| Author | Message | ||
     Garretts1w |
Comparing 1998 S1W specs against the 12R... The 12R only has 2 more horse but has less torque? So anyone out there have both? Whos beating who? I have an S1W was looking at a 12R today to go with it is it worth my money? | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
the XBs are lighter and have better suspension, I think. | ||
| Mcgiver |
I have a 98 s3, (same engine as s1)and it probably had a more responsive power than my 12r. I have now added 1250 kit,stage2 head work,and 536 cams, it will now blow the 12r away. But I can still ride the 12r faster in the canyons!I love both. Brian | ||
| Ducxl |
The loss of the trapdoor is what gave the XB the HP advantage...or so they say | ||
| Tblasier_mmi |
I have an x1 and a xb12 and i do agree that the tubers are more responsive and that the xb's are much better to really lean over. depends what riding you like doing. I do love both too. Wouldnt trade them for anything. | ||
| Swampy |
What ever bike Daves is riding....... Or so I've been told! | ||
| Beachbuell |
Stock XB vs stock Tuber............ XB. I've owned several of each. The XB is lighter, nimble and modern. The XB will get off the line quicker and will reach maximum velocity faster. Top speed might be close, but I'd say XB also. My 12 topped out at 147mph. HOWEVER, I've sold my XB's and reverted back to Tubers. I love em! | ||
| Ducbsa |
The loss of the trapdoor is what gave the XB the HP advantage...or so they say A friend has a record of 225 mph at Bonneville with a 1600cc 80% nitro burning Vincent that has a trapdoor. Maybe a different design? | ||
| Igneroid |
I got a trap door on my long john underwear. I can shit pretty fast in those things if the need arises...so Im thinkin theres gotta be somthing to this.... | ||
| Djkaplan |
Not sure why not having a trapdoor would make a difference in power output... but I don't know as much as 'they' does. 'They' seems to know everything. | ||
| Ducxl |
In past threads HERE,it was quoted that the joint,or locating pins can flex.The added ridgidity was quoted as responsible for the 103hp versus 101hp. I can recall much conversation on it. I personally do not subscribe to it.But take it FWIW | ||
| Bcordb3 |
Which is faster? Top end? Drag race? Through the twisties, Starbucks to Starbucks? The guy who has kitted bike and failed to tell his opponent. I would say the better rider (and lighter rider) would determine the outcome. What is a trap door? I don't what that is. Does a trap door have a proper name? | ||
| Aesquire |
Access Door per '00-01 M2 parts catalog. It holds the bearings on the outboard (left)side of the transmission. Bolted in position. The old tubers have it, the XB series does not. I don't see what major difference in power that would allow you. The XB's require splitting the cases to repair the Trans. (Message edited by aesquire on July 06, 2008) | ||
| Ducbsa |
The trap door is the removable plate behind the clutch that lets you pull the transmission without splitting the cases. For most owners, probably not a big deal, because the trans should last, with proper maintenance. | ||
| Ducxl |
Yes,but it used to make it REAL easy to dismantle the transmission without affecting the cylinders/pistons/crank. I once delighted at spending a winter just fiddling dismantling/re-assembling my Sporty trans.Only because i could.Now i can't.And i also digress.. The XB is faster by it's technological improvements. Technology only moves forward.Right? | ||
| Djkaplan |
"...it was quoted that the joint,or locating pins can flex.The added ridgidity was quoted as responsible for the 103hp versus 101hp." The race only XBRR has a trapdoor transmission... similar in concept (if not in execution) to every GP bike made this century... perhaps for the last quarter century. Case integrity is probably stiffer with the unconventional 'conventional' transmission layout now used in the XBs and Sportsters (the trapdoor transmission was was introduced in 1954!), but there is no way you'll convince me that was done for any other reason than production costs, especially in light of the power output capabilities of the XL/XB engine. | ||
| Djkaplan |
I've had my transmission out to install a Baker smooth shift, and then again to change two countershaft gears with internal splines that were worn that were causing missed 1st to 2nd shift (the dogs looked great). Easily could have been done in a single morning with a lunchtime test ride... in both cases. I took longer just to touch the parts and look around while I was in there. | ||
| Beachbuell |
I will agree with splitting the cases is a PITA just to work on the trans if need be. This is one of the reasons I reverted back to "old technology". Its easier to work on. | ||
| Bcordb3 |
Thank you all for clearing up the trap door. That little mod is the reason Baker didn't want to sell me the six speed transmission. | ||
| Not_purple_s2 |
I would think that those extra couple of ponies come from the improved head design and the little changes to the intake and exhaust systems. | ||
| Djkaplan |
Right there with you Curtis. | ||
| Ducxl |
I did a search on the subject and could only turn up info stating "ridgidity". I couldn't find anything about "HP". I stand corrected. Not that i subscribed to it,but i know i've read it here somewhere. | ||
| Phat_j |
ok, check it...... the trap door had absolutly nothing to do with the hp numbers since the posted numbers are crank hp numbers, not rwhp... so the transmission has nothing to do with it at all.... | ||
| Rick_a |
The XB12 gained two HP through the cylinder heads. Were it not for using the same cams as the XB9 it'd be a pretty serious motor. They are capable of supporting some serious power. With stock XB heads, a bigger cam, and a little more compression I gained 21 horsepower on my Lighting-head S1. That said I prefer the tuber for a streetbike, as it's shortcomings only become evident at track-like levels. The XB's need a heavier hand to steer but feel so much more solid and seem to handle better the farther they are leaned. If I could afford a track-only bike, it'd be an XB12. | ||
| Reepicheep |
RickA, wouldn't you be better (dollar for dollar and pound for pound) on the track with an XB9 with an 1150 kit? | ||
| Ratbuell |
Having both an XB (stock UlyX, stock intake, opened up inner airbox, Drummer muffler) and S1W (stock internals, jet kit, race air filter, race ignition, Vance & Hines can), I can safely say the XB is quicker, more stable, and feels all-around more sorted than the tuber. Same feeling with my S2 (thunderstorm top end, Lightning cams, race ignition, Buell race exhaust), but the question mentioned the S1W specifically... I use more tire on the XB, it's more planted when it's leaned waaay over, and it's easier to get waaay over in the first place. The XB is an easier bike to reach the edge of the envelope with; the tuber requires a little more rider finesse and some additional effort. I've also said it before - the tuber smells bad, makes loud noises, scares pets and small children and shakes your eyeballs in your skull...and I won't trade it for anything. | ||
| Rick_a |
Most likely, but that's too rich for my blood, anyway. | ||
| Reepicheep |
True. I was thinking along the lines of buying a salvage title XB9R somewhere for $2k or something, and putting another $3k into it to get it track ready. My $561 KLR-250 is almost too rich for my blood though, so take this with a grain of salt  | ||
| Rick_a |
Hey, it only took me six years to get my S1 to where I originally wanted it...and I had to break my motor...twice...to get the go-ahead from my significant other  |
