| Author | Message | ||
     Jkhawaii |
I'm running premium gas but I cant even use 1/2 throttle with out the engine sounding like it will knock itself to death timing needs to be set maybe? | ||
| Glitch |
That was one of my problems. Another was I was in 5th under 4000rpm.* The last problem was I had to have the timing done at the dealer, as I didn't have a Scan Tool. *edit-while trying to accelerate. (Message edited by glitch on November 01, 2005) | ||
| Typeone |
ah, the good ol ping question. this was my battle all summer. never figured it out even after different plugs, timing checks, TPS sets, TFI settings, dyno time you name it. I have a feeling its the nature of the beast and it bugged me to no end.... now this Fall... little to no ping at all in cooler temps. Jkhawaii... your first step is to get your static timing checked. then get comfy and do a search for 'ping' on the XB and KV boards then read all the threads you can. some of us have had a hell of a time with this issue in the 12s. | ||
| Loyal0ne |
Check voltage regulator or possible stator issue. | ||
| Jkhawaii |
it would be nice if the fuel injection system on this and most bikes were not such primitive systems. a knock sensor would be nice, maybe more than one ignition timing map ect. it would not be acceptable for a car to have such a problem | ||
| Jkhawaii |
well so far the dealer is trying to tell me that my air filter is causing the problem. I have a buell race filter in it (the new fake K&N) that I oiled but now know that it is supposed to be dry but still. the manager said the computer is compensating by leaning out the mixture.... I have had that filter in there like that for some time now that is not the problem. if it were such a air restriction the power would be down as well but it is not. Being a Automotive tech I am having a bit of a problem trusting there diagnosis. but than again I probly would have said to replace the filter first as well. I say its carbon build up and or over advanced ignition timing hope they have some guys there that can do drive ability work. depending on the anser I get I my just get the equipment I need and do my own work. | ||
| Jkhawaii |
I was hoping they had a TSB out or a common fix for this. | ||
| Jkhawaii |
makes me want water cooling  the guys with the water cooled bikes were able to use all the power from there bike right after sitting in trafic. this bike needs a better cooling fan I bet the cooling system works better with the 9s the the 12s | ||
| Blake |
If you soaked your filter in oil and it was not meant to be oil-soaked, your engine may have injested the oil and accumulated a tiny bit of carbon as a result. I think you are probably closer to finding the problem with your inclination of over-advanced ignition timing. No good reason why your XB12 shouldn't run fine in the heat. Hope you get the issues sorted out soon. Let us know what you find. | ||
| Vaneo1 |
My XB12R is an 06 and still pretty new (3,000 mi) I have read tons of the ping posts on here, and I have grown to realize that its common for the air-cooled twin. In hot weather I noticed the bike seems to do this, maybe it is due to the viscosity of the fluids get real watery an are no longer providing great anti-knocking protection. However in cold weather not a problem with pinging yes even if I open the throttle up from about 10% to 50%, perhaps it is because all lubrication has a "thicker" viscosity. IMO this is a natural on the aircooled engine, and that is one thing I miss on the old liquid-cooled I-4, the luxury of being able to take off no matter how hot the engine may be. | ||
| Jkhawaii |
I'm going to check the timing myself the dealer did not want to do it. to fixated on the filter. my thoughts on there theory of a plugged filter. pluged filter---less air more so at WOT and high rpm computer compensates with more or less fuel while cruising at low loads and rpm's so a hole the size of a penny would probly flow more than enough air during those conditions. at WOT or accelerating the restriction would cause a RICH mixture! not a lean mixture. both likely cause very noticeable power loss. so the theory of a plugged filter is not realistic at all. on top of that I looked at the filter just a few hundred miles ago and It was clean had no holes and I could blow through it just like a paper filter. right now my thinking is a) timing is over advanced b) the engine was already at the limit of pump gas with 100% clean pistons and combustion chambers, so with a little carbon build up a few more octane points will be needed during hot conditions (I was thinking about trying a few percent of 100oc unleaded race gas or ethanol) I know my dads 04 harley softail with the 88TC dose not ping even when hot. but than those engines have much lower compression and I beleve only call for 87 octane in the owners manual and he runs premium I also noticed that the TC cly temperatures run way cooler using a non contact temperature gun my engines cylinders run at 240-250 on the average and probly | ||
| Jkhawaii |
I'm not to sure about the terminology tech said the air fuel was set at 80% reset back to 100 air fuel value at 105 reset back to 100 afv from what I understand is another word for fuel trim or block learn in automotive terms I do not know what air fuel of 80% would mean is that a O2 reading and 80% means .8 volts?=rich going by the afv everything seemed ok | ||
| Blake |
As I understand it, AFV (Adaptive Fuel Value) is simply a scaling factor for the open loop mapping based upon closed loop data from the O2 sensor. So at 100% there is no change to the baseling open loop mapping. At 80% I assume the open loop fule would be 80% of the mapped values. I agree, an obstructed filter would lean the bike at high rpm and large throttle openings. At low rpm and low throttle openings it would have little effect. If it had any effect it would cause the AFV to decrease. I guess if the oil was a serious obstruction to intake airflow the guy could be right. Have heard of too many bikes with the timing a bit too advanced from the factory to not give that serious consideration. Sounds like you are close to solving the problem. | ||
| Blake |
One other much less likely issue for a new bike would be an air leak around the intake manifold seals (3 of them, one at each cyl head, one at the throttle body). | ||
| Opto |
Jkhawaii, If you're running a race ecm on the 12 that can make the pinging problem worse if you already had a pinging problem to start with. The static timing *must* be checked first - as others have stated (Glitch posted a good article on this from memory about a year or more ago). Do not be afraid to "take matters into your own hands" as you are trained and these are relatively simple motors and there is a lot of satisfaction from looking after these ones yourself. I disagree that a blocked filter would make it run lean, it should run initially rich, then normal as the O2 correction kicks in. You could try running the stock filter again to prove or disprove the dealer's claims. I have the same bike 04 12S been there done that, long story main fix was set timing, run stock ecm and best fuels. | ||
| Watrousmark |
You might just try using synthetic oil. Here in the southeast during summer it gets pretty hot, i've had that problem until i switched to syn. remember your engine is more of an oil cooled than just air cooled motor. |
