| Author | Message | ||
     José_Quiñones |
Bob,
Let's give them a break and wait till the final numbers are released in mid January. The numbers floating around are projections. __________________________________________________  This bike, when IT BECOMES AVAILABLE, will test Court's theory like no other bike can. It's the one I'm saving my money for.... | ||
| S320002 |
Court, DaveS (Iowa) has made some incredible advances in the promotion of Buells. When I first rode with him to the 2000 Homecoming he was more of a Harley rider and a Buell salesman. Now he is hopelessly hooked. Not only can he sell Buells in the midst of some of the flattest straightest roads in the country he can sell LOTS of them. Next time you see him ask him how Buells handle "river crossings". X1glider, Yes, the HH article is from about 1998. The worst part is they decided to build the cruiser and not the sportbike. Paul Hallam, who designed the engine, has since left the company. I don't know if the are still building bikes. When they dropped the X1R they lost my interest. If Harley truly is shopping for another bike company to buy...??? The engine technology is pretty cool. Greg | ||
| José_Quiñones |
To expand my #2 above, here is the side by side shot of the 60 and 45 degree S&S cases:  | ||
| S320002 |
José, Your welcome. It would be interesting to see HD build something like that. But like I've said before, "Don't hold your breath." Greg | ||
| Racerboy |
José...Okay, we'll wait but it will have to be one heck of a turn around, and the other thing is while share may be down, I wonder if profitability may be up...My local dealer has a 9R and a 9S and says even with the 0/0/0 for 7 deal they have not had one inquiry...And, of course they are blaming Buell...But the problem here is that they have no idea how to sell them and were basically coerced into carrying Buell and their attitude shows...Even the one mechanic who has taken Buell training is very blatant in his disgust for the Buells...This dealer has no idea how to make a profit with Buell...Unlike the above mentioned dealer in Iowa, god love him...The rest of us need to get a list of his customers are offer to trade tires with them just like we do with the Illini guys and gals... Say HI to Linda for me... See Ya! Bob | ||
| S320002 |
José, One interesting note in reference to the dragbike article that photo came from; if Feazell would listen to the guy who does his headwork he might have qualified already. Greg | ||
| Vr1203 |
Court; Have you ever tried chasing that oiled balloon ,naked? with your butt?  Now there a visual! Lets tie this whole thing this together; New guy on the block- Fischer Old news sport Vtwin(everybody making one) American sportbike Drysdale-compact V8 V8? get it? American too simple!! | ||
| Dynarider |
Quote from Lake Bueller.....They know the money is in the used Harley for $16k instead of the new (or used) Buell............. No big suprise there. How many Harleys actually ever ended up in junkyards? How many have been pieced out on E-bay because the owner couldnt find a buyer? Very few I would gather, yet I see Buell owners parting out their bikes because its more profitable than selling the whole damn bike. Buy a Harley & you have bike that is infinately rebuildable. I know people who have had their Harleys for 30-40 yrs. Some of these bikes have been thru quite a few modifications also. A dealer selling a Harley knows the new owner is gonna be back in his shop & can sell him a ton of "custom" parts that will net him more than the profit margin on any Buell. | ||
| Dynarider |
Quote from Eeeeek...My non-scientific talking out my ass assessment is that a lot of H-D owners have bought Buells, gotten a taste for sportbikes and then bought Hondas, Yamahas, Suzukis, Kawasaki's, Aprilias, Ducatis, etc. When I look at the list of Buell owners I've know over the years, I find that many of them have either sold their Buells and bought other brand superbikes or they Buell has take on the role of a secondary bike. Regardless of which, they have spend their recent money elsewhere..... Thats the group I fall into, well sort of. I have owned sportbikes in the past, had a Honda CBR600 F2 & a Suzuki Katana...not the quickest bike but still a sportbike  Anyways I bought my Harley & then a few yrs later the wife wanted to ride so I figured "what the hell, buy her a Blast" Kept that for a yr & traded it in on the X1. Biggest mistake I ever made. I think my bike is one of those "friday" bikes court mentioned earlier:P I like the looks of the bike, but compared to the power of some of my earlier rides it's dissapointing. If Buell were to put a V-rod engine or a Rotax into their new lightning, I would buy 1 in a heartbeat. But given past history, & my own accts I have absolutely no faith in the Harley based V-twin engine in a sportbike chassis. | ||
| Court |
EFFECT: My local dealer has a 9R and a 9S and says even with the 0/0/0 for 7 deal they have not had one inquiry... EFFECT of course they are blaming Buell...But the problem here is that they have no idea how to sell them and were basically coerced into carrying Buell and their attitude shows...Even the one mechanic who has taken Buell training is very blatant in his disgust for the Buells...This dealer has no idea how to make a profit with Buell... Try telling your kids they are stupid, were conceived by mistake, you don't want them and they are depriving you of all happiness in your life. Some results are so obvious as to render discussion useless. | ||
| José_Quiñones |
Wait a minute! Who is advertising the 0/0/0 deal in Cycle World, Motorcyclist and other magazines and on a bunch of Websites, including this one? Buell or the individual dealers? If people see these ads and are still not motivated to find and go to their local Buell dealer, is it the dealers fault? I'm not denying the dealer problems, they are very real, but if the advertising/financing promotions sponsored by the MANUFACTURER does not create "foot traffic" for their PRODUCT, I don't see how that would be the DEALER's fault. It's the PRODUCT........ | ||
| José_Quiñones |
Had Buell decided to offer a STANDARD AXLE TO AXLE THREE YEAR WARRANTY with no fine print instead of the 0/0/0 deal, I would bet you that there would be more "foot traffic" at the dealers. | ||
| Phillyblast |
Jose, your next vacation spot? http://go-utah.com/utah/dead-horse-point/state-park.html | ||
| Court |
>>>>If people see these ads and are still not motivated to find and go to their local Buell dealer, is it the dealers fault? Damn it's tough when we are in perfect agreement.... As I read the original post, the fellow DID get to the dealership. It was the expereience, once there, that was dissappointing. Court | ||
| Racerboy |
There's just too much to agree with here... José...I, too, think it's the product...One that appeals to a very narrow range of buyers... Court...The sales manager told me that he had not even had an inquiry on either of the XB's...But, that being said, I wonder if he has and has not been able to "sell" due to attitude, knowledge, etc...What this person has been very successful in selling is H-D's and Big Red ATV's (they're in a rural area)...John will do just about anything to avoid this dealer because of the "feeling" he gets every time he's gone there... Aside...The Iron Butt Rally kicks off next August 11 in Missoula MT...John and I are planning on being there and then touring that area of the country...If you're interested, we would welcome company... See Ya! Bob | ||
| Java |
No amount of advertising or 0/0/0 deals, or warranties will work to sell bikes. A bike is an irrational purchase to begin with. All advertising is designed to do, is get you into the showroom. I hate to hear a dealer whine about how no matter what deals Buell offers, the bikes just take-up valuable floor space. Well, no kidding. When I am drawn into the showroom by the Buell deals/ads/offers, 9 out of 10 of your sales people say "yeah isn't that deal great! Come sit on this 100th Anniversary Sportster Sport, while I tell you about it!" P.S..."different in every sense" also means "not for everybody"...if you want 1 bike that will make you the envy of every man,woman,child and domestic animal that sees it, look elsewhere. | ||
| Csg_Inc |
Man I sure am getting tired of all the negative thinkers here! Ok I can only relate the story from my own position so here goes. November 2001 I put my name on a list at my local dealership for the 9R. Then I bugged them every week till the end of the year. About mid March I went to a second dealer and started my search by April I was one his "list" So now I figured I had it covered since I was now on two "Lists" to get one. First dealer to get one in with my name on it is the winner. Since the fleet was to demo at AZ bike week I was going crazy to see one let alone ride one. Well no demo's for AZ but at least I could see a pre-production one. Mine was Shipped 4/24 and I could not be happier with it. Yes incentives, advertising would have been nice but in my case I did not care. It was the Bike that Erik built. Way to go Erik! So just go ride one... DAVE | ||
| Court |
>>>>Man I sure am getting tired of all the negative thinkers here! Think you are, what about me? I just joined the Opimist Club thinking it was some sort of "Woe is me 12-step group". I think I see why some folks have such miserable experiences with motorcycles....hell, many seem to have made it a lifestyle. aaaaaaaaaaaaarggggggggggh. Hey...aren't you a little bit biased?. . or I am the only one here who knows your background? Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh Court | ||
| Elvis |
"Man I sure am getting tired of all the negative thinkers here!" I'm beginning to find it amusing. Based on what everybody else is saying: History Channel, Popular Science, Popular Mechanics, Maxim, Cycle World etc. the XB9R and XB9S are revolutionary exciting bikes that are generating interest around the world. I haven't seen any real data indicating they are having any trouble selling them, and don't forget the Firebolt has only been around for about 6 months and the Lightning has just arrived. I can't even keep track of how many covers they've graced. With the exception of some comments from the press about the engine (and even they seem to think it's good just not great), the only negative things I've heard about the bikes come from these forums. | ||
| Uwgriz |
The simple fact is Buell is not the most well known brand out there as we all know. Some people (like myself) are actually happy about that as it makes their bike something a little more unique. These bikes don't make it into every other issue of Cycle World etc. as part of yet another 600 sport bike shootout (sure they'be been in those mags, especially lately, but then again, not nearly as many people buy bikes in Oct/Nov) or in the "big name" racing series that get shown on Speed Channel that gives Buell the visibility of some other bikes. Before anybody says anything about the racing series that Buell is involved in, remember, take the perspective of someone who doesn't follow Buells like we do. Bottom line, Buell isn't as well known as other bikes. Also, part of the uphill battle is stereotypes. If you don't know of Buell but were in the market for something a little sportier, you probably wouldn't really think to stop by your local HD shop. You'd probably go to a motorcycle "superstore" where you can see what you might perceive as most of your options only you'd never see a Buell there. The simple truth is, it's going to take work on both ends to overcome this. Is this the dealer's fault?Absolutely. Does the fact that Buell isn't as well known as say Honda the dealer's fault? Of course, not. But they do contribute. One lost sale, is one lost sale, but it's also one lost person who can be excited about that awesome new Lightning that he/she bought that won't now go help market that bike by the most effective means there is - word of mouth. My dealer had no influence on my buying a Buell. Riding my buddy's got me there on my own. As for who's fault it is that some dealers can't sell them. It falls to a certain extent on both Buell and the dealers but each pointing the finger at each other won't solve it. If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem. I tip my hat to guys like Daves and Justin for being a part of the solution and going about it full force. | ||
| Rick_A |
That Fischer doesn't really impress me. If there was something truly innovative about it I'd be excited over it. It looks like they're just sticking to proven ideas. I like Buells approach better. The V-Rod doesn't impress me either...neither would that V-Rod street tracker, if it's ever produced. What I find impressive is improving on them arcane aircooled rigs. | ||
| Court |
>>>>Riding my buddy's got me there on my own. And we're damn glad to have you! >>>>I tip my hat to guys like Daves and Justin for being a part of the solution and going about it full force You got that right. The KEY element, going forward, will be for certain powers within Buell who are currently working to improve this, to learn from the future (there have been VERY committed dealers who finally just through their hands up) and understand that in order for the marque to suceed that the entire TEAM, dealers and factory, must step off like a marching band taking the field at half-time. The hardest part of the equation, and the piece other brands would die to have, is the distribution network of dealerships. Buell, effectively has a GREAT transmission line and now needs to get the transmit and receive ends in phase and aligned. Like I've said.....I suspect their is a vigorous current initiative....I am simply getting too many calls from dealers (no shit, they call me to ask) asking if the guy from Buell is legit. Dudes name appears to be Lowry and I am liking what I am hearing. Court | ||
| Racerboy |
"Man I sure am getting tired of all the negative thinkers here!" Don't believe that I am negative regarding the XB's...I haven't ridden one but I did travel with Sam on his 9R from St Louis to Deal's Gap last summer after he had already ridden in from Kansas City...And then we watched as he carved up the TN and NC twisties constantly wearing a big grin...Sam also has an X1 that he's in no hurry to get rid of... But was he as comfy on the whole trip overall as I was on my S3T?...I think not...And that's all I'm saying that is negative is that I bemoan the fact that Buell, my American motorcycle company, no longer offers a scoot that could do a bit of both...I sold my FLTRI, a great dresser, because when I got to Sturgis, Colorado or The Smokies I was dragging anchors in every turn...So is a XB the right scoot for some?...You betcha...With the models available right now will my next bike be a R1150RT, K1200GT, ST1300 or FJR1300?...You betcha...Brand loyalty, you say or even loyalty to Erik?...My loyalties, at least as far as the cycle's I purchase are only to me...Does that mean I don't admire Erik and his body of work?...Not in the least...Does it mean that by the time I'm ready to purchase my next scoot I hope Erik will be building one for me?...You betcha... See Ya! Bob | ||
| Blacksix |
I don't agree with "Buell missed the boat..." The XB was not intended to be a Superbike. The multiple positive reviews from magazines and the overall positive consensus from owners leads me to believe that it is indeed a "super" bike. (See how I did that...that play on words...superbike...super-bike....ahem...) My M2 was quite possibly the best bike I ever owned. I kept thinking I had a lemon because no matter what I did or where I rode, the damn thing just wouldn't break. Wonderful motorcycle. I haven't bought an XB series because I feel the bike is just far too small for me. Don't get me wrong...I fit...or it fits me rather...but the damn bike feels to small with me on it. Ever see the bear riding the mini bike at the circus? I'll buy another bike this winter, Texans are lucky that way I guess, but it won't be a new Buell or it may not even be a used Buell. I've got that "track" itch I haven't had since the late 80's and I need to scratch it. Mr. B has done something really cool that very few of us will ever have the opportunity to realize. He has taken a hobby or ambition and turned it into "his job". Whether or not he enjoys it is up to him. Whether or not we enjoy the fruits of his labor is up to us. I certainly enjoyed my Buell while I had it and in retrospect...maybe I should have hung on to it. A big Thank You to him. As far as the "Fischer" goes...it's a pretty picture. Isn't it? Not sure yet. I'll keep my eye on them, as I'm sure all the enthusiasts will. Maybe, just maybe, they'll make it into production. If so, fantastic. Maybe I'll get a test ride someday and see what it does for me. Of course, I don't think Buell is done building bikes and I doubt if we've seen the best stuff on the showroom just yet. | ||
| S320002 |
"I think I see why some folks have such miserable experiences with motorcycles....hell, many seem to have made it a lifestyle." Amen brother, amen. | ||
| Kerryx1 |
Bad Weather Biker's BBS is now offering 0/0/0 !!! We offer this exiting offer to all our beloved obnoxious posers, oops, excuse me, posters. Zero time wasted aggravating true Buellers, Zero KB of computer space wasted for this URL and Zero grief for those of us that love the product and the Mystique! With a great deal like that, Buellers shouldn't ever see the likes of you again! 'Ole Baldie Cripe's, I'm old and don't have such a bitchy attitude! If I had such a personality, I'd commit suicide. If you do decide to do the latter, please use an automatic weapon with at least eight or nine rounds so you have a small chance of hitting something vital. Oops! I smell an Admin hearing coming...dammit it's worth it! | ||
| Kerryx1 |
Don't forget Pearl Harbor today. Be proud to ride your Buell! 'Nuff said! 'Ole Baldie | ||
| Nevco1 |
How to attract new customers to Buell... Let's see...radical new models, advertising, positive (yet sceptical) press reviews and financing deals are not working all that well in attracting first time Buell (not necessarily motorcycle) owners. Plus, the dealers don't know how to sell the Buell lifestyle. Hmmm...What would I do? At the dealer level, I would integrate my display of bikes at the front door even though the types would be grouped on the sales floor. I would train my entire MC sales staff on the features, benefits and lifestyle of a Buell so they can conduct an intelligent conversation with prospects in the event the Buell Specialist is either preoccupied or off that day. Then I would put a spiff on the Buells for my sales staff. In essence, I would make sure that there are at least two on the sales floor at all times that can help a Buell prospect or perhaps (God Forgive Me) try and sell one. At the manufacturing level, I would create integrated POP signage and image building ads, develop a dealer incentive program and most importantly I would get all the MC publications to do a long term test of my product. In addition, I would promote my own long range test fleet (either two guys or preferably a couple touring the country) with monthly support from the PR department that insures the articles get published. For what it's worth, the negatives of the HD and BMC products for dependability are what need to be addressed. I am still taking a ton of crap from my long term riding buddies for buying a Buell and the only way I am going to get them to change their minds is to rack on the spirited miles with them and experience equal or less failures. Hence, the emphasis for long term tests by the motojournalists. Not being privy to what promotional activities have been tried, these suggestions are just shoot from the hip basics. However, the objective is to get the market confident that buying a Buell is a wise decision. Once accomplished, the sales will be there. In conclusion, like Robert Blake's character Berretta said,"if you can't do the time, don't do the crime." In this case, it relates to having the huevos/dinero to let/get the motojournalists to do long term tests. FYI, the only long distance article I have ever seen concerning a Buell was the article about Fireman Jim in the recent Fuell. Nice article, but the target market does not see it in that medium. | ||
| José_Quiñones |
Does anybody know the real story behind the S3T that Motorcyclist had two years ago as a long term bike? Their experience was far from "seamless". I don't know if any magazines currently have an XB as a long term bike, maybe some of the English mags do. Bill, those are good suggestions, I would add the following: Buell needs to go ENDURANCE RACING with WERA, and show that they can finish these races and be competitive, then they can use it in their advertising and back it up with a THREE YEAR WARRANTY..... | ||
| José_Quiñones |
The Fischer is a little farther along than simple drawings:   They are promising to have test ride videos on their website this month..... |
