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Xb12rdude
| | Posted on Friday, July 21, 2006 - 04:33 pm: | 
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Just because Buell doesn't add it, don't mean it's not something that would help or make the bike better. It's ALL COST, believe me, I make those decisions all day at GM. If adding a RS air scoop adds $5 per bike it probably won't happen due to cost. Especially a financially strapped sister company of HD who act's sometimes like they want nothing to do with our bikes. I'm an engineer by college and trade, trust me......you want the engine running cooler. It is correct, if the fans runs constently......that's bad, it means it's trying to keep up with cooling the engine to the desired temp. If not for temp problems, you could easily get ton's more horsepower and run at higher RPM's on this motor. HEAT is everything, sorry but the facts.
I'll continue working on keeping my engine cool and noise free. Again, thanks everyone for the great input. |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Friday, July 21, 2006 - 04:42 pm: |
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"I'm an engineer by college and trade, trust me......you want the engine running cooler. It is correct, if the fans runs constently......that's bad, it means it's trying to keep up with cooling the engine to the desired temp. If not for temp problems, you could easily get ton's more horsepower and run at higher RPM's on this motor. HEAT is everything, sorry but the facts.
"
I agree with you but not being an engineer, I cannot speak to the tech issues as you can.
Thanks |
Pupu
| | Posted on Friday, July 21, 2006 - 04:44 pm: |
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i know that in cars, to cool of an engine is not good, i would think the same goes for a motorcycle. the fan keeps in the operating temp that they want. like stated about, if the fan isnt moving, it is actually blocking air. |
Cash
| | Posted on Friday, July 21, 2006 - 07:36 pm: |
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for the last 2 days Ive been reading all the different thoughts on the fan and what-not.. And I find it very interesting how much some people are bothered by it. last night i rode home from work its 17.5 miles took me about 40 minutes in 98 degree weather. So i thought it would be interesting to see just how long the fan would go after running in those conditions. well it ran for 2min 47sec.. thats it, to me thats so minor its funny. I think the engineers at buell have build something amazing.. just as it is. jmo |
Lenb
| | Posted on Friday, July 21, 2006 - 08:16 pm: |
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"After you turn off a motorcycle, the oil begins to break down, causing potentially harmful engine damage. Unless that motorcycle is a Buell®. The thermostatically-controlled fan continues to cool the oil even after you pull the key..."
The problem is that the fan runs continuously at highway speeds. From the above blurb I don't think it was intended to cool the engine at highway speeds.
"I'm an engineer by college and trade, trust me......you want the engine running cooler. It is correct, if the fans runs constently......that's bad, it means it's trying to keep up with cooling the engine to the desired temp..."
I am also an engineer and I agree. |
Lost_in_ohio
| | Posted on Friday, July 21, 2006 - 09:56 pm: |
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Hmmmm 6 speed transmission.....the price probably 2500 bucks when and if it comes out. Ouch.
You are correct the right side duct is just another widget for a bike that can never have too many. That is what it's all about right. Make it your own.
I just finished wrapping and curing my exhaust. I will paint it tomorrow. Another 80 bucks for a whim that might look cool. Now is it gonna make the bike run at a cooler temp???????????? who cares. I took some pics of the process if anyone is interested.
Getting ready to order the left side carbon mate for my carbon right side duct. Why? Because I can. |
Xb12rdude
| | Posted on Saturday, July 22, 2006 - 12:59 am: |
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Make sure to post some pic's. I agree a 6 speed tranny would be niccce, but big bucks no doubt. Hope HD let's Buell have some big $$ and maybe it will happen. I believe the V-rod 6 speed........hummm. |
Dauphin
| | Posted on Saturday, July 22, 2006 - 03:38 am: |
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Here's a few more data points. I do a 80mi roundtrip commute with my Ulysses 3+ times a week. I've put well over 4k on it in the past 3 months.
In the early morning or late evenings when there's a moderate amount of traffic, I can do ~80mph the entire way to/from work. The fan sometimes kicks on as I slow down on the exit ramp. It will definitely kick on if I hit a stop light. Work & home are approx. .5 mi from the freeway. After parking the bike, the fan runs for another 2-3 minutes, initially super-high loud speed and then after 30-90 sec, it runs a "normal" speed. I find the loud speed of the fan annoying but because it's for a short period, I can write it off as a quirk and hope my neighbors don't complain too much.
When I'm lane-splitting in heavy traffic at ~40mph, the fan comes on and seems to stay on until I've gotten back up to speed (60+) I'm a bit on the fence. On the one hand, I'm annoyed that I can hear the fan over my ipod. On the other hand, it makes me more "visible" to the vehicles.
This past weekend, a friend and I took a ride up Pacific Coast Highway, starting at Del Mar Heights and ending up in Oceanside (about 15 mi or so). For the most part, the speed limit on the road is 25-40. There were a couple of places where we got up to 45-50 and then had to slow down. My fan came on. I apologized for it (I forgot to warn my buddy about it) and told him to expect it to go off in about 3 mins. Well, it didn't. As we crept along at 25mph, the damn fan kept running. After about 15 minutes, I got fed up and turned the bike off at the next stop light. Once I started it back up, the fan stayed off until we got up to speed (40+) and then slowed down again. It wasn't excessively hot that day (mid-80s) and there was a nice ocean breeze which was helping keeping it cool (for me at least).
The 2nd and 3rd scenarios seem to indicate that there's a problem with the bike getting overheated at lower speeds. Or it doesn't know how to cool down properly after being taken to speed. Having the fan perpetually run does not seem to be a reasonable solution for this since, as someone pointed out, it doesn't appear to be working.
And btw, using "Buell designed it that way" as an excuse for the fan's behavior is really a lameass cop-out. They also designed the headlights which seem extraordinarily weak. And the stock exhaust which a lot of people are keen to replace. And the choice of Dunlops (which you'll notice that they changed with the 2007 models). And the faulty sidestands (now recalled). And the arching rearview mirrors....and hand-guards...need I really go on? :-) Don't get me wrong, it's a great bike, which I ride almost every chance I get, but it's not perfect and therefore could stand some improvements. |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Saturday, July 22, 2006 - 09:55 am: |
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I could (and have) taken that exact ride and not have my fan come on once, even upon shut down.
I love the right side scoop.
To be fair, I have an XB9s, not a Uly. |
Prof_stack
| | Posted on Saturday, July 22, 2006 - 10:49 am: |
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Two quick questions:
(1) Does the need for the fan to come on decrease as the motor gets more miles on it?
(2) How does the type of oil (dino vs syn) affect the temperature and the need for the fan to come on?
Two comments:
(1) With 10k miles and using synthetic oil, my fan only comes on when the key is turned off, based on temps up into the 80's (I park it above that).
(2) The fan starts on high-speed and usually rather quickly changes to medium. I have no problems with Buell's system here.
'03 XB9S |
Tbowdre
| | Posted on Saturday, July 22, 2006 - 11:33 am: |
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new engines are tighter and generate more heat as they break in. once everything is broken in and working together there will be less heat generated. our bikes are air and oil cooled, synthetic oil dissipates heat better and holds its properties longer, flows better for more effective cooling... im gettin a right side scoop.... Im just bummed about not being able to get a full micron.. back to the drawing board. oh yes and i live in encinitas my fan comes on in 101 traffic but not at high speed unless im really killin it and on the gas.
800miles on an xb12r
love love love this bike... it replaced an rc51 |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Saturday, July 22, 2006 - 12:04 pm: |
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I live in Carlsbad. Surprised I don't see you on the PCH! |
Az_m2
| | Posted on Saturday, July 22, 2006 - 09:24 pm: |
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Two quick questions:
(1) Does the need for the fan to come on decrease as the motor gets more miles on it?
(2) How does the type of oil (dino vs syn) affect the temperature and the need for the fan to come on?
I've noticed no change in my fan behavior after 11k miles. Runs all the time after warm-up regardless of ambient temp. I run Syn3. |
Redstar11
| | Posted on Saturday, July 22, 2006 - 09:56 pm: |
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Our bikes are techinically just air/cooled. Oil cooled bikes like the GSXR's until 95 I believe, actually have jackets for oil to circulate around the top end.
The oil cooler on our bike is there to prevent crankcase oil from heating up too much and breaking down, not necessarily to help the bike run cooler. |
Xb12rdude
| | Posted on Saturday, July 22, 2006 - 11:45 pm: |
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You are correct, the old gixxers were oil cooled but our bikes are not. It helps some though just by cooling the oil I guess. One more week and I get my Right Side Air scoop, so my bike will TWIN air cooled. |
Prof_stack
| | Posted on Sunday, July 23, 2006 - 01:38 am: |
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"I've noticed no change in my fan behavior after 11k miles. Runs all the time after warm-up regardless of ambient temp. I run Syn3."
Interesting. What ARE the ambient temperatures where you are (Ariz?)? Seems odd that your fan would always be on, unless you ride in the desert heat with a heavy throttle. Have you tried Mobil-1? |
Lenb
| | Posted on Sunday, July 23, 2006 - 02:34 am: |
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Our bikes are techinically just air/cooled. Oil cooled bikes like the GSXR's until 95 I believe, actually have jackets for oil to circulate around the top end.
The oil cooler on our bike is there to prevent crankcase oil from heating up too much and breaking down, not necessarily to help the bike run cooler.
I don't think the GSXRs had oil jackets. I think they just had a high flow of oil through the engine, under piston oil jets to cool the pistons (like XBs) and a large oil radiator. |
Diablobrian
| | Posted on Sunday, July 23, 2006 - 02:51 am: |
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There was a sort of pool of oil in the heads of the air-oil suzukis.
There was no oil jacket on any of the gsx series of motors. |
Redstar11
| | Posted on Sunday, July 23, 2006 - 03:01 pm: |
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----
There was a sort of pool of oil in the heads of the air-oil suzukis.
There was no oil jacket on any of the gsx series of motors.
----
You are correct, taking a look at an old engine schematic, there are journals that start at the top of the head, and work their way to an oil bath underneath and around the cylinders. I guess, techinically, they aren't jackets, like in a traditional water cooled engine. |
Lost_in_ohio
| | Posted on Sunday, July 23, 2006 - 03:32 pm: |
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Here is a picture of the right side scoop on a long.
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/32777/215088.html?1153672961 |
Diablobrian
| | Posted on Sunday, July 23, 2006 - 03:46 pm: |
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redstar, I've ridden and wrenched on those motors a lot since their introduction in 86.
If you don't tweak them too much they are almost bullet-proof. There's a reason the street
fighter guys have a "thing" for them. They have the most soul of any of the Japanese motors.
I miss my old 87 gsxr750. It was a good bike. |
Teddagreek
| | Posted on Sunday, July 23, 2006 - 04:56 pm: |
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Seems a lot of people would try one if the price were right including my self...
But they run around about two bills....
Maybe some one should put together a group buy...
(Message edited by teddagreek on July 23, 2006) |
Az_m2
| | Posted on Sunday, July 23, 2006 - 08:25 pm: |
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Interesting. What ARE the ambient temperatures where you are (Ariz?)? Seems odd that your fan would always be on, unless you ride in the desert heat with a heavy throttle. Have you tried Mobil-1?
I find it odd also. Ambient temp now is very hot, but I got the same results over the winter, even mildly running in the 30's and 40's. Had the bike inspected by my dealer and they found that it was operating normally. I haven't tried Mobil1. That fan is pretty darn annoying. |
Dauphin
| | Posted on Monday, July 24, 2006 - 01:46 pm: |
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That was my first time on the PCH. I live in La Mesa and work in Carlsbad so you'll usually only see me splitting lanes up & down the 5 & 52. |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Monday, July 24, 2006 - 10:52 pm: |
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If you want to hook up sometime, send me a pm.
Thanks |
Indy_bueller
| | Posted on Monday, July 24, 2006 - 11:01 pm: |
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Az_m2 you might want to get that checked, maybe a bad temp sensor or somthing. When the temps are in the 30's and 40's, my fan doesnt run at all. |
Az_m2
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 25, 2006 - 09:05 am: |
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Pete, I have had it checked. The dealer told me it was operating normally. I may still try to take some temp readings to see how hot the cylinders are running when the fan is on. Some folks have reported fans running like mine, others much less.
dunno . . . |
Xbman
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 12:48 am: |
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I just had a fan issue of working sometimes and then at some funky speed. I finally got the dealer to find the problem and am now waiting a month for a fan. How dissapointing is that? The tech told me that the 06 has a fan issue. They have already replaced 5. I need Buell to fix this fan issue and give a fan that will last. The bike is only 6 months old. |
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