| Author | Message | ||
     Hootowl |
http://www.changingworldtech.com/home.html | ||
| Hootowl |
http://www.kantor.com/useful/thermo.shtml | ||
| Road_thing |
Interesting! Hope it doesn't put me out of work... rt | ||
| Bomber |
always a demand for burned out, ehem, experienced loons, er, persons with varied, that is, oddball, oh, dammit don't worry, Thang -- you're one of a kind -- where would they find another? | ||
| Road_thing |
How true. Individuals with my narrow range of talents, disagreeable disposition and bad habits are few and far between in the wild. As long as there's a market for one of me, I'm set! And if the market dries up, I'm preparing for a lavish retirement on Social Security and the proceeds from the sale of my Enron stock. In fact, just yesterday I spotted a promising freeway underpass with lots of room for a nice cardboard box. rt | ||
| Bomber |
come to chicago, thing . . . you'll love lower waker drive | ||
| Hootowl |
Sorry RT, I've already got that spot staked out. You can come visit anytime you want though. | ||
| Court |
Timing, Dear Thing, is everything. Arrange it so you purchase that new Frost-o-Matitic with the last paycheck and have them leave the box.  | ||
| Buellkowski |
Why wouldn't it take just as much energy (over time) to de-polymerize as it did to polymerize in the first place? Simple recycling takes enough energy to barely make it worthwhile. Maybe they plan to run the garbage trucks on biodiesel. | ||
| Road_thing |
Hoot, by the time you're ready to retire, I'll just be a fond memory. Well, a memory, anyway. rt | ||
| Road_thing |
Bomber, Chicago is north of I=10, right? I don't go north of I-10 after Labor Day. Too cold. My creaky old joints rebel. No, that's not a veiled drug reference! rt | ||
| Hootowl |
Apparently, the method they use to do it (microwave in an oxygen free environment and using the waste heat to preheat the incoming waste stream, plus a number of other efficiencies) gives them 85% efficiency. The gas released is used to run turbines to power the plant. Its sort of a recycling facility, cogeneration plant and oil refinery all in one. No new technology other than the microwave process. | ||
| Buellkowski |
Well, microwaves don't grow on trees, the waste stream still needs to be collected & transported, and the hardware built & maintained. Perhaps the internal process can be 85% efficient, but I wonder if the whole concept is half as efficient. I ought to read the relevant blogs they referred to... Like my grandfather used to say, "Recycling in MY day? You bought a bottle of beer, emptied it, took it back to the brewery, and they filled it up again. Simple." My S-10's engine is a flex-fuel mill tuned to run on F-85 fuel (85% ethanol). I've never seen the stuff on the market, but why not grow corn for F-85 instead of importing oil? | ||
| Blake |
Oil is still WAY cheaper to harvest and refine than any other alternative energy supply. That will change some day. Not sure when. Trust me, when it does change, you will see a bunch of growth and investment in the new alternate fuel processes. | ||
| Hootowl |
Read the links I posted. Current application of this technology involves building the refinery next to the waste source. They are extremely scalable and can be as large as a modern oil refinery, or fit in the back of a pickup truck. The gas produced (not the oil just the waste gas) is enough to power the plant and still have enough left over to sell to the grid. This is a natural process being artificially sped up. Its not magic. It works, and it is efficient. | ||
| M1combat |
"It works, and it is efficient." Just picking at straws here, but I would say "relatively efficient". | ||
| Brucelee |
Biodiesel Hybrids are the deal. One coming to your town soon! | ||
| Hootowl |
They are claiming 85% (BTU's in to BTU's out) | ||
| Blake |
You still gotta collect and/or pay for the raw fuel. Efficient energy wise does not mean cost effective. | ||
| Blake |
And if you are going to use turkeys for fuel, ya gotta raise and feed them too. I'd rather cook 'em and eat 'em. I need fuel too. | ||
| Hootowl |
The parts of the turkeys they are using is waste that normally would have been disposed of in a different manner, at a cost to the company. | ||
| Darthane |
Heh...sounds like "Mr. Fusion" from Back to the Future II. | ||
| Hootowl |
Nah, that ran on stale beer. (just like me) | ||
| Blake |
Hoot, You no read good. From your linked page...
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| Blake |
Maybe it is not the whole turkey, just the non-food parts, but that is not clear from the statement. Bottom line, if it were cheaper than oil, it would absolutely be exploited commercially on a wide scale. Maybe it soon will be. | ||
| Hootowl |
yeh an I can' ttype eityer. They are referring to the waste from the turkey processing plant. Blood, bones, feathers, guts etc. Perhaps I should post some more links that talk about it farther. The plant has only been in operation since April of 2003. Besides generating oil, the plant effectively disposes of the waste stream. They used to truck it to a rendering plant that makes animal feed. In Europe, it is now illegal to feed animals to animals (mad cow, hoof and mouth etc) and I think we're not too far behind them. The millions of tons of waste generated by the slaughtering business will have to go somewhere. Why not turn it into oil? | ||
| Dasbuell |
That's fine... Just as long as my XB doesn't smell like roast turkey or french fries. (formerly dasxb9s - still dieting) | ||
| Hootowl |
I have a PDF that has some good info in it, but its too big to upload. If you're interested, you can get it here... http://www.technologyreview.com search for depolymerization. Its the only hit. You have to register (free) to read it though. | ||
| Hootowl |
Here's a Discover article. http://www.discover.com/issues/jul-04/features/anything-into-oil/ | ||
| Hootowl |
This is a cut and paste from the "members only" section of Discover's site containing the original article from May referenced in the link above. http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=000332;p= You'll have to cut and paste the link... | ||
| Hootowl |
They are speculating that they will be able to produce oil for $8-$12 a barrel. It doesn't begin to keep up with demand, but hey, its a start. | ||
| Darthane |
Baby steps. It really IS Mr. Fusion. Very cool stuff. | ||
| Hootowl |
This guy has some good questions, but he sounds like a nut job. (His references to the world bank scare me a little) http://www.thermaldepolymerization.org | ||
| Blake |
The Saudis produce oil for less than $3 a barrel, and it is very high quality petroleum. What quality of oil do we get from animal waste for $12/barrel? Sounds like it could be good idea to get moving on. If it is, you can be sure the money hounds will be jumping on it. | ||
| Hootowl |
Sure, but what do they sell it to us for? The oil produced is roughly equal to diesel fuel, and is fairly pure from what I understand. I don't think that it will ever replace other sources completely, but it sure seems like a good idea. We could replace our sewage treatment plants, rendering plants etc with thermal depolymerization plants. Instead of landfilling plastic, we can turn it into fuel. I hope the technology takes off. |
