| Author | Message | ||
     Tommy_k |
Hey guys. Happy Holidays. Just the other day, I rode to a Duc/Triumph dealer with a friend so he could check out a Rocket III. I happened upon a sharp S4R. Then I saw it only stickers for about a grand more than my SS. I love the looks and riding position, and am going to schedule a test ride. I'm interested in input/opinions from anyone who's ever ridden an S4R...w/ the water-cooled, 4 valve head etc. There's a good chance it'll be sharing some garage space soon with the lightning. They're different enough to justify keeping both I think. Thanks Badweb...I hope this isn't taken as blasphemy. | ||
| Buellin_ri |
I think the sr4 is a sharp looking bike. Don't know about the reliablity of it and i am sure parts are mucho $$. | ||
| Tommy_k |
I just read about the new for 2007/June '06, S4Rs Testastretta. here: http://www.ducati.com/od/ducatinorthamerica/en/bikes/model.jhtml?model=1194 130hp and 6 speed sounds good to me. I may have to wait... TK | ||
| Eurotwins |
The SR4 is a great bike. I've owned 3 Ducatis is the last 10 years and have found them faultless including the 2000 748R i still have. The only concern is cost of parts,maintenance and repairs. The motors are very reliable if you maintain them properly but expect the sticker shock to do so. Timing belt replacement and valve adjust will set you back about $700.00....John | ||
| Schmitty |
And that's about $700 every 6000 miles. That was the one thing that scared me away from the Ducati. The parts cost and the service cost and intervals will get you. But if you want to date a supermodel expect to pay the price. | ||
| Fullpower |
I call BS on the 700 dollar timing belt. timing belts (and idler bearings) are spec'd for replacement at 12,000 miles, and are rather less than 100 bucks the pair (belts and bearings together) | ||
| Dana P. |
If ya drop a S4R you can expect almost 2 grand if ya drop the bike and ding the tank and thats just the basic black paint. Way to expensive on parts IMO. | ||
| Xbolt12 |
It's every 10,000km which equals 6,200 miles for maintenance intervals besides break-in service at 1000km (620). I don't know if they replace the belt (still waiting on my bleeping 749R service manual @$#^%#), but the price sounds about right although I think it's more like $600 here. Frankly someone needs to read Ducati the Magnus-Moss Act. They use scare tactics like warranty will be void stuff to keep the money in the shops if you ask me. Still it's probably worth just having them do the first couple of maintenance intervals until the 2 year warranty expires just to avoid a pissing contest should something go wrong. I love the Duc even so, but it is pricey. Body work is probably the most outrageously priced item at least on the superbikes, so don't ever lay it down.... | ||
| Xbolt12 |
Buell parts are surely the most inexpensive replacement from any manufacturer today (you have to love Buell for that). Ducati parts are probably one of the most expensive replacements from any manufacturer today although it does seem to vary and the painted body parts are probably the worst example. | ||
| Dana P. |
Yeah like it more expensive then HD body work. | ||
| Fullpower |
you are confusing the two very different concepts of "maintenance interval" and "Belt replacement" One checks and adjusts belt tension, if out of spec. this does not cost $700. if you expect to pay the profesionals their hourly rate for minor maintenance such as belt tension, tire mounting, oil changes, brake fluid flush, cable lubing, chain cleaning, light bulb replacements then you will find motorcycle ownership to be rather expensive on a per-mile basis. unless you are extremely wealthy or extremely clumsy, the reasonable alternative for most of us is to obtain a service manual, begin a collection of basic hand tools, and learn how to maintain your motorcycle. | ||
| Reducati |
ducati 4 valve does call for 6k service adjustment, and it is in the 600-700 arena, had a 748, and 2valve 900ss, both beautiful bikes...both had clutches go before 7000 miles, another couple hundred...and i now have 13000 on my xb12r, and the clutch is still like new...i would go with a 2valve, air cooled duck like the new models they have now, as someone earlier posted, supermodels are high maintenace....my 2cents... err $700 | ||
| Guzzimon |
The 2-valvers are a lot more forgiving. Keep the revs high -- don't lug 'em -- and you can easily go 10,000 miles between valve adjustments. All my Ducks have been 2-valvers -- and all have been most dependable (except for the Paso's Lucas electrics). Never have cared for the looks of the Monster line -- so I went with the Guzzi V11. Most happy with my choice. My Firebolt is the most fun bike I've ever owned, though. The Monster line is WAY overdue for a makeover. You might want to wait 'til that occurs to get one. You'll never hear me say a bad word about Ducati, though I agree with previous posts about the 4-valvers being a bit maintenace-intensive. | ||
| Svttodd |
On any NEW ('leftover' new ones count) 2004, 2005, or 2006 Ducati you now get your first two scheduled services for free. This makes it a little tastier. The services are really not that bad as long as your mechanic is honest. Most of the service intervals are 'checks' only not 'replace', 'rebuild', or 'repairs'. I am currently looking to get a S4R vs. a XB12s. I am hoping that Buell will update their engines for a little more power/revs soon, then I will go with the Buell. | ||
| Buellin_ri |
Buell parts are surely the most inexpensive replacement from any manufacturer today I'll second that!! I was surprised the first time I had to buy parts at the dealer. | ||
| Xbolt12 |
Yeah, the best kept secret of Buell! Thanks Erik for passing the savings on to your loyal fans! Sometimes I was actually embarrassed to order a part for the buell, like the clutch cable guide for $1.87 and the shifter rubber was about the same... | ||
| Rocketman |
And the Ducati belt replacement / valve adjustment myth continues as per normal on the BadWeB. Belt takes about 10 minutes to replace (not adj). Each valve about 15 minutes to shim. On the S4R it's easier due to better access. Any dummy home mechanic can do it. The hardest part for most is probably calculating the shim size. Wise up. Dispel the myth. Rocket | ||
| Glitch |
It's not a BadWeB myth, it's a motorcycle myth. Go on any non-Duc board and do a thread called Duc vs. whatever the board motorcycle is and that always comes up. The same way with Buell reliability on non-Buell boards. | ||
| Dbird29 |
Did DYNA re-register as Rocketman? | ||
| Brucelee |
According to the local dealer: On the S2R two valver air cooled bike, The first 6K service is about $200. The 12K service is $800. You decide what is myth vs reality. PS-the 30K service on a Porsche 911 is about $700 locally. | ||
| Reducati |
dont forget the flaking rocker arms on the ducati superbikes. on the old cowin-tech/ducati site, it was full of flaking rocker arm problems....and the myth? my visa card tells me differently | ||
| Mikej |
A local shop quoted me about $800 for the M2's 10K service. I did it myself. | ||
| Eurotwins |
Fullpower, Call yourlocal Ducati shop and ask for timing belt replacement AND valve adjust (as I posted) and see for yourself. It's not BS but FACT. They also call for timing belt replacement every 2 years if miles are lower ....John | ||
| Tommy_k |
Jeeze, I didn't realize what a can I opened. I guess nobody here has ridden one then...as those are the opinions I'm looking for. The money is not an issue, so I don't really care how much what service is at what interval. Also, this will be a second or third bike for me, so the miles will be kept at an extreme minimum. Hitting 2yrs will definitely happen before mile markers. I just liked the idea of a similar riding position and styled bike, but with a higher revving 117-130hp engine coupled to 6 gears instead of five. Also, the Final Edition I sat on is awesome looking and reported to be one of 75-100 total imported to the states. Thanks for the heads up on the cost of ownership...I'd expect it for an imported exotic! TK | ||
| Tpoppa |
Tommy_k back to your original topic. I own a XB9S and have ridden a few Monsters (not the S4R). In all of Motorcycling, the bike most similar to the XB Lightning would have to be the Ducati Monster series. They both are V-Tiwn nakeds, with similar riding positions, built for spirited back road riding. Both are exclusive enough that you won't see a bunch of squids riding the same bike. I would think that these are NOT different enough to own both. My guess would be that you would prefer one over the other, depending on your riding style. S4R will be faster in s straight line. XB's will outhandle the Monster (The design has been around for over 10 years) XB's are cheaper to maintain. Looks comes down to personal preference. I wouldn't own 2 nakeds, or 2 cruisers, or 2 sportbikes, or 2 tourers. But I would own 1 of each! | ||
| Xbolt12 |
I think the "outhandle" is pretty subjective. The Buell will probably out-corner the Ducati on tighter corners, but there is more to handling than just cornering. Most of the bike magazines favor the Ducati's handling over the XB. There is a British magazine called RPM (Real Proper Motorcycling) that just did a comparison of naked bikes. I think they were a little too judgemental of the City-x since they crashed it on some diesel fuel-which could happen on any bike. They did mention the 12R in a couple of places in a favorable light though, so I don't think they dislike Buell, I think they just don't like the light front on the S models. XB's corner great and handle really well, so don't get me wrong, I just think that handling implies many traits.... As for the flaking rockers, that was a real problem with 748's and Ducati would not help you unless a dealer did the maintenance. In fact, Ducati would replace rockers for free even after the warranty was expired on the bike if a Ducati dealer did the work. A good friend bought a used 748 a couple of years ago and it was out of warranty but only had about 3k miles on the bike. I warned him about what I had read on the Internet about rockers, so he had a local Ducati dealer service his bike (except for simple oil changes). He told me that by the time he sold the bike he was pretty sure all the rockers had been replaced at least once (18,000 miles). He incurred no extra labor or costs for that work, but was just charged the normal routine service rate. It was a '99 model purchased in 2004 BTW. This is one of the reasons I am letting the dealer do my service initially. Once I get the service manual and get more familiar, I will take over the task providing that the 749R doesn't have rocker flaking problems like the older bikes... | ||
| Rocketman |
Paying for Harley / Buell servicing is never cheap in the UK. It's just as expensive, if not more so, than paying for servicing a Ducati. Buells home market might better serve you if you pay for your maintenance, but what do I know from where I'm sat. I'd wager the dealer prices in the US for maintaining a Buell or a Ducati are pretty similar, aren't they? Rocket | ||
| Tpoppa |
I have not read an article where a Monster's handling was considered superior to the Lightning. I have read a few that have rated the Buell over the Duc, Motorcycle.com, BIKE, etc. Articles and reviews are fine, but until you actually ride a bike you won't get the true feel. I like Monsters. I've ridden quite a bit on an M900 and an M1000. I even considered buying one until I test rode an XB9S. For me, the Buell just felt more capable. It was a bit of a challenge to get the suspension dialed in on the XB (harder than on the Monster), but once I did there was no comparison. Monsters are good handling machines. The design was innovative 10 years ago. When a redesigned Monster comes out (the rumor is next year), I'll be first in line for a test ride. XB's are great handling machines with a frame that is cutting edge. The short wheelbase & mass centralization just inspire confidence. | ||
| Djkaplan |
"Buell parts are surely the most inexpensive replacement from any manufacturer today." I will also concur with this statement. I don't know how long it's going to last, though. As far as the price for service, I haven't paid any kind of garage anything since 1980 - that point is totally moot to me. I sure do like looking at that S4R. | ||
| Xlcr |
As mentioned above, shop time prices may be similar between Buell and Ducati shops in the US, unfortunately, Ducatis require more maintainance, and sooner or later you are going to need parts, and Buell parts are WAY less expensive. | ||
| Diablobrian |
I dig the 2 valve s2r more than the s4r myself. But I prefer my xb9rr to both. But that's just me. | ||
| Xbolt12 |
Yeah, I agree, the labor rates for Ducati aren't any higher. It's just that the Buell is lower maintenance and easier to do it yourself. For that reason I never had HD work on the Buell except for the warranty belt replacement. Parts prices are vastly different though. | ||
| Svttodd |
Did I mention that the first two services are FREE on any new (including leftover new ones) Ducati, that kind of shoots down the 'expensive mainenance' theory. Now, when you pay for the third and fourth service, you have actually paid half price for your services, because you got four services for the price of two. I think that the intervals are something like 600 miles (inspect/check), 1200 miles (inspect/adjust), 2400 miles (inspect/adjust), and 3600 miles (inspect/adjust/replace). Any breakdowns/premature breakage should be covered under your warranty and/or the Lemon Law, so I don't think that the modern Ducatis are that much more money maintenance wise. Now, initial cost is a different story! Both bikes are awesome, tough choice. | ||
| Grndskpr |
If ya drop a S4R you can expect almost 2 grand if ya drop the bike and ding the tank and thats just the basic black paint. Way to expensive on parts IMO. Thats the cost of a new tank, i had a body shop fix mine, and no one could tell there was a dent in it, all for 200 bucks On Buells that dont have frame sliders, if you drop the bike, you can ding the frame, i belive thats 1700 or so, and you cant fix it Whats the point, well both the 2 valve Ducati and the 2 valve Buell cost about the same to fix, both have issues, both have about the same interval for fixing, both are fun, both are great bikes, and i have owned both. I guess its a mater of how you look at things, and if you want you can always find problems with any bikes Comparing an S4R to and XB is comparing 2 different bikes, at that point it cost more to maintaine the Ducati, but it would cost more to get to 130 HP with the BUell. Its more what your looking for, not whats better, there are very very few bad bikes out there, more prferences than reality My sugestion, ride one and decide, you may be suprised, and i would still have the Ducati if i didnt drop it(please be advised that after the bike was totaled i rode it 1500 miles until the insurance company stoped by to pick it up, a cosmetic total is just that, cosmetic, the bike held up great) R | ||
| Dana P. |
No its like 1300 Roger and thats a bikes frame and gas tank all in one.I wonder what a Fuel tank plus frame costs for a S4R?? Like you said 200 at a body shop and you wouldn't know its there. How about 40 bucks for sliders and you wouldn't know it there. | ||
| Grndskpr |
Yes, very correct on the sliders, but as most who have owned a Monster also know, that the dent in the tank comes from the controls hitting the tank because of there location(not the ground), 4 bolts and a little movement or shift of the controls and it wont happen, better yet with the use of slightly wider bars, once thats in place again the controls dont hit So again, you point out that all bikes have quirks and solutions, it just a question of finding them, and deciding what your prefernce is in rides, nothing more(as a side note, this wasnt directed at you, just a simple observation from a former owner) R | ||
| Grndskpr |
Another thing to consider, parts for a Ducati get some of there price due to currecy fluxuation, same with Buell over seas. My understanding, and Rocket can clarify, is that price for Buell parts in the UK have doubled this year????? At least thats what was mentioned. I consider myself luck, but i have noticed re introduced tube frame parts have gone up significantly, but at least you can get them Buell and Ducati run similar tracks with parts, good and bad dealers. I suspect even good Ducati dealer have a harder time that good Buell dealers getting parts, But lucky for me i have a great Buell and Ducati dealer localy, so parts are never an issue for either bike Again, you could make all kinds of comparisons, but i found overall both the 2 valve Ducati and my Buells were very similar R | ||
| Vonsliek |
my girl has a m800 (s2r w/ different pipes & paint) & its a good girls bike!  my xb12r will leave it dead anytime i want .. the duc is fine for inner city, but the buell has torque & the duc can't get near that, tho for a polite, linear run, its smoother. whaddayawant?? furious tug at bars, or nibble rush .. kinda like a honking great man fart versus a long quiet girly fart .. also, duc parts are inordantly expensive (CA$3200 for a replacement gas tank) .. some cheap fixing (but they still cost) & anyone can fix the buell. but the duc feels lighter .. don't be mislead abt top speeds either .. no fairing & sit-up&-beg position makes anybike rough at speed. plus, the buell wheelies like a bastard for free! |
