| Author | Message | ||
     Buford |
When this box is "checked" what does it mean? thanks | ||
| Blacklightning |
It means that the idle ignition timing adj. is enabled.  Sorry, I had to. | ||
| Buford |
Yeah, I knew that one was coming.. | ||
| 1_mike |
Don't know. I just raised the timing, starting at the lowest value on the chart (800rpm ?) With the engine running, the "timing" value on page 2(?) shows the value is correct. Unlike the 1125...it won't change the idle/timing. I don't like that.. Mike | ||
| Buford |
Mike-can the timing be changed in real time while the engine is running? | ||
| 1_mike |
Buf - While the engine is running....I don't believe so. Try "x-o-p-t-i" (Mike) for this question. In either case, not a big deal to set it with the engine off. I don't recall the exact numbers I used right now, but after I get home (at work!) I can give you the values I used...you can start there. It idles a little faster, so you'll have to lower your idle speed. It also smooths out the idle quite a bit. So it's not so...Harley...sounding...! I'll have to be careful letting the clutch out the first time after changing this setting...it'll toss you off the back..! Mike | ||
| Buford |
Mike-that would be great. Would love to see the timing numbers. I know my tables show 0 degrees at 10 tps for 800 and 1000 and then 5 degrees adv at 1350 rpms. (Message edited by buford on August 08, 2009) | ||
| Xoptimizedrsx |
yes timing can be done in real time as well as fuel. if you on the dyno with a load. it gets real fun. watching the egt the tq and afr. you will be shocked once you see the final timing in 4000 down in 40% tps down.yes it will load in real time on timing and fuel with out the toggle used. just click ok and keep seeing what its doing. i use the dyno this way with egt, head temps and afr. mike | ||
| 1_mike |
Buford - Here's what I am running... The whole throttle opening line (vertical line) is made up of the settings below. No jumping around, no up and down values. These are working nicely in my XB12. 800 = 4 degrees 1000 = 6 degrees 1350 = 11 degrees 2000 = 23 degrees I'm actually not sure what the 800 and 1000 locations do. I've got my engine idling about 1250rpm. I've tried slower...I like the feeling that the oil pump is pushing more oil at a slightly higher rpm.Just a personal choice. Xop Mike - How do these values look compared to numbers you've used? Mike | ||
| Xl_cheese |
To answer the original question. I think this adds advance timing to cold starts. But I could be wrong. | ||
| Xoptimizedrsx |
800=5r 800=9f 1000=5r 1000=9f i get rid of the 800 row and the 1000 and rename all my rows. i top out at a 7000 row. start with a 900 row i add in a 5500 and a 6500. it makes a huge difference. but needs mapped on wide band front and rear. i also change the tps deg's i remove the 10 row its unused 100% of the time. i add in a 225 row. now the ecms ready to be hand tuned. this is how my dyno work is done. a full days work but well worth it. you will gain up to 10 hp avg and the same on tq. follow these leads and you wont go wrong. dont set closed loop to 13.4 keep it 14.7 on street bikes. the open loop you can set there on the top 3 lines. unless you know what codes to apply in the ecm or run with no o2 correction then you set the whole thing to 13.4afr and leave it. its what i call then a digital carb. remember you can scale the closed loop to a different target in the ecm. as well as the learn area. they are way to high in tps and rpm for my taste. hands down 13.4 afr is where i find the best power to all thats done this for a while. different fuels do change the table. be sure to tune to the fuel you use. fresh fuel. if you live in the high altitude dont have the bike tuned at sea leavel. the map will be off more than you think. already proved that to myself. its off all over the place. not off a whole amount across the board. we realy need a map sensor added to the bikes for mountains. then use that as the correction not the o2 alone. some bikes like the rear at 6. when you offset the timing like this the rpm at idle goes up. and you have to back tps deg down. with that said. if you can back down the tps less air more idle theory carried thought the ecm. setting to get the correct egt and offsets. will allow a lower fuel table with less air and get the same power. over all a more hyped up bike. some cells are way to advanced getting the egt to hot. but that also is epa related. making a lot less fumes. passing emissions that way. dont set timing till it pings then back it off. set timing to max tq value. you will need a dyno to do this. max tq value with afr set at 13.4 is the best it can be. then move to the next cell of data. some cells are good some are way off. the worst cells are the cruise area where epa does there test. IMO to advanced and not split enough. moving timing one deg sometimes you dont see a thing in afr or as much as 8 deg moved. but the egt changes every .5 deg. hope this helps. it will confuse a lot of people. plus you must be use to my writing style.lol time for you guys to buy some gauges, a wide band and a dyno huh? it gets expensive. now with the new bikes with dual o2's you will see them run faster and much better. only if they make a new ecm flash and a header replacement or weld on upgrade for the older bikes. this will smooth out 90% of the issues we have been fighting. the dreaded surging at 2000 to 3500 rpm. plus it would allow a way to read the ecm afv and o2 more precise. down fall would be the new flash would not be ecmspy combatable. you would have tp search out the fuel map in the eeprom and make a spreed sheet then do it in raw hex txt in the eeprom directly. then burn changes only. but well worth it. there is more than one way to do it though. wheels down have fun. i'm working on applying the dual o2 codes to a older ecm in spy. then it would still read. it will take a while to decipher. mike | ||
| Xoptimizedrsx |
the box checked alows the ecm to read the temp and adjust the advance based on air temp and cyl temp. it then has a table seen in the ecm or on the directory files. where you can adjust its value on how much it adds in deg. as air temp changed and cylinder temp the cell falls to more of what you see in the graph. the scale of timing i came up with a long time ago before ecmspy2 came out. it was the code of .0257 from the raw hex data in binary form. cause what values we see in binary to hex are all in 4 digit form. we settled on .025 as the fixed deg value. then the pc writer added that ratio to the ecmsy and it was released to the public aprox 5 months later. we are on version . well what we all have now before it closed down is version aprox 12 i believe. as there was a lot of test version never released to the public. some have funny words on them. as the writers are german and the english translation a few times got messed up. it was fun though. hope the above brought insite on how long i was playing with ecmspy before it came available to the genera public and helps your question. i start pc program writing school next week for three years. now i'll be able i hope to write a few thing we need into a new version for us all. i'll give it one heck of a try. i run mine not checked. on both of my buells. | ||
| Buford |
Thanks Mike- Anyway you could paste the ign maps from EcmSpy onto this message thread? | ||
| 1_mike |
Mike (Xo)- Being a long time drag racer (cars), I must disagree with some of what you've said about exh. gas temps and timing. "Low" timing will increase exh. temps., not high timing. Exhaust temperatures can and are somewhat mixed as to weather it's fuel or timing at points when things get close to "correct". Again, mistaking a high temp as high timing is normally misleading. And as another misleading bit of "drag strip" proven info... The best "dyno" results rarely prove out the best E.T. slips. My XB12, has the peppiest throttle...with a very slight amount of constant-smooth detonation. It's also been verified by the gas mileage. I fully understand the ramifications of this and have remidied the condition...AND have lost mileage and response in the throttle. But it'll save the piston tops, rings and rod bearings...! Why this is....I haven't a clue on this one..! Mike | ||
| Xoptimizedrsx |
yeah you have to watch the dyno. it will lie to you in a heart beat. the dyno guy must know how to run it in advanced scale of you are not getting it set good. a dyno is only a tool. i use it to get the base mapping then finish the mapping on the actual road with loggers. mapped to the bike rider and all variables in lave data. thats the best way. yes to low of timing will raise the temps also. guess i wasn't clear about it. sorry about that. mike | ||
| Buford |
MikeX: What would the ecm do to timing as air temp and or engine increase? More advance..retard timing? And would it be just at idle or across the table? thanks (Message edited by Buford on August 11, 2009) | ||
| Xoptimizedrsx |
it does both. depending on tps and rpm position. a really really long story. stuff you cant do with ecmspy alone so i wouldnt worry about it on a street bike. at idle it advances it at wot sometime it adv it but 90% it retards it. no details on this. its tool lengthy. wee ecmspy.com and the ecm profiles the data is there in script. i'll leave it at that sorry. i have the spreads in my ecm program no one has. (yet) mike | ||
| Buford |
Trying to achieve the "perfect" idle..thing runs great though. May never be able to do that given there is just single throttle plate for 2 cyls... dunno.. |
