| Author | Message | ||
     Electraglider_1997 |
Can the temp the fan comes on be messed with in ECMspy? I'd like to lower the temp so the fan comes on much sooner. I think my temp sensor is getting old because my fan keeps coming on way later than in the past and I know this because my swing arm oil temp is way hotter these days than in the past. The price of a new sensor is only $40 bucks or so but I'm not even sure the sensor is the problem other than my oil keeps getting hotter as time passes. | ||
| Teeps |
Electraglider_1997 Posted on Sunday, September 06, 2009 - 02:57 pm: Can the temp the fan comes on be messed with in ECMspy? Yes you should be able to adjust it by changing hex values in the Eprom tab, of ECM Spy. I've thought of doing the same thing. But I don't know which cells contain the fan data. Nor do I have any idea how to read or make sense of the hex values. | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
More information please. | ||
| Froggy |
Yes it can be done, I have been meaning to play with mine. I will look into it.  I don't know why, but I thought it was an option that didn't need any hex editing, similar to like how you can disable the o2 sensor. Anyway, I will post back, or just nag me in a few days if I forget. | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
I've never done anything other than TPS reset and checking my timing with ECMspy. I really would like to learn more about it and this fan business just might be the impetus. I'll be nagging. | ||
| Rotorhead |
it's ma hex thing but you need to figure out the cell and the value. I havn't a clue what it is but i'm sure Mike knows here http://www.xoptiinside.com/ give him a temp you want and hell be able to give you a number and cell | ||
| Gamdh |
The ECM spy web site still has reference info: This is about the eeprom layout in genral. http://www.ecmspy.com/eeprom_info.shtml You can then look at the specific version (this is the GB231 rack ecm) to identify the specific Hex off set and value. http://www.ecmspy.com/cgi-bin/ecm.cgi?ecm=7 If you search for 'fan' on the second page you will see the handful of fan related settings. IN theory after that.. you could run ECMSpy find the appropriate hex offset and change the value then burn the ECM changes... IN THEORY... Also note that at the bottom of the second link.. is the formula to calculate the new values using the scale and translate values. output = (EEPROM_value * scale) + translate (Message edited by gamdh on September 07, 2009) (Message edited by gamdh on September 07, 2009) | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
Looks like you have to really be a geek to understand that stuff. | ||
| Motorfish |
That is highly illogical Captain.  | ||
| Etennuly |
I am thinking you are on to something Electra-man!  I am not sure how to test it for this yet, but I think you are about to join the 'Flashy Light/Run/Skip' group. I too have been noticing more heat and having the FL/R/S when it is put under a medium speed load on a warm day. I don't know as you would need to change the parameters as much as I think the ETS is breaking down itself and allowing the fan to come on too late when it has been cycled on and off many times on a ride. I have been doing extensive testing to find this FL/R/S problem. My replaced ECM makes the bike run great, but the problem has returned again. Next up replace the ETS. I have to look it up again, but I believe it is in the $80.00 range. it requires a special socket for the wire. I am just going to use an old socket where I will blast a hole in the upper side with my plasma cutter. | ||
| Froggy |
32564-99YC SENSOR, ENGINE TEMP. Retail Price:$80.20 | ||
| Etennuly |
Thanks for that Froggy!  | ||
| Froggy |
My parts inventory says I have one sitting in a bin, which is odd because I don't recall it. I need to dig it up now. | ||
| Hughlysses |
It might be worth removing the sensor and inspecting it. Oxidation could build up "insulating" it from the heat of the head; maybe it just needs cleaning. Re-torquing might help as well. | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
I like Hughlysses thought about the oxidation. Mine keeps getting worse and worse, meaning my fan-on temp keeps increasing as time passes. Even the oil temp in the swing arm measures higher for the fan to come on at shutdown. Used to come on if the temp dipstick read 145 or 150 F and now it need to be about 180. The parts guy I talked to said the temp sensor was only in the $40+ range. He must have been looking at the wrong part. Getting at that sensor looks pretty straight forward. Remove airbox baseplate and undue and move the cross brace rubber mount to get at the ETS. Question is, what is special about this special socket needed to remove the ETS. Must have a slot in it for the wire(s) on the ETS. | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
What is the 'Flashy Light/Run/Skip' group. | ||
| Etennuly |
Read "engine trouble light occillation" thread. You are correct about the socket. It has a slot for the wire. My brother, an electromechanical engineer type, says these switches can easily be compromised by overheating and general use. He couldn't answer as to why it didn't show it' own failure code though. | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
What size of socket does it take. I've got a few of those motorcycle spark plug sockets that have accumulated over the years. If one of those fits it then maybe I can just slot one with a hacksaw. I plan on riding the ULY down to the Kansas City Harley Manufacturing Plant Open House this Friday and Saturday. My plan is to remove, inspect,clean and reinstall the ETS before that. I'll probably end up having to order a new one. AND my battery is finally giving up the ghost so there goes another approximately 70 bucks + the most likely 80 more for the ETS. I'll bet the Buell engineers have no parameters that the ETS is checked against to throw a CODE. It is probably like those lifetime drive belts .... | ||
| Florida_lime |
The parts guy I talked to said the temp sensor was only in the $40+ range. That's about what I paid a couple months back. Ordered it at the same time as my RSS and updated exhaust valve actuator. ???????? | ||
| Hughlysses |
EG- if the sensor gradually drifts out of calibration, there'd be no way for the ECM to know to throw a code. I'm sure if it stops sending a signal altogether the ECM would pick that up. It'd be worth verifying the installation procedure from the shop manual. Maybe you coat it with thermally-conductive silicone grease or something prior to install. That could break down or ooze out over time. | ||
| Froggy |
EG the sensor would have to be way out of wack to throw the code, reporting something like 5000 degrees. If the sensor is only partly wrong, the bike will read the temp as is and will think thats the real temperature. | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
I ordered the temp sensor today and it was 80 bucks or so. Apparently it has been upgraded 4 times since 1999 and has gone from 30 some bucks to around 80. OUTRageous. | ||
| Etennuly |
I feel your pain. I ordered mine along with the comfort kit today. I won't know for sure what size the socket is until the new one gets here. Tough to measure the original while it is still in the hole. Thanks for your observation on the oil temperature. It is a clue that has been missing in my search for the issue mine has been suffering. I watched your threads on building the 'thermodipcap'. I thought it was a great set up. I don't know why, but I haven't felt the desire to have one. I may in the future, as you have proven, monitoring can prevent future problems. | ||
| Gamdh |
1/2", 6-Point for reference http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?item_ID=63 264&group_ID=1311 Al @ American Sport Bike also has one for less. http://www.americansportbike.com/shoponline/ccp0-p rodshow/16140.html | ||
| Etennuly |
Thanks Mike! 1/2" deep it is! I was going to wait for the new one to measure it. I have many of these sockets, need to use one of impact style of forged steel. Mr plasma cutter can make a fine hole that the wire plug end will fit through! Allrighty then!  | ||
| Kdogshirow |
never met a parts guy who was a good mechanic . . . . | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
Etennuly, I like to think of my ULY having a low grade fever as measured by the oil temp dipstick. Sure hope that 80 bucks does the trick. Talk about bending over. | ||
| Etennuly |
Yeah, but you know how a low grade fever can turn into influenza then pneumonia and on to the plague! It is a lot for a little part, but hey, if that 'spensive little buggar fixes my problem, I will likely pull it back out just to give it a kiss!  | ||
| Froggy |
Must be why I am good at taking things apart, but not being able to put them back together! | ||
| Etennuly |
I got mine in and did the install. I used a deep 1/2", 3/8 drive socket. Cut a long groove with a 3" cut-off die grinder. These chromium/iron sockets grind easy, but will not tolerate plasma cutting to well. The groove had to be double cut to be wide enough for the wire, and had to radius the cut edges so they weren't sharp. It went easily. Handle the wire with care. It has to rotate with the socket and extension and that hole is fairly tight for that. After the air box base was off I removed the right side cross bar/ground cable bolt and loosened the left side one. It just swung out of the way. The sensor was not overly tight, but not loose either, didn't have to worry about breaking the modified socket. Going for a test ride asap. I hope yours goes in as easily as mine did! | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
Glad all went well. I'm counting on mine coming in to the dealer next week. Hopefully I can modify a socket without too much effort. I'll report if my fan comes on at a lower temp like in the past. It had better. | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
I'm wondering if these temp sensors are really even necessary with the oxygen sensors in both pipes on the 2010's. Oil temp might be a more reliable means of signaling the fan to come on and off. A sensor measuring the oil would only have to get to half as hot and would be easier on the sensor. | ||
| Etennuly |
I agree with you on that front. Measuring the oil temperature would be more consistent from where I see it. But then, if an oil blockage occurred you could melt the head and never circulate oil up there to read the temperature over load. And that same scenario could occur in it's present formation if say, you got an intake leak on the front cylinder, it could overheat and not tell the sensor on the rear cylinder. The kit installs pretty easily. I took out the battery mount frame and the stuff necessary to get there. Since I have the hard bags, I decided to short cut a bit. I hooked a small ratchet strap in the big round part of the under-seat tray where the shock is, pulling it back about an inch and a half or so to hold it back in order to work the filler cover down into place. I did the left and right sides both at the same time, kept reaching under and clearing items on each side. The only big deal was getting the adjuster for the rear shock in right. I made an issue of the pipe guard. If it is a little too far back it will hit the frame and the RSS rear screw bracket causing vibes through the frame as in it felt like a bad isolator. Had that realigned in a few seconds. |
