| Author | Message | ||
     Cycletlh |
Ok, so it is after Thanksgiving and the high today was like 27 degrees. Was scanning the net and looked at pics of the new BMW 800. http://www.motorcycledaily.com/23november07_bmw200 8f800gs.htm What if: Buell took the existing XB platform, changed the rake, added fork travel, a longer swingarm, 21" front, 18 or 19" rear, chain drive, XB9 primary. This was discussed a lot when the Uly first came out. I am not talking about changing the Uly, but another model. This is what brought me to Buell in the first place. I was going to build my own. Bought an S2 to use as a donor bike, collected WP suspension off of a KTM. Other projects took priority and in the mean time I got to liking the S2 so much that I could not cut it up. The weight of the Buell is not that much more than the BMW and about the same as the KTM Adventure. Would it work? Would it sell? Would it attract other buyers to Buell? | ||
| Bosh |
"Would it work? Would it sell? Would it attract other buyers to Buell?" What a bike like that would excel at is globe trotting where just getting there is the objective. Not necessarily having much motorcycle (riding) fun along the way. Basically (IMHO) too much of a compromise in both the road, and off road fronts. It would be clumsy and slow in both environments, but it would get you there if you know what I mean. I put the F800GS and R1200GS in the same category. Too heavy and ponderous to be really good off road. And the wrong geometry and tires for fun on the road. It would get you to the dirt in an unremarkable kind of way and get you through the off road part in a equally unremarkable kind of way. Your Buell version would be more along the lines of a R1200GS which has more on road Prowers and would be more useful than the 800 in my opinion. I don't know, I wouldn't buy one unless I had a third world trip planned. The Ulysses on the other hand.. It'll get you through the dirt if it has to. Not as competently as the BMW's but you'll have hella fun on the roads getting to wherever you're goin. Not many public dirt roads / trails that really go anywhere where I live. So I grab my dirt bike when I want to ride in dirt. I grab my Buell when I'm just taking off for the day / weekend to try and get lost and see where I end up. . | ||
| Bertotti |
I would certainly look into one. Ones idea of fun is very subjective. | ||
| Mainstreamer |
Buell would also need better thermal management. This seems to be an issue they are unable to resolve with the current Uly configuration. Here in south Florida I don't ride the Uly during the heat of summer. Horsing it around off road during hot weather would simply not appeal to those who are looking for a 'true adventure' model. As for chain drive.... I suspect the belt is nearly, or perhaps more durable and most riders will not ride where the durability of the belt will be tested. I think Buell may have missing a significant marketing opportunity when those chaps from South America visited Wis. before riding their Uly's to South America. Had Buell documented and promoted that journey as BMW did with the 'Long way round' perhaps BMW would now be asking the question.... 'What is we convert our GS line to belt drive' for lower weight and less maintenance? | ||
| Court |
>>>Had Buell documented and promoted that journey Actually Buell did a stellar job of documenting and promoting it. In addition there are a host of other such undertakings going on . . . I'm involved with two at the moment. It's tough to keep showcasing all of them, the Ulysses is just a bike that invites you to adventure. The South American Adventure (the first one, the one you are talking about) was wild and involved everything from bandits, bad cops, robbery and some terrible terrain. | ||
| Windrider |
All adventure bikes are a compromise of sorts. The Buell belt drive is the best final drive in all of motorcycling, IMHO. However, it limits use of the bike in mud and dirt. The Buell ZTL front brake / wheel is a great design and gives a really light unsprung weight. The fact that this design is tied to a 17" wheel limits the tire choices and ability of the Uly in the dirt. The current Uly is strong on comfort and strong on handling on the street. These strengths make it weaker in the dirt. It is best classified as all road bike and it's rigid chassis and excellent suspension make it fun on rough roads but mud or trails are a bit much for it. If Buell were to head down the path of making a dirtier Buell I would hope that it would have a smaller, lighter Rotax based engine and be lighter and less expensive overall. This would also make it less worthy on the street for touring and comfort and knobbies would take some cornering performance away. Adventure bikes are all a compromise between dirt performance, street handling, comfort, weight, and cost. | ||
| Bearly |
They never mention the suspension travel anywhere in the official info for the GS800. Look like a more dedicated off road machine than an Adventure sport bike. Weighing that much I hope it has at least 11 inches of suspension travel. | ||
| Windrider |
Court says: "I'm involved with two at the moment." Please elaborate! Or are you missions cloaked in secrecy as usual..... Here's one of my favorite Dirty Buell posts, that isn't promoted by Buell anywhere that I saw: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23 3793 | ||
| Adrian_8 |
Bosh hit the nail on the head...I could not have said it any better...people trying to turn the ULY or any other "heavy" bike into a dirt bike...read and reread that post. | ||
| Ulytime |
>>>> Actually Buell did a stellar job of documenting and promoting it. The South American Adventure (the first one, the one you are talking about) was wild and involved everything from bandits, bad cops, robbery and some terrible terrain. <<<< Hey Court - is there video available? DVDs etc? A blog perhaps? I'd love to read about this adventure! Forgive me if it's already obviously posted somewhere. | ||
| Mainstreamer |
Ulytime, 'A stellar job of......'. and we don't know if a DVD is available? Ya got to be kidding! Take a look at some of the other boards and see what riders are doing with their KTM's and even the fat R1200GS. Where are all the ULY adventures???? Not flaming you, l enjoy my uly but it is what it is. In my opinion..... (yep we all have 'em) lack of proper promotion has keep kept Buell out of the mainstream. Sure, we the Buell enthusiast, know what a good product it is. Others do not. | ||
| Windrider |
Here is a link to the "Lasso the Americas" site. http://enlazandoamerica.com.ar/index.html The English translations are a bit rough. If you speak Spanish it might help. What a ride ! The Ulys held up very well. | ||
| Bertotti |
Bosh and Adrian_8 my point is still that just because it doesn't fit your idea of fun doesn't mean it isn't someone else's idea of fun. I for one like taking a beast and getting it through. I find it fun. Of course I want to be able to tweak it a bit and change tires, who doesn't like to tweak their rides to suit them. | ||
| Mikef5000 |
Actually Buell did a stellar job of documenting and promoting it. I normally agree with everything you say Court, but I don't know about this one. I could most deffinately be wrong, but how exactly was it promoted? I don't remember seeing anything official about this, just updates here on Badweb. | ||
| Court |
Now you DO KNOW that the trip in that post was conceived, hosted and conducted by BUELL MOTORCYCLE COMPANY, right? It was a media event something akin to the recent Laguna Seca event for the 1125r. All the folks on the trip, including Dave who wrote the piece for Kiwi Rider, were journalists and all the bikes were provided by Buell. >>>>I don't remember seeing anything official about this, So you'd not call the 8 page article in FUELL "The Official Publication of Buell Motorcycle Company" anything "official"? I'm a teasing you . . . you'll be glad to know I used almost exclusively pics from these two adventures in the chapter about the Ulysses.  | ||
| Court |
By the way . . . none of these projects are "particularly secret" I've just fond the internet particularly unforgiving when an idea is announced and later either doesn't come to fruition -i{(look at the bashing Buell's taking over the dirt bike . . they got their lesson about discussing future products shoved up their ass)} or fails to meet someone's idea of how they would have done it. One of the trips in planning is damn near impossible . . . and will require extensive preparation, physical, emotional, financial and heavy mods to the bikes. It's an entirely privately funded and conducted venture and is still in the presentation to investors stage and mods to the bikes are being engineered. . . it'll be a dandy. My wife has already told me I am single dude if I even think about going! | ||
| Cityxslicker |
She gets in the dirt quite well, if'n ya have any doubts, I will run it on my City-X first just to show ya how capable that bike is off road. | ||
| Mainstreamer |
Court, articles in Fuell are like singing to the choir. When friends ask 'Where we going next yaer?' I lend them my DVD of 'Long Way Round'. I await the day when I can lend out a copy of 'School Buss Over The Adnes'  Remind me sometime to tell you about my off road adventure up the base of the Matterhorn on the Italian side! | ||
| Court |
Will do . . .  | ||
| Cycletlh |
WOW!!! I expected to stir the pot, just in a different manner. (Sorry Court) Should have posted this at ADVrider. Everything is a compromise. The Uly is advertised as a 90/10 bike pavement to dirt. Yes, it will do some dirt. Both mine and the wife's 9s have been on dirt. A dirt trip down Baja is a different story! And yes I know, there have been a couple guys with their Uly's down there. Once again, not talking about replacing any of the current models but a new model added to the existing line-up. There are a number of heavy off-roaders out there. One group just finished 18th in the pro class on a KTM 950 in the Baja 1,000. I agree that heat management is/would be a major issue. My fan runs constant even when riding at 45 degrees. |
