside of BSB. There is an old saying in aviation which pretty much sums up racing in the UK: 'If you want to make a small fortune then you need to start with a large one' A lot of up and coming young riders are now taking different routes to try and reach the top without having to go through the established 'production based' classes that the UK seems to be so fond of. The most popular option is to race in the Spanish CEV Buckler series where it is possible to earn a living in 125GP racing and get noticed by the established GP team managers (Which is why you see so many Spanish riders coming up through the GP system). ANother is to go to the European Supersport/superstock series, although that seems a bit of a dead end and results don't necessarily mean being noticed by the teams that matter further up the food chain. In the US you have a great system with CCS regional racing, and I'm sure that they could organise a national superbike series to to better the current DMG setup if they wanted to (and would probably get more support from factories too). Don't get me wrong, I am not anti AMA as such, and have been a fan of AMA racing for 30 years + in fact ever since Dick Mann, Cal Rayborn & Gary Nixon were amongst the 'main men' of AMA racing. Any domestic series that can bring up riders like Them, and more recently Nicky Hayden and Ben Spies must be good. It is just the current steering body that is the fly in the ointment and I'm sure it would improve beyond measure if someone else took over the reins. (Message edited by trojan on January 14, 2010) | ||
| 4cammer |
"In the US you have a great system with CCS regional racing, and I'm sure that they could organise a national superbike series to to better the current DMG setup if they wanted to (and would probably get more support from factories too). Don't get me wrong, I am not anti AMA as such, and have been a fan of AMA racing for 30 years + in fact ever since Dick Mann, Cal Rayborn & Gary Nixon were amongst the 'main men' of AMA racing. Any domestic series that can bring up riders like Them, and more recently Nicky Hayden and Ben Spies must be good. It is just the current steering body that is the fly in the ointment and I'm sure it would improve beyond measure if someone else took over the reins." +1, well said. As a side note, Trojan what do the natives over there think about Guy Martin? I have been following his antics (and I mean that in a good way) for a few years now and have really come to appreciate what this guy does on the courses and real road tracks. | ||
| Trojan |
As a side note, Trojan what do the natives over there think about Guy Martin? Guy Martin is what you could call a 'character' and very outspoken Yorkshireman who doesn't suffer fools, so is sometimes his own worst enemy when it comes to public relations and getting decent rides for top teams. He once famously got banned from BSB for slamming a lap top shut on the fingers of one of the organisers during an argument! He is very good on roads circuits and rides well in classic races too, but is best suited to running his own team with people he trusts backing him up rather than in a large 'corporate' team. He is also a very skilled engine builder and mechanic so sometimes doesn't see eye to eye with 'factory mechanics'. 2010 will see him running effectively his own team on the roads financed by an Irish businessman and so not dependant on outside sponsorship, so I think this could well be his year at places like the TT and NW200. I hope so as it is about time he had some good luck and the sport needs characters like him around | ||
| Eboos |
Back to the topic of Chaz Davies, I can't wait to see the Triumph Daytona 675 as a consistent podium contender. A little education needed here, what chassis modifications are allowed in World Super Sport? | ||
| Trojan |
A little education needed here, what chassis modifications are allowed in World Super Sport? Basic frame must remain stock, and stock forks must be used (although with aftermarket inserts) they can use aftermarket rear shocks. Wheels can be replaced with lightweight race items too I believe (although I'm not 100% sure this is still the case for 2010). | ||
| Eboos |
What about aftermarket triple clamps? (yokes to you Brits  ) | ||
| Trojan |
What about aftermarket triple clamps? (yokes to you Brits ) I think they have to use stock triple clamps on supersports and superstock bikes, but it isn't an area that I have taken any notice of in the past. Looking at pictures I took of BSB Supersports bikes they have stock triple clamps, but the WSS may have slightly different rules. | ||
| Patrickmitchell |
As an owner of a 675 track bike, I'm excited to see the bike progress. Gary McCoy was a serious threat at seasons end. I'm hoping that 2010 will see the bike on the podium with more regularity. | ||
| Trojan |
It's a pity that Triumph don't run a serious factory backed race effort. I'm sure there is some factory support for the BE1 Parkingo team (Triumph are listed as a major sponsor) but they are essentially an Italian privateer team up against the Japanese factory Supersports teams. They get a lot of assistance from Bitubo and other aftermarket manufacturers but are definitely punching above their weight, helped by talented riders of course For those interested in the team they have a great photo album here http://www.flickr.com/photos/be1racing/ | ||
| 46champ |
Matt at least Triumph is consistent. Triumph was the second most storied Mfg in last 60 years of dirt track racing in the US. Any money for a new dirt track program, no, nada, zilch. | ||
| Trojan |
Latest news: According to Italian magazine Motosprint, gary McCoy will no longer be riding for BE1 Parkingo Triumph in 2010 because his wage demands have become too much for the team to endure. He is rumoured to be replaced by 2 new riders and these are expected to be announced as Patrick Charpentier ( a long time WSS campaigner) and Jason DiSalvo. It is great news if true and about time DiSalvo got a shot at world level. I think he should do really well on the Triumph. | ||
| Smoke |
http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2010/Jan/100118-dis alvo.htm looking forward to this! good luck Chaz and Jason!! tim |
