| Author | Message | ||
     Jamhamm |
ok - something strange is going on with the bike 1998 s1w noise from primary cover side - almost sounds like the dry cluth and desmo valves from a ducati and the pri. cover shouldn't be hot should it? i adjusted the chain recently - also replaced the fluid after reading all there is to do with the chain and clutch i really dont want to go in there and try to fiddle with any of that... i know the shoe needs to be replaced which i can tackle any of you tuber guys have any problem with a rattle or clatter from the primary side? if the bike is stationary - and reved up pretty good - all you hear is the sweet song of the supertrapp but out running the clatter is present in any gear at just about any speed and what's really odd there are times when i swear it goes away completely! shifting action is fine - 1 to 2 is smooth 2 to 3 is a bit clunky 3 to 4 and 4 to 5 are fine i dont like dealing with tranny issues - so this one may end up at the shop bummer cause i just got this bike - and the one thing i didnt want was to put 500 miles on it and have to fix on it oh well - let me know guys and thanks in advance -sau | ||
| Firemanjim |
Primary does get hot,not so odd. Pull that cover and replace the old style shoe,check to make sure alternator/compensator nut is not loose, and adjust primary chain properly when done. New oil fill to bottom of clutch basket--about 3/4 quart of good synthetic. | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
I just went through tensioner replacement/adjustment for the 1st time. I had checked the chain tension as described in multiple threads here. Mine either had become noisy like you describe or I had just started to tune in more to the noise, but the chain seemed to be at the prescribed 3/4". Maybe I was not pushing hard enough on the chain and it was in fact too loose, but after installing the upgraded tensioner, I adjusted it to 5/8" and replaced whatever lube was in there with 20/50 M1 v2 oil. It is now much, much quieter! | ||
| Jamhamm |
that's what im going to do before i let a shop have a go at it... im going to replace the shoe and get the good fluid in there what do you all suggest what i just used was the stock hd replacement fluid -sau | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
Do a search and you will have hours of reading various opinions! Everything from HD stuff to dino vs. synth to gear lube vs motor oil. If you are inclined to go with synth, I did extensive reading here and elsewhere and went with the above mentioned 20/50 Mobil 1, full synthetic, air-cooled v-twin, motorcycle specific motor oil in both the engine and trans. It was designed for use in both the engine and transmission. Your bike, you pick what makes sense to you.... Fair warning!~ the more you read the more confused you will be! P.S. don't forget to get the new style metal primary gasket and new shift shaft gasket! | ||
| Bluelightning |
P.S. don't forget to get the new style metal primary gasket and new shift shaft gasket! Make sure you get the newer metal gasket from HD or another reputable shop, you'll know why later if you get the paper one and it leaks on you!! As for the lube, I personally run Amsoil 20W50 in both the primary and the engine. My motor is a little hopped up, and it seems top work great in both. At least I haven't noticed any unusual extra wear marks anywhere. If you are unsure about how to the shoe replacement, make sure you have a service manual and if still confused, come back to here and ask questions. There are many "experts" here that are willing to chime in and lend a hand. | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
I personally run Amsoil 20W50 in both the primary and the engine. very, very good stuff too! In Amsoil's own report called "A Study of Motorcycle Oils"- a very detailed piece that can be found on their website, they came in 1st (no surprise) and the M1 v-twin oil I mentioned (that may be easier to find) came in a close second! | ||
| Oldog |
IMO: use factory stuff, why? shaft seal stator clutch see fsm ( I think that there is an electronic one here ) | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
Hey oldog, the M1 v-twin engine oil is safe for all of the above and I am sure the Amsoil is too. I personally agree that it is not worth the potential risk of running the gear lube. Especially since I am satisfied with how it shifts now. http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g2156.pdf The Harley Syn3 while I'm sure is still relatively good stuff, finished mid pack in the above test. I'm not saying you shouldn't run it or are harming your motor. I'm just saying that to me, there are better choices out there. Just curious- for whatever type of car you drive, do you go to the dealership to buy the factory brand of oil that came in it? | ||
| Bluelightning |
Just curious- for whatever type of car you drive, do you go to the dealership to buy the factory brand of oil that came in it? Nope, nor do I go buy the factory oil filter, air filter, or spark plugs. There are equal and even better replacements out there for less than the dealers sell!!}} | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
I personally run H-D sport-trans for the tranny and use the H-D filter. I run the factory stuff mostly because I'm lazy and the prices aren't awful. I don't have to look up an equivalent filter in a book, it's just there on the shelf by the cashier right next to the sport trans juice. I however usually run 20-50 castrol "turbo ready" because it's cheap by the case.. My X1 has always consumed a small amount of oil since day one. It makes no sence to me to pour $15 of fancy oil in it if it's going to waste it away little by little. | ||
| Sloppy |
Is that Castrol 20-50 API "C" rated -- most of the car oils I've seen have been "S" rated. After running the two in my engines, I'm a believer in the "C" oils when it's specified (like the XL engine). | ||
| Oldog |
Scott: you understand the bit with "red metals" gear lubes tend to eat stator varnish / crank seals super slipery oil may have adverse effects on the clutch operation what garantee do you have that the synthetics will not shorten the life of these items? "tested and approved mean just what?" my truck is lubricated with castrol and filters come from walmart. I change this my self, I will probably switch to amsoil as there may be a shop on the way to work that handles it, HD syn allows the valve trane to make way too much noise for my taste but it is in use now. BTW " sport trans " is reputedly hydraulic oil with some conditioners for the clutch and rubber items. the new stuff looks and smells like ATF, for the price is it worth having to deal with the agrivation of changing failed parts, other than a bad gasket and a little noise the primary area is a no problems area on my sled, like nate I go by the dealer from time to time and buy an oil filter so i get the other stuff too. We have a decent dealer here so I spend with them a little. Hey Nate you had to go into the primary not too long a go have you ever had a stator go south, or a crank seal, what happend to your clutch? Scott: the articles are provided by the makers of the oil, probably good stuff, what effect does the detergent / additive package have on, rubber, varnish, fiber and adheasives, the clutch tranny is a little different environ to work in. Like we say in the South, I was born at night BUT NOT LAST night.  (Message edited by oldog on May 25, 2006) (Message edited by oldog on May 25, 2006) | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
I still have my original stator. The last time I was in there was at about 55K to do the clutch. Previously, the crank seal went bad at about 45K and I have the shop do it. Before that, I replaced the primary gasket and the teflon shoe with the new versions. I recently had the shop do my tranny over since it was hopping out of second when I roled on the gas. They replaced second gear, third gear and a bunch of bearings (Charged me about $750 but it shifts like new now) | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
Like I said oldog, run what you like! But don't forget to put only the manufacturers oil in your truck, God only knows what harm that Castrol is doing! After all, where is the proof that it is not?  | ||
| Jersey_thunder |
any of you tuber guys have any problem with a rattle or clatter from the primary side? thats not the normal sound? SH*T JT | ||
| Oldog |
Scott: I would not put motor oil in the primary as you recomended. I have first hand knowledge of how good castrol gtx is, 1 motor cycle and one car the micrometers don't lie, nor does the compression tester. 1992 lebaron v6 fwd cyl head [ohc] every journal in the head & valve guides middle of wear limits [ all parts ] 96,000 miles 1979 gs1000e I kept records of the compression after valve adjustments from 6,000 to 58,000 miles change in compression 3 psi (loss) max varience cyl to cyl about 2 psi, yes its good oil, I would not use it in the primary. why? detergent oils are designed to prevent and remove gums carbon and varnish problems with stator, and possibly shortening clutch plate life, crank seals ( not as likely ) the primary oil I read some where was a hydraulic oil with some additives, easy on most rubbers besides if you read bottles ( I do ) the castrol is approved for use in ford autos by ford soo the folks that make the machine not the ones that make the oil say its ok theres the distinction. From the road the ol dog..... | ||
| Jamhamm |
 finally had time to pull the pri and take a look inside to see what was making all that noise.. would this be the cause of a little rattle while im rollin'? -sau | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
Looks like you can stop looking for the problem now. Lucky that the chunks didn't kill your case eh? | ||
| Patrickh |
E.J., I was just going to post that you had broken your shoe which was clattering around inside you primary, and the additional heat was most likely your primary chain grinding on the inside of your primary cover. Do you have grind marks on the upper left corner of the inside of your primary? Also, judging from the condition of your shoe I would say that your chain was adjusted too tight. Mine only shows some light wear, not deep grooves | ||
| Jamhamm |
the funny thing is... the whole unit held together until i pulled it off and there arent any grooves in the primary cover - i checked that after i saw all the pics on here the shoe has very deep grooves - so my primary was too tight [my fault] im sure the extra tension is what snapped the plate - again luckily for me the shoe itself held the plate together and didnt allow it to get out and inside my workings good stuff - now i need a spiffy rubber coated steel gaset and some other odds and ends - like that new part shoe [399-90A] so guys - amsoil in the buell? pros, cons, naked women...? -sau | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
I think that type of wear is normal. I always run mine on the loose side and it looks the same as yours. My original didn't break but the show got worn down just like yours. | ||
| Denfromphilly |
Your shoe looks like normal wear to me, I changed mine at 12K and it was not too tight and looked the same. As far as oil goes I have tried everything in my tranny. My favorites are 20W50 Mobil 1, 15W50 Mobil 1, 75W90 Mobil 1 gear lube (it has the same bad sulphur as motor Mobil 1), HD screaming synthetic, Amsoil, Royal Purple. The differences in clutch drag, noise and shifting are trivial with all these in my bike. My bike shifts hard and there is more clutch drag with dino oil. Since I replaced the spring plate with 2 steels and a friction disc I can say I detect no clutch drag whatsoever, it feels perfect. If the primary is still apart look at the shift detent and clip. They slip into contact with the clutch basket and the clip breaks and make the bike shift hard. I had to fix mine last week for the second time and went with a Baker smooth shift kit. It has 200 miles on it and after initial hard shifting it has broken into one of the most beautiful shifting bikes I have ever ridden. The clutch and tranny are actually easy to work on, you will need a few special tools. There are lots of screws and nuts but I took mine apart, tranny out, and reassembled it in a little over two hours after I had done it before. I was annoyed at having to do it again and purposefully worked fast. Write me with any questions. Den | ||
| Jamhamm |
ok so where should i order all this stuff from? i called my local hd shop - told them i needed to order some buell stuff got put on hold - and hung up on called back - suggested to the person that i just spoke with not to hang up on me again and i got put on hold again - only to be left on hold for 10 minutes [yes i counted while playing half life 2 being on speaker phone] so i called back - suggested 1, i dont want to be put on hold for ever and 2, please dont hang up on me - can i just speak to someone in parts...? sure you can - hold on sir... so after 10 minutes again [more half life 2] i got someone who didnt tell me his name - and asked what i wanted parts for my buell... *crickets* hello?! yes sir what can we do for you... what the!? parts for my fracking buell! oh - what particular parts... primary gasket, shoe etc ok - call me back at 6 and we can get that orded for you...!? what the happy hell... what are you doing now that's so friggin important you cant order parts? oh well the parts guy isnt here - im in sales - i was just covering the phon... that's when i hung up jeez anyway - where should i order all this stuff from? -sau | ||
| Denfromphilly |
DaveS at Appleton HD 920.757.1651 in Appleton Wisconsin home of the Brat and the invention of American beer. You will be treated like a guest....no bull he always has the parts I need and even with shipping they get to me 11 days sooner than the perpetual 2 week promise at my local dealer. DaveS has the gasket and adjuster, shifter shaft seal, & clutch discs, for a Baker kit and clutch compressing tool go to Drag Specialties, see Al at American Sport Bike for the primary lock up tool, (or just ask to borrow mine and then SEND EM BACK!). What all you want to do? Den |
