| Author |
Message |
    
Ingemar
| | Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 03:08 am: | 
|
Never, ever, ever, will I own a Mac.
I second that. |
Mr_grumpy
| | Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 03:32 am: |
|
What I want to know is,
If I buy with a Linus will I get a security blanket?
If I buy a Mac do I get fries & a shake?
In any case I'm with Tramp, I'd rather have a lapdance than a desk drop on me!  |
Chainsaw
| | Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 04:19 am: |
|
Re-read the above posts and replace "IBM" with "Honda" and replace "Mac" with "Buell". Now you understand what us Mac users hear. More popular doesn't mean better. If it weren't for Apple, the PC you're typing on now would still be beige! now there's a worthy contribution!
How many people do you know that have had viruses crippling their computers? Always comes thru all of the holes in Microsoft's software.
I've yet to have a virus on a Mac. Ever. Did I say ever? I mean ever. I've only been on these puppies since the Apple IIe, circa 1983. Everytime a Windows machine crashes Bill Gates goes "cha-ching". He's the richest man in the world because there is a sucker born every minute, and those suckers use PC's. 
I'm on a 5 year old Mac running the latest OS (10.3) without issue. I've got 14 computers networked at work with only 2 PC's in the mix. Hell, one of those Macs is over 10 years old running system 7.6! Still networked without any issues. Compatibility is only an issue with MS Powerpoint. Between Adobe Illustrator and Photoshop we can read or work with almost any file.
That said FMJ, just remember whatever machine you buy her you will be her technical support, so choose wisely. If you do choose the dark side, please choose a Dell running Microsoft. I have stock in both! Uncle Bill Gates is writing me a check on Dec. 2nd. Gotta love a $3 a share dividend. |
Phillyblast
| | Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 06:08 am: |
|
Dooooooood you're gettin' a Dell! 
Blake, lose the hate, walk to the light
Better late than never - the Dell laptops we deploy at work are mostly reliable. Couple of battery issues, Dell was good good about sending out replacements.
The ones that see field work have held up well.
What Court said about IBM. I'm typing this on a rather ancient Thinkpad right now, and it's bombproof. The Airborne guy also carries SCSI drives and SAN parts, their tech support is excellent.
If you're running Windows in a school environment, please please please make sure to keep the virus scan software up to date, enable the built-in firewall at the very least, and get Spybot installed. School networks, in my experience, are loaded with viruses etc.
Mbsween - you beat me too it but my answer took a while to emerge . . . |
Polekat
| | Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 09:06 am: |
|
I've had MACs since they came out. The new IMAC 20 inch G5 I just bought is fantastic and is trouble free. I guess I got a good one :-)
Like windoz, the MACs had some software programs written that conflicted with other programs on the same machine. I have to use windoz at work and find the interface and ease of use inferior to my MAC. The MACs have fewer programs, but how many word processors do ya need? MACs have Excel, Word and compatibility with many other programs. Of course not all programs. |
Tramp
| | Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 10:02 am: |
|
monsieur grumpeeee-
lapdances, all around....
on me |
Josh_
| | Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 10:19 am: |
|
20% off an Inspiron Notebook at $999 or more
Your discount code is: $0QWDZDZ?2410$ |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 10:50 am: |
|
Can you hook a mac to your corporate exchange server yet? No baiting, it's an honest question I just don't know the answer for yet. What about VPN software (like the Nortel).
Personally, my big beef with the mac is the lack of the second mouse button. Annoying as heck to me. |
Polekat
| | Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 11:11 am: |
|
I've used my MAC to connected to the corporate server via phone lines and had no problem. When I told our IT people, they responded by saying they didn't know a MAC would work that way. I am not an IT person.
VPN? I'll never know if it'll work. I need the client and since the company does not support MACs, I'll never be able to get one and try it. There is VPN software for MAC OSX. |
Chainsaw
| | Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 11:20 am: |
|
from Apple.com
Mac OS X offers wide-ranging support for the network file services you need to work with others. And then some. Mac OS X can talk to every major file server protocol on every major server platform on the market today. This includes AFP, SMB/CIFS, WebDAV and NFS file services running on Mac OS X Server, AppleShare, UNIX, Linux, Novell NetWare, Windows NT and Windows 2000 servers. Mac OS X is the most compatible operating system available today.
Of course, you’d expect to be able to easily talk to any other Macintosh that you want to. You can. But Mac OS X also delivers a number of technologies that make it simple to integrate your Mac into cross-platform networks.
Symbiotic Relationship
Mac OS X Panther lets you browse Windows networks right in the Finder. Once you’re connected, these servers appear in the Finder like any other file server and provide the same functions found in Windows clients, making Mac OS X computers first-class citizens on Windows file server networks. You don’t have to install additional software on either the server or your Macintosh, making it easier to integrate your Mac into a Windows networks.
Mac OS X can also chat up UNIX NFS servers, making it the perfect network client for universities, research labs and open platform businesses.
Mac OS X supports SLP, an IP-based protocol used for dynamically discovering network services like file servers. You can use the “Connect to” command from the Go menu in the Finder to browse the available file servers on your network, provided your network administrator implements this feature.
If you need to connect to your company’s network remotely, Mac OS X has the tools you need right out of the box. Just launch the Internet Connect application and select New VPN (Virtual Private Network) Connection Window from the file menu. Enter your account and server information and you’re connected. Mac OS X Panther supports PPTP-based VPN as well as standards-based networks.
Your other question answered:
Mac OS X offers built-in support for USB mice and keyboards. With a two-button or scroll wheel mouse, you can take advantage of convenient features of the operating system without touching the keyboard. If you prefer a split ergonomic keyboard, just plug it in. You don’t need to install any additional software or configure drivers.
More info at http://www.apple.com/switch/ |
Firemanjim
| | Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 01:26 pm: |
|
Wow,almost as bad as saying "contact patch"----- |
04petes8k
| | Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 02:54 pm: |
|
I've never been so happy as when I purchased my 17" PowerBook! Mac's are so user friendly and finally NO MORE VIRUSES! I thought I'd never go mac but....Once you go mac....u never turn back! |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 09:04 pm: |
|
So is microsoft Exchange natively supported or not? Is there an up to date "outlook for mac" package? Not something that plays the same role, something that will connect to a corporate exchange server and supports its full functional interface? And I don't mean that abominiation of OWA (Outlook Web Access), that is unusable.
I realize this could sound like I am trying to feed a flame war, I am not, I really don't know and would really like the answer. |
Nedwreck
| | Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 10:46 pm: |
|
FiremanJim writ:
"Thanks for the inputs.I was leaning towards a Dell, anyway."
The tech people are in Manila. Either brush up on your Spanish or be prepared to say "What?" a lot.
The up side is, I've only had to call them once.
Bob |
Phillyblast
| | Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 10:47 pm: |
|
Reep,
Entourage, Microsoft's email client, and Mail, the native Oh-Yes-Sex email client, both have exchange compatibility. Native, not OWA.
Anyone still have a NeXt pizza box?
 |
Blake
| | Posted on Saturday, November 27, 2004 - 01:52 am: |
|
What are these "tech people" of whom you speak?
Jim, I'm with you. Time for an upgrade. Over four years on the same Dell Inspiron 5000e is enough.
Thanks for the code Josh. Can we both use it?
Do they offer an internal DVD RW in a Dell laptop?
Here's a hint to save a few hundred bucks... Order the laptop from Dell with the minimum memory and then if you want more, order it from Micron at half the price that Dell charges. At least that was the case when I bought the 5000e back in '00.
It's not "Micron" anymore though, it's now "Crucial". Here it is...
http://www.crucial.com/
Cheers,
Blake
PS: You try the Boddington's Pub Ale yet? Damn I like that stuff. |
Jima4media
| | Posted on Saturday, November 27, 2004 - 02:33 am: |
|
Jim,
I'll talk to you at the next American SportBike Night 6th anniversary meeting next month about computers. That is what I have been doing for the last 36 years.
Jim |
Mr_grumpy
| | Posted on Saturday, November 27, 2004 - 08:34 am: |
|
Tramp we'll go at Homecoming in June,
Blake beware, it's all part of the Northerners plan for world domination, once you're addicted to their beer you become their slave! Rocket is involved in this up to his armpits I'm sure of it.
I have found the antidote however, a nice drop of scotch does it for me. |
Ethanr
| | Posted on Saturday, November 27, 2004 - 09:38 am: |
|
Blake > The vast, vast, vast majority of businesses use Windows based machines. To invest your money and time into something different from what you will most likely be using professionally is silly.
To wit: The vast, vast, vast majority of motorcyclists ride Japanese-designed hardware. To invest your money & time into...
'Tis true some folks have experienced problems with Macs. I know quite a few Mac users, though, and none complain about theirs the way my colleagues do about their PCs. I've been a Mac user from the beginning and have quite literally never had any significant problems. Never reinstalled system software. Never had to wipe a hard drive. And since the advent of OS X there's simply no reason not to run a half-dozen or so high-powered apps at once. I do it all the time when editing audio and video simultaneously.
There are good reasons to buy either a (quality, name-brand) PC & a Mac. With the last couple releases of both OSs, reliability isn't really much of a factor on either side any more. Comparing your mom's G3 to the currently available Mac offerings is like some Mac nuts complaining about PC problems that existed in Win95. Downright silly. There were problems with the old MacOS architecture...that's why Apple went UNIX.
Regarding multi-button mice...at home I have a Kensington PS2 trackball hooked up through a 4-box KVM switch controlling 3 Macs and a PC. (Yes, I have a PC at home running NT, and am *very* familiar with cross-platform issues...the PC just doesn't get used much.) No problems at all with multi-button functionality. If you're using one to control just USB Macs, there are lots of options. As a power-user, single-button mice have been one of my few significant complaints with Apple. Considering that UNIX has been a 3-button environment for more than a decade, and OS X is UNIX, would it kill them to join the rest of the UNIX world and include a 3-button mouse?
It's funny...I wind up in a similar discussion when I try to convince my riding friends to try a Buell..."they're unreliable, slow,..." Fact is, unless you ride one, you won't know what you're missing. Same's true of computers. Most people who say they'd never buy a Mac have no experience at all with OS X.
If you have an Apple Store nearby, drop in. Give it a whirl. Most of the staff are fairly savvy and can show you just how easy it is to put together a slick DVD of your home videos using the included iMovie/iDVD software. Then compare that to doing the same on a PC. To get PC software that's comparable to those two apps you have to spend $300-500 apiece, which more than eats up the difference in hardware cost. Tack the cost of VirtualPC onto an iBook or iMac and you're still in the black and can run both OSs. If you still prefer an IBM or Dell laptop (they ARE high quality) you can be sure you've made a much more informed decision. |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Saturday, November 27, 2004 - 09:38 am: |
|
Thanks Philly! |
Crusty
| | Posted on Saturday, November 27, 2004 - 10:35 am: |
|
The tech people are in Manila
The times we've had to use Dell's "Award winning tech support", we talked to "techs" in India.
("click on that"
"O.K."
"No, wait; don't click on that"
"But you just told me to!"
Repeated several times in a two hour span.
That computer still doesn't work)
I don't know what kind of computer our next one will be, but I do know it won't be a Dell. |
2bbuell
| | Posted on Saturday, November 27, 2004 - 12:27 pm: |
|
Yo Wreck-
That would be Tagalog in Manila, not Spanish!! Maybe that is why there was a communication gap?
LMFAO |
Dbird29
| | Posted on Saturday, November 27, 2004 - 02:25 pm: |
|
Re: Macs
At work we run 15" Powerbooks in TV News ENG editing. Of the 15 laptops, we have had 1 repair in 13 months of use/abuse($269 repair for a damaged case). These same TV Photogs have broken every SONY DSR370 camera we have to the tune of thousands of $.
Just a data point for your decision,
DBird
p.s. I use a Dell Inspiron 600m for my work.
|
Blake
| | Posted on Saturday, November 27, 2004 - 03:18 pm: |
|
The G3 that has never worked has OS X. That was installed in hopes that it would rid the machine of its incessant crashing. It helps some, maybe a little, still crashes all the damn time, and now much of the software won't run, so we had to leave OS 9 on the machine and have to boot back and forth between the two depending which app we want to use.
I tried to play the Buell CD on the thing yesterday. It played but had a terrible intermittent skip. WTF???
I'm sorry, I've had too many years of extreme frustration with a Mac and my wife who uses one every day professionally confirms that crashes are a way of life using the G4.
I'm talking about an appliance that I must rely upon to make a living and to work with the other appliances in the business world.
I don't view my motorcycle as an appliance. Anyone who does, should probably not be riding a Buell. I view my motorcycle as recreational vehicular art. Kinda like an amusement park ride combined with sculpture and music.
Your attempt at analogy between Buell and Apple thus falls flat with me.
Call me a computer bigot. I know that there exist a LOT of Macs in the world that work very well for their owners, especially in educational and entertainment/graphic arts arenas.
I do hope that Mac continues to grow and prosper. More choices and competition are a good thing. Doesn't Microsoft own like 20% of Apple, or is it Bill Gates himself who invested in Apple some years ago?
I got some pretty slick video editing software for free with my digital camera, "MGI VideoWave III. I also understand that the new XP systems ship with movie/video editing apps as part of the system. |
Steve_mackay
| | Posted on Saturday, November 27, 2004 - 05:36 pm: |
|
Blake, I use a Dual 1GHZ G4 at home, on a daily basis. Crashes? Like OS kernal paniks? I've seen that twice. Once from a flakey HD, and another from throwing an unsupported video capture/tv tuner card in it, with some opensource drivers. That's twice in 2 years. Both hardware problems.
Personally the G3 crashing problem, Macs have some serious problems with some cheaper ram, that will indeed work in other computers.
Heck, brewcitybrag.org runs on a home built 400MHZ G4, which actually sees A LOT of access from fiends and family as a web/ftp/mp3/picture repository. The only downtime it's ever experienced is from scheduled hard drive install, and security updates. And from one little 2 1/2 year old pressing the power switch
And no Microsoft DOES NOT own 20% of apple. They have invested a small amount, but nothing like 20%.
And yes, new XP systems ship with video editing app, but it doesn't hold a candle to iMovie. Nor does XP ship with anything that burns those edited movies
I'm not a computer biggot in any way shape or form. Currently in my house, I have 2 Macs, 5 PCs(2 running XP), 1 Sun Ultra 5, and one SGI Indy.
I just prefer to use things outside of what's made in Redmond. |
Jima4media
| | Posted on Saturday, November 27, 2004 - 07:13 pm: |
|
Last year the 3rd fastest computer in the world was based on 1,100 G5 Macintoshes at Virginia Tech.
This year, the fastest computer made runs on the same processors from IBM. BlueGene/L at Lawrence Livermore Labs in California. The Mac based system dropped down to 7th this year, because there is more competition at the top.
But those are just for people who want to do heavy duty computing.
http://www.top500.org/
Jim
(Message edited by JimA4Media on November 27, 2004) |
Polekat
| | Posted on Sunday, November 28, 2004 - 10:53 am: |
|
Kernal panics on the Mac can be due to hardware and software programs. Not enough memory causes this problem, running several programs on a memory challenged MAC causes this and lots of beta software can have memory leaks that cause large amounts of memory to be taken by the programs. Keeping software updated and running proven software can keep this problem to a minimum. No computer is perfect and without problems. MACs just have fewer problems. I looked at dos years ago. I was told that I could buy a dos machine and there would be a large learning curve with it or I could buy a MAC and have the computer work for me. I chose to have technology work for me, not me work on it. |
Henrik
| | Posted on Monday, November 29, 2004 - 10:30 am: |
|
Basic maintenance (zap P-RAM + rebuild desktop on OS 9) will keep most Macs happily humming along trouble free. OS X has added permissions to the std. maintenance.
Have been using Macs for multimedia development for 14 years, and have occasional crashes with high-end video and 3D modeling/animation packages - we're talking aftermarket PCI cards, add-on break-out boxes etc. Otherwise my Macs have been super reliable and trouble free. I use Office applications regularly, and the Mac versions supposedly have a few more useful tools than the Windoze version - go figure. Only cross-platform issue I run into is, that Powerpoint on PC will not find movies inserted into presentations on Mac. The rest of my (PC only) office comes to me, when they can't get files to work on their machines - and I'm mostly able to open and fix the file for them.
That said, I've had a few more crashes with my new-ish G5s running the latest'n greatest OS X than with previous machines.
But the overall user enjoyment of Max vs. Windoze is immeasurable. Life's too short for Windoze.
Henrik
(Reep, buy an aftermarket 2-button mouse - works just fine. What kinda Techie are you, that you didn't think of that ) |
Josh_
| | Posted on Monday, November 29, 2004 - 11:22 am: |
|
>Thanks for the code Josh. Can we both use it?
I didn't so feel free. Hit the Dellf up for more coupons (see the Dell Home site)
>Do they offer an internal DVD RW in a Dell laptop?
My Dell laptop has an internal dual-layer DVD burner.
>Here's a hint to save a few hundred bucks... Order the laptop from Dell with the minimum memory and then if you want more, order it from Micron
That was the case when I bought my last system (4550) but my new one (8400) Dell memory ordered with the system was only a hair more then Crucial's site and Dell (Crucial) memory ordered from Dell's website was cheaper than from Crucial's site.
Best bet is to shop around. Dell's memory was actually cheaper than I could find no-name memory from pricewatch.com and other places.
1.5GB RAM (home system) and 1GB RAM (work laptop) rocks. |
Jarhead
| | Posted on Monday, November 29, 2004 - 11:33 am: |
|
Having been playing with PC's since my 3.25mhz Timex Sinclair(if anybody remembers those), I have seen that a lot of the OS/PC/MAC debates simply comes down to what fits an individual best and what they are used for.
MAC is the best for graphics design and easy to use, Microsoft is great for those who are used to it, and Linux is getting more popular with small businesses and even the Fed Government.
All in all, IMHO.........
 |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Monday, November 29, 2004 - 11:53 am: |
|
I knew the aftermarket 2 button mice exist, but I don't want an external pointing device, I want the one built into the laptop to work, and work right.
The "right-click -> properties" is an incredibly useful abstraction, one of the few things the windows GUI gets right, and the only reason (IMHO) Mac's still only have one button is an elitist egomanicial GUI gatekeeper, combined with a "not invented here" mindset.
I am just biased because the only Mac I have owned (though I have been using them on and off since 1986) was a Powerbook G3 - the WallStreet version. Probably the worst Mac ever foisted on the masses.
I hoped to have a nice OSX platform for experimentation, but the thing is so annoying I am (literally) going to use it to create a dedicated digital picture frame and give it to my wife's Grandma for her to hang on the wall.
Meanwhile, my Thinkpad 570, which was basically a contemporary of that Wallstreet powerbook, still gets used daily. It dual boots both XP and Linux, runs and runs and runs, and would still happily be my main work machine if they had not forced me to use a Dell.
But I have no beef with somebody who chooses a Mac. 9 out of 10 times, it will be a reasonable call. Just know getting into it that Apple has gotten away with "screw the customer" policies that would have destroyed independent hardware companies because of their exclusive control of the platform.
My Mac experience has been that when it's good, it's good, and it's good most of the time. When it's bad, it's *really* *really* bad though. |
Henrik
| | Posted on Monday, November 29, 2004 - 12:37 pm: |
|
Oops, didn't remember you wanted a 2nd button on a laptop ... my mistake, sorry.
I have had my share of Mac problems over the years, some of them bad too, but by now I have a lot of trouble shooting experience, which of course makes everything easier for me
Most really bad issues used to stem from extension incompatibilities in OS 9. In OS X ... I have no clue 
Henrik |
Steve_mackay
| | Posted on Monday, November 29, 2004 - 12:46 pm: |
|
Jarhead,
Yup, The Timex Sinclair ZX80 was my 1st PC also.
Then a Commodore 64, B128(not the more popular C128) which I ran a BBS off of(*GASP* before the internet was popular ). Atari ST520, Then a slew of IBM clones starting from an XT... |
|
