| Author | Message | ||
     Andys |
Stock fork oil is 5wt. Increasing the oil weight up won't make any difference, at least is didn't on my bike. what made the difference was revalving. Anybody here get Roadracing World magazine. There is a fantastic article on the front ends of the GSX-R1000, the R1, the 954 and the ZX9 that they tested at Daytona. I went to their website (www.roadracingworld.com), but the article isn't there yet (I guess they don't want to compete with the paper issue.) It was written by Max McAllister, the owner and brains behind Traxxion Dynamics. The article went on to say that none of the above bikes had a suspension system (front or rear) that was worth anything. The Honda in particular. For some reason Honda insists on not preloading their springs and therefore the 954 had a total sag of 60mm (I had this exact problem with my friend Peter's RC51--same type of forks-natch). Unusable. It also had 15mm of stiction! Max didn't have the time at the track to resolve that one, but swears there must be something wrong. The Gixxer had garbage parts inside the beautiful forks (as compared the 750's Showa fork which he felt are "the finest production fork ever made"  , the R1 had no free sag and the Kawaker had a rear spring that could be used on a truck. All the bikes came from the factory with a "nose up" condition. Something I spoke about years ago with Buells. Bikes do not like to handle with the nose up, they will push in the corners. Sorry I can't rewrite the whole article here for I haven't the hands to do so, but if you have the magazine or have a shop that sells them, look at the May 2002 issue and turn to page 106. Absolutely facinating reading. | ||
| Peter |
Brad, I told the blokes at Technoflex what I weighed (about the same as you) and they sent me springs and oil to suit for my '00 M2. The spring rate I don't know, but they gave me 10w oil and told me to run an air gap of 130mm (just over 5" ). I noticed this was outside the range that Buell gives, but it handles very well like that. PPiA | ||
| Bluzm2 |
Peter, Thanks for the info. I think for now I'll use 5W. When I get the new springs I'll probably change both legs. I can't believe how bad the seal is leaking! I've had tons of fork seals blow on dirt bikes and other street bikes but have never had one that pee'd this much! I have to wipe it every time I ride or risk oiling the rotor. It gets changed tonight.... Thanks all.. Brad | ||
| Rookie |
I guess I could have checked all of the archives and if my computer worked properly, I could have downloaded the S.B. on the rear isolators but here goes. The rear isolators on my 99 M2 look as if they have shifted(squished). The manual doesn't really say anything about them and the diagram leads me to believe that they are there to reduce vibration. True or False? Are they load bearing? Are they a safety issue if "squished" Adam | ||
| Doncasto |
Adam: The thing to look for on the old style isolators is tearing either in the outboard section near or around the bolt or a tearing/seperation of the rubber between the frame and the swing arm. If memory serves (and sometimes the residual damage from the 70's Tequilla Wars interferes) my old isolators always looked "off center" and frequently had "scrunched up" looking rubber around the bolt. The upgraded isolator, IMHO, is a pretty good idea even if your originals are not torn in that they eliminate the inevitability of eventual failure. The change over can be done without dealer assistance but I was one of many that "lucked out" and had the upgrade done after a failure. Hope this helps and good luck! Don | ||
| Aaron |
Okay, I need some advice here from a forkin' expert (Jewish Lightning? You still out there?) I have the need to substantially lower the front end of an S2 (don't ask). Stiffer as I go lower is a good thing, too. The taper in the upper fork tubes limits the amount I can just drop'em in the triple trees. Seems like the amount I could shorten the springs is also limited, no? I mean, the way that clip arrangement works on the top, it seems to me it relies on some preload to hold it together, right? So what are my options here? Strapping'em down is complex because of the USD nature ... no fork brace or other device on the unsprung portion to latch on to. The only thing I can think of is a sleeve that acts as a top-out spacer. Seems like that might work, any problem with that I'm missing? Any other method? TIA, AW | ||
| Tims |
Can anyone give me the length of the S1 USD forks? From top to axle centre with the forks extented?? Anyone fitted, or looked into fitting, USDs off another bike to their Buell?? Hopefully I should take possession on an S1 frame soon, so want to look at fitting a late model twin disc USD front end to it. Thanks Tim | ||
| Rookie |
Don, thanks for the info but I'm still not sure about what is going to happen when they do decide to give out. I read your bio, me and my new bride just spent a few days around Colorado Springs, beautiful area. Thanks again, Adam | ||
| Doncasto |
At some point, when the isolators have begun to deteriorate, you should will probably notice increased vibration on the pegs - I seem to recall it during decelleration/accelleration especially with a passenger. Just today I heard from a very reliable local source that during a recent swing arm removal on a 1998 S3 the failed isolators (2) only became apparent after they were removed. In other words, no visable damage until they were off the bike. Don't know if this is of any more help, but keep an eye on the isolators nonetheless. Don | ||
| Kahuna |
Has anoyone lowered the rear of their X1? I would really like to bring the tail end down an inch or so. I find myself bunched up forward all the time. Are there any dis-advantages to doing that? Thanks, | ||
| Bighead |
I recently posted a question that my S1 would occasionally have a front wheel wobble at high speeds. I had recently replaced the front tire and had the fork oil/seal changed. The dealer/shop said it's just the short wheel base and sharp angle of the forks. After talking to several people it was suggested that the new front tire with a somewhat worn rear (and the other two factors) might cause it. seems to make more sense and I thought I'd share this. I intend to get a steering stabilizer and change the rear tire. Todd | ||
| Newfie_Buell |
Kahuna, How's the weather in Upper Canada these days. I will be up around there in early June and am considering riding up from Newfoundland. If you lower the rear of the X1 make sure you drop the front forks as well. If not you are changing the rake which will change the handling (I think). I am sure others here have more experience and advice on that subject. Bill | ||
| Jmartz |
BH: How fast? 80? | ||
| Bighead |
80 is about right. | ||
| Jmartz |
My S1 used to do the same at that speed. What I can suggest is to make sure there is no play in the neck or wheel bearings. Also determie if the rim's runout is within specs and that it is balanced. Finally you might want to invest in a dampener and narrower bars. That is what eventually cured mine although things always improved with a new tyre, but you already have one of those. | ||
| Newfie_Buell |
OK, Seeing its snowing here AGAIN tonight, I am gonna change the fork springs, not to mention the new shock that was went to me last thursday. The 1998 S1 now has 10,000km on the beast and do I really need to change the fork oil and if I do is there a specific type I need. I assume the forks are cartridge type so will any type of Cartridge Type fork oil do. Another thing about bleeding the air out, is it as simple as moving the damper assembly throughout the range of motion a number of times sufficient. any more advice is great. Thanks, Bill | ||
| Blake |
BH: I don't buy the dealers explanation at all. Unevenly damped forks can cause a high speed wobble. A too tightly gripped and held handlebar can also instigate unwanted oscillations. Kahuna: Lowering the rear suspension to achieve a more comfortable riding posture is like rotating your entire house to get a better view out the living room window. Try a lower more forward set of handlebars and/or a custom seat. The suspension should be setup per specifications of course. | ||
| Bighead |
Thanks for the help. This sounds like a design flaw, if so it should be addressed by the manufacturer. Though I suppose you could argue that resolving such things is as much a part of the idea I've bought into as it is the bike itself. Todd | ||
| Rookie |
Thanks Don, that's what I needed to know, the M2 rides great but like I said, the isolators looked kinda funny.Adam | ||
| Henrik |
Bill Newfie: Change the fork oil. It'll be dirty by now. I believe you'll find Andy S excellent oil weight explanation above. Yes, you get the air out by gently pumping the fork up and down a few times. You may know this, but you measure oil level with the springs out of the fork and the fork completely compressed. Traxxion dynamics have an excellent tool for compressing the fork spring. And ... now would be a good time to make sure your sag is set correctly. Henrik | ||
| Newfie_Buell |
I guess the oil is measured with the springs out as when the springs go in it displaces the oil therefore giving a false measurement. Am I correct??? My question was not answered on the type of fork (cartridge or other) and if it is a cartridge then what kind of oil to use. Oil specifically for cartridge forks or other. I dont have a big choice up here and I have 7wgt oil for cartridge forks so I hope that will work. I will also keep within the Buell specs on the measurement. Thanks Henrik but the rest would also be good. Bill | ||
| Aaron |
Many thanks to Henrik for his guidance in solving my fork lowering problem. Man have I had an education lately in how these forks work. | ||
| Newfie_Buell |
I got the shock changed but its much shorter than the old one. Hell, I got the whole kit, all new hardware, bracket for the front of the motor and everything. Does anyone know what version of shock I got, its got Showa on the adjusting res., fully enclosed with the adjustment on the rear of it.  to Buell on recognizing the problem and fixing it for free - well my labor. Next project are the springs. Thanks all who offered advice. Bill | ||
| Rick_A |
Anyone have experience with solid aluminum rear swingarm/frame isolators? My stock isolators are about shot...so I'm looking for a replacement. Since my handlebar arrangement numbs my hands after about 45 mins cruising anyway, I can handle a little extra vibration. I'm more worried about that extra vibration transmitted through the chassis breaking things. I've only heard of racers using these and am curious if anyone has used them on their streetbike. | ||
| Volbueller |
Need Help!! I need to get a WP shock rebuilt. Thanks, Scott H | ||
| Rick_A |
I was quoted $240 for a rear isolator replacement. Is this typical? I'm very tempted to do this myself. Thanks in advance! | ||
| Newfie_Buell |
Hey Rick, If you have the service manual do it yourself, I just did the fork springs (changed the fork oil too) using a combination of the manual and tips from the boys here on the BBS. If you don't have the manual then I can copy the section, scan it and e-mail it to you. Only took me a couple of hours. Thanks for all the tips guys, your knowledge is better than any dealer can supply. Bill | ||
| Aaron |
Buell will do it for you for nothing. Get the service bulletin (see top of page), underline the part where it says it's covered under warranty even for bikes beyond the factory warranty and without pre-approval from Buell, and take it to your dealer. Worked for me. Do not assume the dealers have read or understood these bulletins. That's why they are on this web site. Information is power. | ||
| Jmartz |
I have a pair of NOS older style isolators I am now ready to install in my bike. I know a new design is out now made of a harder compound sporting an ugly lip to catch the frame if it breaks that requires a new front pulley cover. Are there any pros to the new style other than safety and more vibration through the frame? | ||
| Rick_A |
From my understanding the new ones are actually supposed to last. Thanks Aaron. I also notified the dealer about that front exhaust hanger bulletin, too! My isolators are not yet torn but are fairly distorted...the bolt is starting to dig into the side...and the service bulletin clearly stated that they must be torn for warranty replacement. I guess I'll shove them aluminum stiffners in 'em and see how long they last.  |
