| Author | Message | ||
     Bluzm2 |
Another update,,, I have logged about 500+ miles since doing the chamfer mods to the middle rocker box. I still have no oil coming out of my filter. Not a single drop!! I have run the M2 pretty hard on the freeway, intentionaly a gear low to get the revs up (scientific research ya know!). Before this type of stuff always left a small puddle. Not a drop now. My breather setup is no where as sophisticated as Spuds pictured above. I have stock nipples out of the heads (I have a carbon ham can filter), right angle hose going down behind the ham can. Both lines attach to a "T", front cyl attaches to one leg, the rear to the center leg, the 3rd leg attaches to a length of hose that runs along the frame, then back up and under the tail section. A filter is attached to the end of the hose. Yeah Jose, I know it's going back up hill. This was only going to be a temporary thing. It was really going to be temporary after I started getting puke on my back tire. After the RB mods, NO drips yet. I pulled the hose off the T under the carb, no puke to speak of in the line either. I'm still going to redo the setup this winter, probably Blast RB tops but the mods to the rocker box were so simple to do I may not need to change anything. The Blast tops make all plumbing unnecessary and clean up the carb side of the motor. Brad | ||
| Davet |
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| Davet |
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| Davet |
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| Davet |
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| Davet |
I sold my Buell awhile back, but I just came across these pics, so I thought I'd post them. I made this catch can (above) with the help of some family and friends. It started as a 1 1/2" x 8" piece of aluminum pipe. I had my cousin weld end caps on it and had a friend spin it on his lathe to smooth it out. He threaded both ends, so I could put a hose barb on one end and a drain plug on the other. I drilled a vent hole in the back side of it facing the battery. I then gave it a good polish on the buffing wheel and threaded a couple of 1/4" studs for mounting. A couple of straps on the frame and it's all done! | ||
| Ara |
Davet: Nice piece of work! Some of us would argue that a filter of some sort would be beneficial, but it's a beautiful and functional piece nonetheless. Those here who are interested in the breather mod I did in early November (see photos above) might be interested in the performance of that modification to date. So far, the system is functioning as intended. The liquids go down into the clear catch tubes and the gases exhaust through the filter under the rear bodywork. No leaks, no faults, no problems. I had an additional thought: If one cut grooves in the breather fittings it would serve to increase the surface area and cool the fittings. This *might* help the liquids condense and direct them more readily downward into the catch tubes. In effect, they'd serve as solid state liquid/gas separators. Comments, anyone? Russ | ||
| Sportyeric |
On Davet's, I wonder if stuffing stainless pot scrubbing material would help baffle out the oil mist without plugging or blocking the flow. | ||
| Davet |
I never really had a problem with mist. Only a little bit around the hole. In fact I only emptied it about once every couple of months, and there usually wasn't much in there. So Eric, is this the year we see you on a Buell??? You were hard to keep up with on the Sporty, all we'd see is tailights on a Buell! | ||
| Jrock |
I have a puking breather remedy that is working well on my X1. I have the hoses joined with a "T" and the single hose routed to a mini air compressor filter mounted under the seat (I had to relocate the flasher relay). The other side of the air compressor filter is routed to a breather filter mounted in ther rear housing under and behind the ECM. The mini air compressor filter provides a screw off collecter that is clear (for visual checks) and can be drained easily. The entire setup is invisble when the seat is on and works great. Only draw back is a 2 to 3 ounce capacity due to the angle of the collector when mounted this way. I can post pics if anyone is interested. | ||
| Djkaplan |
Let's see that pic. | ||
| Sportyeric |
Davet. I thought the hole in yours was too small, restricting airflow. I think airflow is a function of engine age,ie an older engine will allow more air past the rings, so I need to concentrate on not restricting it. I'm going to re-route mine to avoid the two into one tee. I like Ara's H idea, but maybe with a puke can too. No Buell yet. One more year before the money flow improves. I'm hoping to see a VRod S3 by then.:-)(or Aprilias sold in the Great White North.)(or a low mileage S2, still my fav.) | ||
| Jima4media |
I had the rocker box holes drilled and thought that was going to fix the problem breather oil leak problem once and for all. I only got a couple of drops out of the breather hose I had set up in over 1,000 miles, until I took the bike out for a longer 400 mile trip down to Long Beach on Friday. First the shift arm broke when the screw stripped, and I had to put it in third and run it at 5,000 rpm for 120 miles. Everything was fine until I slowed down, and oil started gushing out the breather. I lost more than a quart out the breather. I didn't know how much I had lost until I got back to Modesto on Saturday afternoon. Modesto rigged up a temporary catch can, and I was back on my way. I'll have to continue to look into this problem. Jim X-2.5 | ||
| Davet |
Eric, you might be right, although the vent hole is the same size as the inlet hole. I did experience numerous oil leaks this year, that could be attributed to excess crankcase pressure, couldn't it. Something to think about, we'll see how Harvey does with it next year. | ||
| Ara |
Jim: Even considering the severe conditions under which you were running, losing more than a quart of oil out of the breaters seems entirely excessive. Has anyone experienced anything similar??? Russ | ||
| Sportyeric |
The Buellers I ride with make me run over 5000 all day. Damn 27 tooth pulleys! Belching a quart through the breathers sounds like either too much oil in the motor to begin with or a major motor problem. Sorry if I'm throwing bad joss. Davet. I didn't know the hole was that big. Same in as out seems reasonable. | ||
| Blake |
I agree with SE. If you lost a quart, chances are it didn't ALL exit via the breather. Some may have gotten burned; some may have leaked past your crank seal; some may have transwarped into another dimension... yeah that's it. That durn majical HD oil can be two places at the same time, but something must have disturbed the temporal continuum causing your oil to permanently disappear into the Buell dimension. Blake (smartyass) | ||
| Buelliedan |
You Trekkies are all a bunch of goofs!! | ||
| Jima4media |
I had the oil changed about 400 miles before the oil blow out happened and didn't leak but a drop or two before that. Additional factors - I was coming down from 30-something degree weather on top of Tejon Pass at 4100 feet into 60 something degree weather near the ocean at LAX airport. I also backed off from 80mph at 5,000 rpm to 50-60 mph in traffic. It was not leaking oil anywhere else - the oil filler cap, the transmission vent hose, or rockers. Just from the breather hose. Modesto Buell did a leak down test and it was fine there also. It hasn't puked any since then in the last 600 miles. Strange. Jim X-2.5 | ||
| Mikej |
On my cross country ride, some days I would barely use any oil, other days I'd blow almost a quart out the vents in 500 miles or so, figure mostly riding at 75-95mph in 5th gear on the freeways, and 3,000-4,000rpm on the secondary roads. I probably averaged a pint a day per 500-600 miles each day, and it was mostly blowing out the breather vents because I had just prior to the trip dropped the breather lines down to a small vent filter hanging next to the shock and the one side of the swingarm and rear shock mount were covered in oil on the high flow days. I never refilled it past the middle of the lines on the dipstick and would check the oil once or twice a day. When I get the M2 back I'll be doing the drill and countersink mods to the rocker plates. Unless I convert it to the center-tap Blast style covers. But that's all months away unless someone is heading this way from Seattle over Christmas. | ||
| Jima4media |
Thanks Mike, Glad to know I'm not the only one who has blown a quart of oil out the breathers. I used to have a theory about 90/90/90 - 90 miles at 90 miles per hour at 90 degrees - and you'd be blowing oil. Then I modified it to 80/80/80, because I'd seen that combination too. I now know that it can happen at lower ambient temperatures. Jim X-2.5 | ||
| Mikej |
Yeah Jim, I have no idea what the majic formula was that varied the blowout. I know that last Memorial Day when I rode up to Duluth I lost over half a quart, most of the time spent between 3,500-4,500rpm. The next day with more miles, but a little cooler I only lost about a cup, with the most miles between 3,000-4,000rpm. On the cross country trip it was hot most days, they all had similar freeway stretches at similar speeds. I think I lost the most oil going across South Dakota, and then again going across the west third of Montana. Going across Wyoming and Oregon I lost very little. Just one of those mysteries of life and bikes I guess. It could just be a rpm/humidity thing. | ||
| Blake |
In the voice of the warden in Cool Hand Luke... Whuht we hahyave heyer is uh failyur to separate. Can anyone say with certainty, what the heck causes the excess breather spewage? Are y'all running a good synthetic oil? Have you tried a catch can to actually verify the amount of oil escaping through the breather? Will the XB9R setup, finally, put to rest the breather spewage issue? Stay tuned... | ||
| Ara |
Blake: My '97 S3 has 22K miles on it, all but the first couple of oil changes have been with Mobil 1 15w-50. Contents of the pair of catch tubes on my bike is too watery to be oil. It appears to be moisture heavily polluted by combustion by-products rather than oil. Volume is on the order of one ounce per cylinder for every 500 miles or so. I've never needed to take the rocker covers off, but the first time that's necessary I plan on drilling out the drain holes at the least. Russ | ||
| Kevinhern |
I have a new '02 M2. I've been reading the info on this site about the breather lines, catch cans, unbrella valves, etc. I'm ready to reroute my breather lines, but I need some advise. I would like to run two separate breather lines, unfiltered, to the underside of the engine and simply let it breath (puke) out on the ground. Looking for comments, suggestions, concerns with this method. Also two other questions: Do the 2002 bikes have the "improved" rocker box gaskets from the factory? Do the 2002 bikes have the 1/8" hole at the unbrella valves to help oil drain out of the heads? Thanks for the info in advance. | ||
| Ara |
Kevin: There is an awful lot of information on the breather system archived here along with the many ways there are to try to improve on the factory design. At the very least you should go back to October of this year and read forward. The discussion has been pretty lively since then. Specifically, your initial take on a solution has several strengths and weaknesses. On the up side, you want to run your breather lines downward. That's a must, as has been fully discussed here. As liquids are involved, one cannot ignore the effects of gravity. Running your breather lines upward only serves to create a liquid "plug" in your breather system. Also on the up side is your plan to keep the two breather lines separate. Teeing them togther may be convenient, but it cuts the volumetric capacity of your breather system in half - actually less than half if you know a little about fluid dynamics. On the down side, leaving your breather lines unfiltered invites the possibility of extranious material entering the breather system. A ride in the rain or a splash through a mud puddle may produce undesirable effects. Secondly, there is the problem of running your breather lines in such a way that the fluids do not lubricate your rear tire causing a loss of control. I don't know of a way to do that, and that's why catch cans and catch tubes are employed. Lastly and perhaps unfortunately for now, you have a new bike warranty to preserve. Let me suggest that you ride your bike unaltered during the warranty period and keep a watchful eye on how much your breather system pukes during that time. You may find that you don't have a problem to solve, as different engines behave quite differently. Do your research here, and than ask any questions you like. If I can be of help, feel free to ping me off line. Russ | ||
| Kevinhern |
Thanks for the response Russ. This site will be a great help in the maintenance and enjoyment of my Buell. If I understand the system correctly with the unbrella valves, there shouldn't be any way atmospheric debris could enter the breather system. My bike is at the dealership solving a speedo failure (imagine that!). When I get it back I plan to conduct a little experiment. I'm going to put some small ballons on the end of the breather lines and start the bike. I want to see if the ballons inflate. I want to see how much sucking or blowing is going on in those breather lines. If the net result is more blowing than sucking and the breather lines are about two feet long depending on the mod, I'm thinking there isn't a need for a filter. However, I'm new to all of this Buell stuff and I'm sure you all have figured this stuff out long ago. Again, I'm glad I found this site. | ||
| Ara |
Interesting experiment, Kevin. I suggest you check at multiple rpms and rapid changes of rpms, both up and down. Share the results here, will you please? Might want to use a zip tie to keep the balloon from being sucked up into the hose. Russ | ||
| Aaron |
Kevin: The net effect of the things happening in the crankcase is positive pressure, and you're right, the umbrellas *should* prevent any momentary inflow anyway. Filters on breather lines are useful to absorb moisture and prevent drips. Until they become saturated, and then you just wash'em out. | ||
| Kevinhern |
Thanks Aaron and Ara. Has anyone tried running the breather lines, unfiltered, down and out under the engine. If so, I would like to know if the bike ever puked enough to be visible on the tire or ultimately affect traction. I understand it depends on the bike and the riding conditions but I would like to know what luck people have had with this way of breathing the engine. |
