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Tincus
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 27, 2007 - 10:25 am: | 
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Just got a 2005 XB12S about 4 weeks ago with only 70 miles on it and still under factory warranty until October 2007.
I have run 3 tanks of premium fuel through it and it now has about 450 miles...lots of fun!
However, last week it started choking, missing, back firing, etc. I was close to the local HD dealer so I took it there. I figured the plugs were fouled out, no big deal. They replaced the plugs, and a wire (they broke, and blamed it on a tight fit, and charged me). Payed my $50 and took off, got about 100 yards down the road and same problem! The bike has been there since! The A-hole service manager said I probably put bad gas in it, then he found out that it was basically out of gas when I pulled in (blew that theory), then he said the dealer I purchased it from left bad gas in it and even though I ran 3 premium tanks through it, the damage was done...that seemed a little of a far stretch. His last comment to me was great "Hope you got a good deal on it". I would have taken it somewhere else, but it's unrideable. No errors show up on the computer, they reset the TPS (I think that is right) and everything else they could think of, bla, bla, bla.
I have read alot of the thready on this sight and have learned a ton, this is my first street bike and I'm glad to have access to a site like this.
I forgot to mention, the bike is stock. If anyone has any suggestions I can pass on I would greatly appreciate it, I dont think I will be dealing with Brighton HD again, they dont seem to know their Buells. Also, I have seen several threads refering to the HD/Buell Global Warranty Manual? Where do I get this manual, can someone send me a link...that would be awesome! |
Blake
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 27, 2007 - 01:39 pm: |
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Please describe more precisely the poor running symptoms of your bike. What engine speeds and throttle action, what gear, at idle or cruising or at high speed, is it okay if revved up, only happens when hot/cold, etc? |
Tincus
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 27, 2007 - 02:39 pm: |
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The Bike starts and idols fine, usually you can rev it up and it seems just fine, at the shop after they test rode it it was back firing when reving it up, but hadent done it to me.
The problem started very, very intermittent. For a day or two I had a couple incidents where the bike would kinda cut out, or chug a little going about 40, or 50. Just real quick, I would pull in the clutch, rev it a little, then it was fine. I wondered if the plugs were bad, even though they were new 300 miles ago.
The third day it started doing it real bad, pulling in the clutch worked until I let it back out. Down shifting might help, or up shifting sometimes...I guess keeping the R's higher was better then low. It got so bad I didnt think I was going to get to the dealer, it would chug and cut out so bad it would start back firing, then stall. A couple times I had to coast off the road then down shift, dump the clutch and fire it back up. Then I would get the bike back up to around 50 and try to find a speed it would run good at for a while. I guess 40 - 50 keeping the R's at 3300 or around there was the best bet...but it continued to get worse.
Hope this helps?
I called HD/Buell customer to find out about warrenty info and they said that the "Global Warranty Manual" is used by dealerships, not sure why it's such a big secret, shouldnt we all be on the same page? Anyhow if anyone knows where I can get a copy I would love to see it.
Thanks.
-Shane |
Sparky
| | Posted on Thursday, June 28, 2007 - 02:04 am: |
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If there is no Check Engine Light coming on after these incidents, I would tend to thing that there is some kind of interruption in the ignition circuit.
On the tube frame Buells, there is a sidestand switch that must maintain a close circuit state to keep the ignition current flowing for normal operation when in gear at any speed. It has been documented that if this switch becomes defective, then normal ignition may cease to function or cause backfiring, stalling, popping through the carb, and in general, abnormal driveability.
I don't know if your particular model has a sidestand switch, but there are other switches like the neutral switch, clutch switch, RUN/OFF switch as well as sensors like the Bank Angle Sensor, Oxygen Sensor, Intake Air Sensor, Head Temp Sensor and the wire harness that ties everything together that could be contributing to this condition. All these components must be 100% functional for normal operation.
Regarding the dealer, remember: the dealer is an independent agent, meaning Buell Motorcycle Company has (virtually) no control over the dealer. It's up to you to finesse the dealer's service department into trying to find out what the problem is if that is what you want.
The other way to go is to buy the factory service manual, look into the troubleshooting sections relating to your specific problem and point out to the service manager what their "technicians" should check out! Who knows, maybe he'll knock off 50% of the bill if you're right? |
Tincus
| | Posted on Thursday, June 28, 2007 - 11:22 am: |
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Thanks for your suggestions, maybe I'll see if they checked the things you mentioned. Also, I do plan on gettins a manual, I need one.
As far as the dealer goes, I think Beull Motor company has more control then you think! Buell is a part of HD, HD dealerships sell and service one product. So I dont think they want to deal with headquarters over being incompetinet, I wouldnt. Still, I dont want to make any enemys there at this time...my bike is still on there bench if you know what I mean. |
Blake
| | Posted on Thursday, June 28, 2007 - 02:23 pm: |
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Yep, sounds rxactly like a sidestand safety switch gone bad. If you pull in the clutch and the engine runs fine, that is the likely problem. It happened to me. Heat and moisture can exacerbate the problem. It may not be a sidestand safety switch, but some other safety switch that is tied to the clutch actuation switch in its circuitry, maybe a starter/neutral indicator circuit?
(Message edited by blake on June 28, 2007) |
Tincus
| | Posted on Friday, June 29, 2007 - 01:30 pm: |
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Thanks!
I just called the dealership and asked them to check those safty switches you suggested. They are still waiting on a tool to check the fuel preasure...oh boy!
Thanks again, it's been 7 days in the shop, I miss my baby!
-Shane, |
Ricochet
| | Posted on Sunday, July 01, 2007 - 05:51 pm: |
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I don't believe your bike has a sidestand safety switch. My 03 has one, but we were looking at my friend's 05 XB12S, same bike as yours and noticed it doesn't have one. I automatically assumed it had been a reliability problem, so they eliminated it? |
Tranvk
| | Posted on Sunday, July 01, 2007 - 06:14 pm: |
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"the bike would kinda cut out, or chug a little going about 40, or 50. Just real quick..."
My 05 XB9R was doing the same thing and it turned out to be the intake manifold seal. Van |
Tincus
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 - 03:26 pm: |
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Update:
It's now July 11th, my bike is still at the dealership. That makes 20 consecutive days in the shop! What a great summer of riding. I called and got HD/Buell Customer Service involved last week. Not sure if it will help or not, they keep telling me that the Buell Tech. anf the dealership tech. are working on the issue. Supposedly all the electronics, spark, plugs, wires, etc. and fuel preasure check out.
If I was this incompetint in my job I would expect to be fired.}} |
Blake
| | Posted on Thursday, July 12, 2007 - 03:47 am: |
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What an unfortunate situation. I feel for you bro. Hang tough.
If it were me, I'd be paying the place a visit and getting all up in their business. I get suspicious when someone tells me stuff like "we've been waiting on a tool for a week." |
Tincus
| | Posted on Saturday, August 04, 2007 - 04:49 pm: |
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Today marks the 45th day in the shop.
Supposedly they have been working on the problem with Buell...but they cant fix it and have offered no solutions. In-fact, it's been pretty hard to even get a return call from the dealership and HD customer service. HD customer service continues to tell me they are working on the problem, I ask to talk to a manager, they say they cant. I asked to talk to the Buell tech. they said no one is alowed to talk to the teck.
I give up! I hired a lawyer, and he is filing a lawsuit against them under the lemon law clause. I just dont understand why a company would treat one of it's customers so ••••••. Why not replace the bike and call it good. Now they have to fight a lawsuit which will cost them a heck of a lot more if I win.
My first bike, and this is what happens.
In my mind this is more then just a bike issue, it is a poor example of how a company treats its customers.
I dont think I could ever buy another product covered by HD. I really like Buells, unfortunitly, unless it is replaced, I wont ever be ridding another one.
Just wanted to pass on my experience.
-Shane |
Court
| | Posted on Sunday, August 05, 2007 - 07:01 am: |
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I smell a rat. . . something does not add up.
Keep us posted. |
Mikej
| | Posted on Monday, August 06, 2007 - 08:44 am: |
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"They are still waiting on a tool to check the fuel preasure "
Unless the "tool" is some sort of special adapter, I would personally be concerned about a shop that works on fuel injected bikes and doesn't have a fuel pressure tester in house.
Just my opinion, hope it gets resolved for you soon - in a positive manner. |
Dnchevyman
| | Posted on Friday, August 10, 2007 - 04:20 am: |
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yea, i have a fuel psi tester in my garage, cost me a whole 29 dollars. used it 2 or 3 times on the buell to troubleshoot. sounds like a halfassed shop to me |
Wieners1
| | Posted on Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 09:09 pm: |
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shane have your issues been resolved or is your bike still in the shop?just curious,it would seem that the dealer network is very weak in people skills and oh yes diagnostics its a shame the bikes are so nice |
Saberworks
| | Posted on Saturday, September 15, 2007 - 02:59 pm: |
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For what it's worth, I had problems with my 06 and it didn't take a lawyer to get Buell to buy it back under the lemon law. I wrote them a letter explaining the situation. I made sure to include all the required information from the lemon law web site my state provides (WA). They sent some representative from Buell out to look at the bike, and within a month from my original letter, I had my money back and the bike was off my hands. |
Wieners1
| | Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2007 - 08:42 pm: |
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sounds like a familiar story if they keep buying them back how do they fix the problems? |
Saberworks
| | Posted on Friday, September 21, 2007 - 07:42 pm: |
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I'm not quite sure what you mean. I did get access to all the lemon law records for the past 3 years in the state of Washington and mine was the only Buell on there. All the manufacturers were basically even in numbers of lemon-law cases. Which indicates that the manufacturers that sell a lot have a lower rate of problems, but we already knew that.
After reading about all the improvements to the engine on the 2008, I'm seriously considering buying one. I swore I wouldn't get another Buell when I was having all my problems, but the fact that they bought it back after a single letter and a few phone calls (to Buell HQ, not the local dealer, which still sucks), it leaves me satisfied that they do indeed treat their customers reasonably.
I had similar problems as you - 06 XB12Ss, sputtering, backfiring, losing power, dieing, etc., (worse in cold and rain). Maybe the new fuel injection fixed it  |
Bodyshot1
| | Posted on Thursday, September 27, 2007 - 01:26 pm: |
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I had a similar
situation that appears to be resolved.
Long Branch HD/Buell in NJ found the breather lines were too far down the K&N filter..causing the heat sensor to activate the "safe" mode..they adjusted them, and reset my TPS..so far so good!
Good Luck.. |
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