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Froggy
| | Posted on Monday, April 27, 2009 - 08:13 pm: | 
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GMC is the most profitable part of GM. The light duty trucks like the Sierra are almost identical to the Silverado, but similarly equipped are are $5000 more. The medium and heavy duty trucks like the Topkick also are doing fine in their segments. It costs GM next to nothing to keep GMC going, and closing GMC dealers is more of a burden than it would be worth to even bother doing. Its going to be expensive to close each of the brands, as Oldsmobile costed GM several billion between buying out the dealers and other lawsuits related to the closing. |
Jb2
| | Posted on Monday, April 27, 2009 - 08:19 pm: |
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>>> And people bitch about a one month backorder on a belt on a current production Ulysses.
They should. |
Ozzie84
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 12:34 am: |
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when i heard this...i was freakin pissed, its the only american brand that ive ever had since my 1st car (4 to be exact) and have a 71 firebird fomula....not only will parts be more expensive, the heritage of pontiac will be gone.....friggin gay! |
Cityxslicker
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 01:50 am: |
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Now now, I have never said I wanted a Camry. (and in my best Bill Clinton impersonation) I did not have garage relations with that vehicle.
I got an 84 Ford Ranger pickup. I have no need for a new car. American or otherwise. Now on a pure lust level, I dig the looks of the Sky. No kids, not married, no baggage, the perfect reason d' etre for four wheels for me. Its a nice ride, but then again I have always loved the Shelby 427SC Cobra. Totally impractical, but pure sex.
Death before a Camry graces my garage, unfortunately it will probably be the same for the Cobra. |
Mr_grumpy
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 04:22 am: |
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What’s next? Nissan buying Renault?
Lol, good one Froggy.
2008xb12scg, FIAT are prospective buyers of Chrysler not GM. Personally I reckon it'd be a good fit between Chrysler & FIAT, better than ever was with Daimler Benz.
Sadly I can't see anybody buying GM as a whole, it's moribund.
I think if the unions get their collective heads out of their collective asses & work with potential buyers, most of GM can be saved by selling off different bits to other car makers, if not it'll be a complete disaster.
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Aesquire
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 07:56 am: |
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The Daimler takeover wrecked the QC efforts Chrysler had made. Ironic when a Jeep micro SUV had better quality of build than a Mercedes. The QC is coming back with the Cerubus owners. Since Chrysler is lacking in high MPG cars, Fiat makes sense to a Washington legislature type. Makes me cringe, though.
GM has been running stupid for some time.
The sale of the only part of the company that made money, GMAC finance arm, was the kind of decision you see from people who are raping a company for personal gain as they leave a gutted shell to be cleaned up by others. Like Kodak.
The Corvette is today a world class car. I'd love a ZR1, 600+ ponies & superb handling. Won't though, don't want to hear the "sorry about your penis" jokes.
Cadillac has a few really sweet cars, and GMC makes an ok truck. But interior quality in the Chevy/Pontiac lines has been crap for so long that cheap plastic, poorly fitted is expected. GM vans, though I like the door hinges, are rattletrap tin boxes that don't hold up as well as Fords. That's sad.
If I saw in '06 a coming fuel crisis, GM didn't seem to. GM made so many models of SUV I couldn't keep track. That's ok, SUV's are a high markup item, but I didn't see the low profit car that got great mileage coming out of detroit. They've had more than 30 years to make me the 100 Mpg car I've wanted since Carter was Prez. Still waiting.
A steady rise in fuel price, no domestic production increase allowed by Congress. A 2 freaking year election cycle with Hamas etc. supporting one of the American political parties. Not the incumbent one. So just a few disruptions in production could create a "crisis" jacking fuel costs. There were such disruptions and the price did go up.
So over a year ago, I looked for a new car. I wanted a hatchback with good room & 100 mpg. ( I'd compromise on that ) Ford's little Escort was not in production, nothing Chrysler had got good mileage, GM's Saturn line had grown fat, I was not impressed with the Cobalt, and even Honda's Civic was fat & no hatch.
VW had a Diesel coming, and tales of 50mpg with GTI handling were heard. ( best line on VW ever, from "Top Gear" about the new GTI "If you knew how to make this car, why did you sell us such crap all these years?" ) So down went the money. A freaking year later, my car arrives, & I can no longer afford it. Sigh.
Still looking for that wee hatch that I fit in ( sorry Honda, the Fit, doesn't ) gets super high mileage, and runs well for hours of x-way zooming. Think it'll be a Fiat?  |
Crackhead
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 08:11 am: |
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look at the Toyota Matrix or if you want a domestic you can get a Toyota Vibe for dirt cheep now.....i mean Pontiac Vibe. |
Swordsman
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 09:06 am: |
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Hey, I had a 2003 Vibe, and it WAS a fantastic car. Zero problems for 90k miles, and then it just needed a new belt tensioner pulley.
"Hard to be profitable when nobody will buy a car that has 4” panel gaps and tons of wind noise as result."
I never noticed any of that with my S-1. I read about it, and I looked for it, but my "gaps" were actually smaller than what I observed on a lot of GM pickups.
Funny thing about those Saturns though... to be so small, they had the WORST turning diameter! No joke, my wife's Z71 extended cab cut a smaller circle than the S-1. If you had to make a u-turn, you'd better hope you had 3 lanes to work with on the other side, or else you'd be backing up in the middle of the road.
~SM |
Crackhead
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 12:43 pm: |
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Thats a Toyota for you. |
Xl1200r
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 02:13 pm: |
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I worked in a garage through high school and college. All cars break, no matter what the Japanese tell you.
VWs are among the WORST.
And when 13 out of 14 technicians drive American-made vehicles (as well as all of the office girls and night crew), that says something. The one guy who didn't used to own a VW shop that went under, but even he had a GMC pickup he used most days. |
Mr_grumpy
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 04:09 pm: |
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Are we talking about new cars or service & parts here.
I own two four wheel vehicles at the moment.
A 2006 Ford Focus C-Max diesel, & my old faithfull 1968 Dodge D100 pickup, I can get most parts for the Dodge off the shelf in the US delivered to my door in less than a week, the same parts for the Ford take the same time or longer through the dealer network.
As for prices, I needed a wheel bearing for the Ford, at the dealer it was over 350 dollars; I kid you not! as you have to buy a complete unit, what a ripoff. Through my internet connections I got the unit for half that from the UK.
I haven't spent that much in total on parts for the Dodge over the last 5 years!!!!
I know it guzzles, but using it as a second vehicle, if you cost it all out it's hardly more expensive than a compact .
As to VWs yes they make good kit, but you MUST stick to the maintenance schedule, & you MUST use their own oil if you want one of their diesels to last. I won't buy one & I won't be buying another recent Ford either, because I refuse to be a hostage to their dealers.
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Swordsman
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 04:44 pm: |
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Grumpy, I just saw your Dodge in the hot rod thread. My first vehicle was a 1967. Identical to yours, but with a different grille. It didn't have a motor when we bought it, but we dropped a 318 in it, and a previous owner had swapped in a full ton running gear. It came with 38" mud tires, and had 9 leaf springs under each wheel to provide the lift. Talk about a frikkin' BEAST to drive! Got lots of attention at school, but scary as hell out on the road. First gear was fun... no gas necessary. Just drop the clutch and let it idle off!
~SM
(Message edited by Swordsman on April 28, 2009) |
2008xb12scg
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 06:32 pm: |
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Grumpy thanks for the correction. But then my question would be about Chrysler. If Chrysler is an Amarican company (is it anymore?) And We want Fiat to buy them,, why are we (via bailout $) dumping money into a future foreign company? To save the jobs maybe? Not sure I get it. |
Jstfrfun
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 06:55 pm: |
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These poorly managed companies should have been allowed to die months ago, and then be taken over by new buyers who didn't have to bow down to the unions. 28.00 an hour dosen't work, 25% of the sales price of each vehicle paid to the pension fund dosen't work, fat cat execs dosen't work.
The only way to re-structure is to let them die and start over. |
Xl1200r
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 09:12 am: |
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Jst -
I really wanted to see them saved when this mess all got started. Now, I'm not so sure. They may too far over the edge to successfully bring back, but I've been surprised before.
If something like GM were to die, I do think it would be exciting to see what kind of new, domestic automakers might arise. I'm just not sure how well they could survive with all of the government testinig and certification required for new vehicles - it would take someone with a LOT of capital even to get a meager one-model company off the ground. |
2008xb12scg
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 10:45 am: |
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There is an American auto maker turning a 3% profit from what I hear. Maybe that company (Buell) needs to start making cars. |
Dbird29
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 10:47 am: |
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Bring back Plymouth! |
Jstfrfun
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 02:31 pm: |
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If GM or Chrysler crashed the corpse of the monster would still be there all the buyer would have to do is re-structure and re-manage with a clean slate, yes it would take some time, but it COULD be done without costing such a catastropy to American buisiness that the feds would lose what was predicted. I think there's a lot of "helpin a brutha out" going on in corporate America,IJS. |
Swordsman
| | Posted on Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 09:13 am: |
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Heard this morning on the news that the Chrysler/Fiat talks fell through, and Chrysler is now looking at full blown bankruptcy. Maybe this will bring down the price of the Challenger. 
~SM |
Darthane
| | Posted on Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 11:02 am: |
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It's being reported that it's some of the hedge funds that own secured debt, not the Fiat/Chrysler merger itself.
Unfortunately, time is proving me right on this one. >.< Hopefully Chrysler will emerge rapidly as a strong, lean company, but with the government involved let's just list me as 'highly skeptical'.
The same goes for GM, and unfortunately that likely means I will very shortly find myself out of a job.
'The government has no interest in running the automotive industry' my ASS. It won't be over until Reid, Pelosi, and that moron Obama have forced at LEAST one of the major global automakers to produce what THEY want, not what the consumer wants. |
Limitedx1
| | Posted on Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 11:46 am: |
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hope my 2002 ws6 goes up in value.....probably not till this slump is over.. |
Froggy
| | Posted on Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 12:11 pm: |
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Navy blue metallic with the 6 speed and t-tops? I want. I have been wanting one for years now. |
J0hn0tt0
| | Posted on Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 12:39 pm: |
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Say hello to Chrysler-Fiat:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/01/business/01auto. html?hp
I'm excited. After studying abroad in Italy for a month last year, I can't wait to see what cars will be brought over. |
Darthane
| | Posted on Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 12:48 pm: |
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If it's done properly, it could be a boon to both companies.
Fiat rebadges their European small and midsize vehicles and re-enters the NA market. They keep Chrysler's expertise regarding light-duty trucks (Ram), Jeep, and minivans (goobermobiles, yes, but they are arguably the best family vehicles ever invented).
...unfortunately I think it will end horribly. >.< |
Xl1200r
| | Posted on Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 01:05 pm: |
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I can't wait to see what cars will be brought over.
Who effin cares. They very well may have some neat cars. The point of all this bailout stuff is to promote DOMESTIC business, DOMESTIC manufacturing.
MY tax dollars had better not go towards creating an easy distribution channel for the italians. |
Limitedx1
| | Posted on Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 01:06 pm: |
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one of the greatest bodies ever designed |
Froggy
| | Posted on Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 01:23 pm: |
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:drool:
What wheels are those? They look similar to the current Z06 Corvette rims. |
Sayitaintso
| | Posted on Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 02:13 pm: |
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For the folks bashing on VW.... I got a Jetta Tdi in 01 and have had no real problems in the 150k + miles I've had it.
The only thing that happened was the mass air flow sensor went bad in the first 1,000 miles. Replaced under warrenty and nothing but oil changes, timing belt and tires since.
Well that and its an accident magnet. Its been rear ended three times, had a crate fall out of the back of a truck on the interstate, and sideswiped in a parking lot. |
Xl1200r
| | Posted on Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 02:25 pm: |
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I don't doubt there are good ones out there, but the 7 years I spent working in a 16-bay repair shop which averaged something like 90 cars per day likely gives me a slightly larger sample pool.
Then there's my brother's Jetta which was a total POS.
The friend who had a newer Jetta which he had to trade in because after just a couple of years the transmission was about the hit the fan.
The other friend who had one of those special "GLI" turbo Jettas who battled squealing brakes since the day he bought it for a solid year, right up until they offered to buy the car back from him at the MSRP and let him put it towards anything else on the lot. After a short lived ownership of a current generation Jetta, he traded that in on a current model GTI, which had the radio replaced twice. He got rid of that car after about a year.
None of these people in my examples are currently driving VWs.
VWs, in my experience, are very hit or miss. Sometimes you get lucky, but sometimes they're a total headache. Parts are pricey, and the "German Engineering" can make them a pain in the butt to work on for certain tasks. |
Sayitaintso
| | Posted on Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 03:16 pm: |
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Lol, I guess thats good news then....I got a one in a million 
My biggest beef with the car has been the crappy "rubberized" plastic pieces used in the interior. The rubber film they put over the plastic pieces started peeling off within the first year...looks like total crap, but its only looks and I really like the 45-50 mpg I get. Usually I get better mileage from it than either of my bikes.
What has surprised me the most is that at even at 150K the clutch still seems as strong as day 1 (knock on wood) and most of my driving has been stop and go commuting which is usually murder on a clutch.
As for Chrysler and the other auto companies, the ones who are gonna get it in the tail are gonna be the retirees. Whether they should have the pensions they do or not is another question....but they planned their retirement based on them and to have the plans changed after they're gone b/c of bankruptcy sucks. |
Xl1200r
| | Posted on Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 03:31 pm: |
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A well-driven clutch should last the life of the vehicle... at least as long as your 150k miles, even in a commuting-type role.
My first car, a 1991 Pontiac Grand Am LE Coupe with a High-Output QUAD-4 and 5 speed (if I ever find one of those in good shape I WILL buy it), was put to rest at around 140k miles, and that included plenty of abuse from myself, my best friend who bought it from me, and my girlfriend at the time who learned to drive manual on it. It still had the original clutch.
And when I say abuse, I'm talking about "I'm a 17-year-old kid who wants to be a racecar driver" abuse. |
Swordsman
| | Posted on Friday, May 01, 2009 - 09:43 am: |
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My late father-in-law worked for a company called MSX that does service center consultation work for any and all auto brands. He said that VW has been having one helluva time with its quality control since it moved certain manufacturing to Mexico. A girl here at work had a new Beetle a few years back and still curses that thing.
~SM |
Darthane
| | Posted on Friday, May 01, 2009 - 12:45 pm: |
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The problem with Mexican manufacturing isn't the people themselves (ie, not all Mexicans are incompetent, lazy, have poor work ethics, etc) - the bigger problem with our company's Mexican operations (and I suspect many if not most others) is that the turnaround rate is ridiculously high.
No, I couldn't tell you why it's so high, but when a significant part of your work force is being replaced each month, it's absolute hell on quality and training budgets. |
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