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Budo
| | Posted on Thursday, July 29, 2004 - 06:20 pm: | 
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Quote "The tires we receive from Harley-Davidson seem to us, to be a far better quality than those we have mounted in the past from other suppliers."
I want to know where HD gets these special tires. So, you are telling me that the Dunlop 207 that I get from www.compacc.com is inferor to the Dunlop 207 that you get from HD? A new Dunlop is a new Dunlop, if it is not then I need to talk to Dunlop and find out why they are distributing two different qualities of tires. If a tire is used, or a track day take off, well then that is different deal. These guys don't seem to get the concept of 'goodwill'. You can't put a price on it. Judging from Jeff's post he may never get it. Here is a hint 'f$$k off' is not goodwill toward your customer. If I had a employee like Splinter on my payroll I would loose sleep. How many customers has he run off that no one knows about. Ok, there was a miscommunication and someone screwed up. Jeff had the chance to make it right or try to and he proceeded to aleniate everyone here, along with Splinters help. And of course we will tell everyone else, just like a sewing circle. Like Splinter said, they have plenty of business and they don't need ours. This is exactly the attitude of my dealer (Bumpas HD/Buell of Memphis Tn who blows) and a large part of the reason that I don't own a Buell anymore. I have a suggestion OZ, take your gift card and give it to the first crack head you see. Tell them to go to American HD and pick out some new clothes, preferabley with the American HD name on them. Free advertising for American HD! |
Budo
| | Posted on Thursday, July 29, 2004 - 06:22 pm: |
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Almost forgot. I always take in my wheels and tires to be mounted. If I don't mount them myself. |
Jasonblue
| | Posted on Thursday, July 29, 2004 - 06:50 pm: |
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Last time I had taken the wheel off myself and took it to a Honda dealer with a tire I had purchased. No problem. |
Csg_inc
| | Posted on Thursday, July 29, 2004 - 07:00 pm: |
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Jeff thanks for posting here. I had never heard of your dealership before, but now thru Badweb I have.
As for different tires available from Dunlop I have noticed that I can not order the OEM type D207 from any other source other than a Harley-Davidson dealership. But my question is do you folks get your tires directly from HDI or from a Dunlop distributer? And in the case of the XB special version of the D207's are they only available from Dunlop to any HD dealership or only a HD/Buell dealership?
As for taking the bike in for tire changes. In the case of all my HD's yes the bikes go in but in the case of the Buell just the wheel. Different in every sence.
DAVE |
Glitch
| | Posted on Thursday, July 29, 2004 - 07:27 pm: |
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And in the case of the XB special version of the D207's are they only available from Dunlop to any HD dealership or only a HD/Buell dealership?
Only HD/Buell dealership, and they suck out loud.
IMHO of course. |
Smitty
| | Posted on Thursday, July 29, 2004 - 07:50 pm: |
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Well well well.
Another dealer I will let people know that they may not want to do buisness with.( according them they have more than enough so it wont be mised anyway)
Ozz thanks for the info about Stans I will pass that positive info along also.
I do take off my wheels to get new skins mounted . When the local dealer no longer had the factory wheel weights that mounted to the ridge in the rims center I took my buisness elsewhere. I now travel about 73 miles one way tho have this done. Mounted and spun balanced $78.00 for both. |
Crusty
| | Posted on Thursday, July 29, 2004 - 08:51 pm: |
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I mount my own tires. I take the wheels to a local Rice shop to have them spin balanced. They charged me $18.00 to balance both wheels.
I bought the tires from Chapparal for $186.00 including shipping. That totals out to $204.00 for two D220 Dunlops mounted and balanced. A local dealer wanted $178.00 for just the rear tire alone. I think I'm ahead on the deal. |
Dino
| | Posted on Thursday, July 29, 2004 - 09:27 pm: |
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Seems to be considerable confusion about OEM tires. Let me give my understanding and then perhaps someone who actually knows can chime in.
A manufacturer is producing a bike and goes to tire companies for a bid to supply a large quantity of tires for that bike. They may go to one tire co. with whom they have a relationship, they may put a bid request out to a number of companies. They may then use one tire co. to provide all the tires for that model or they may obtain tires from more than one tire co. for that model, perhaps for use in different markets. They may also negotiate with the tire co. to produce a version of a tire that is slightly different than standard, specifically for that application. The difference may be a slightly stiffer sidewall, for instance, or a slight change to the tread profile to provide a desired feel on turn-in. The difference is not related to how round the tire is or how perfectly the weight is distributed, but to the ride/handling characteristics that the tires give in that particular application.
A motorcycle considered safe to ride with any matched set of new tires with the proper construction type (radial v. bias), speed rating, and sizes. (I am talking about tires from a reputable manufacturer, not a hot pink retread.)
Ever read track comparos of super sport bikes? What is the first thing often done upon arrival at the track? They bin the OEM rubber and slip on matched sets of a single brand of sport or DOT race rubber onto all the bikes to eliminate the effect of tire differences. Then they go out and run those bikes at ten-tenths around a race track...on non-OEM rubber!...and live to write about it! Wild and crazy guys, those journalists.
edited by dino on July 29, 2004 |
Socoken
| | Posted on Thursday, July 29, 2004 - 10:55 pm: |
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the dealer is doing a fairly good job of defending himself, to a certain extent. i have not read an offer to make things up to said customer, or an apology from said employees. the dealer also used a statement to the effect of "we get special Dunlop tires that you cant get anywhere else" which set off my BS detectors. someone made the comment about installing ordered pirellis or metzlers that were purchased through the dealership, which by the "special Dunlops" comment, would be out of the question, and that an excellent point.
truth be told, most dealers cant even get tires at cost for what some tire outlets can sell them for, and that sucks, for them, and for us. and it IS fair for them to refuse to install other tires. but why hide behind "liabilities"? why not just be up front about it? or charge extra for mounting tires purchased elsewhere? i pay the extra 10-20 to save 60-70, and everyone is happy.
Oz, in an urgent need to get something done, and even though he was a repeat customer with cash in pocket, was treated with disrespect and indifference. thats just not good business, and thats not going to make anyone happy.
some of you may have read my story a couple weeks ago about having a rear tire mounted, and then spinning out on the mold release and laying down. i was not warned at all, nor was the tire ridden on for more than 20 feet or cleaned off. bottom line is, i WILL go back to them, and will spend more money there. what happened was my fault, but could have been prevented. i never bitched or complained, never pointed a finger, and still dont. could i? maybe.
the service manager was NICE and courteous to me!!!!!! he cared about my business and was happy to help me. that wins EVERY time, and that is ALL a customer can ask for. Oz didnt get his, and he has every right to spread the word. its situations like this that keep the service industry on their toes and helpful, and thats good for everyone.
Jeff,
you certainly have our attention, heres your chance to fix this. first and foremost, "splinter" needs to be fixed, should he be associated to you in any way shape or form. employees associated with said incident should apologize, not on here. Oz was the "customer" of course, and that is good business. if you offered to mount his next tire (no matter where it was purchased) for free, would be perfect, and would win a lot of customers. you did say ANYTHING. you can make this happen, you didnt get where you are by letting things like this happen in your establishment, and you should not condone them now. may i just say thank you for posting and giving the issue perspective.
just my opinion
Ken |
Ray_maines
| | Posted on Thursday, July 29, 2004 - 11:37 pm: |
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Reepicheep said: "Charge $40 for half an hour shop time to mount a tire that was not purchased from the shop. Take out overhead, and I bet the shop is lucky to make $10 on the whole deal."
Bad accounting practice sez I! If the customer had never darkened your door the overhead would still be the same. You would still have to pay rent and labor. You really can't charge "overhead" to any one job. At the end of the accounting period you can divide one thing into the other thing and find your average cost of "overhead" per job or per dollar of income, but you really can't project that into the future.
So they ONLY make $10 of net profit. Is that a crime? Isn't $10 better than $00.00? Zero is what they would have got if they hadn't mounted the customers tire. In fact, they would have lost money because the tire change guy would have been standing in the corner picking his nose AND drawing his salery.
But, as I said earlier: "This really is a Supply / Demand world and if your local HD dealer has customers lined up outside of the front door waiting patiently to get in so they can throw big bills at the cutie watching the cash register then they aren't going to change your damn tires because they just don't have to." and "I hope to live long enough to see a genuinely humble HD dealer" |
M2me
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 12:19 am: |
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Wow! For a pretty simple misunderstanding this has sure drawn a lot of opinions. I'm not surprised that a HD dealer won't mount tires that they didn't sell. It's not very profitable and they're just not interested in that business. How many of us, if we owned a HD dealership that also sold tires, would mount tires that customers brought in? I'll bet very few.
Another interesting thing about this thread is how quickly Buell owners jump on the Harley dealer bashing bandwagon. Ever heard the phrase "it takes two to tango"? Tire mounting isn't something to get all bent out of shape over! There are lots of independent shops that will do it or buy the tires from the dealer and they will happily do it. Or if you really want to save money mount them yourself.
I bring in the bike to have tires mounted. It's not a big deal!  |
Shky_jake
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 01:09 am: |
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M2me it is not about the fact that they would not mount the tire it is about the way they handled the transaction. If the dealership would have handled it a little different this thread would never have taken place. Then the dealership rep chimes in and instead of putting the fire out he added to the flames. Hence bad customer relations, and loss of business. |
R1DynaSquid
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 01:42 am: |
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Just chalk it up to yet another dealership that doesnt want a Buellers business. No big deal, tell em to kiss your @ss & support your local indy shop. |
Cj_xb
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 09:00 am: |
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shky jake, good post, exactly my thoughts !!!
CJ  |
Budo
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 09:51 am: |
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"I'm not surprised that a HD dealer won't mount tires that they didn't sell. It's not very profitable and they're just not interested in that business"
I disagree, I think it is profitable. I was talking to a indy shop owner once while he was mounting my tire. He said he could do that all day. Very profitable for he and he was happy for the business. But, even if it was a break even deal. I would think the opportunity to get a guy in the shop where he might buy accessories or even his next tire would be attractive. I might say, I dunno where you got this tire but I would like to quote you a price on your next tire. Even if I can't save you any money maybe I can mount it for free or something, because I want your business. But they have so much business they don't need any more so, mute point I guess. I think so many of us 'jumped on the dealer bashing bandwagon' because it mirrors our own experiences. |
Budo
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 09:58 am: |
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So in comparison. There is a Vicotory dealer here. I stopped in and taked to them. Nice guys really want to increase their business. The owner offers a tire mounting balance discount to our club. So on a Fri I walked in with tires and wheels. Opps the owner says his tire guy is at the cycle show with their display could I wait until Sat. Not really I say, not a big deal I will do something else. Just a sec he says. He got on the phone and had the tire guy leave the show and come to the shop just to mount and balance my tires. This was on the guys lunch break. This is FRS powersports in Memphis Tn. But, that is just the difference between a dealer who wants and needs your business and one who does not. |
Cj_xb
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 11:40 am: |
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But they have so much business they don't need any more so,
That point keeps popping up doesn't it ??!!
If I was an owner, that's NOT a comment I'd EVER make, but guess they are doing better than normal !!
CJ |
M2me
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 12:39 pm: |
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Here's the point I was trying to make: None of us were there for the phone conversation or the conversation at the shop. I just think a lot of people are reading too much into this. It started out as a misunderstanding over whether a customer could bring in a wheel and tire and have the tire mounted. Oz was in a hurry and got frustrated about wasting time over this misunderstanding. Then people are saying they would never do business with this dealership, they're all a bunch of crooks who don't need or deserve our business. What?!?
I can understand why a HD dealer would not want to mount third party tires. That's not the business model they operate under. An independent shop would be a better choice. Lots of businesses choose the type of jobs they accept. It doesn't mean they are bad businesses. I'm not real sold on the "liability" explanation though.
I agree that the communication could of been handled better but I wasn't there so I can't say for sure what was said or how it was said. American_HD said that the conversation was different than what Oz said. Maybe that's true, maybe it isn't. |
Cj_xb
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 01:11 pm: |
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Wasn't basing my thoughts on what happened there, but on the posts here from the dealer, just wasn't much impressed !!
No big deal, I see your point too m2me, just seems their posts rubbed several the wrong way !!
CJ |
Glitch
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 01:19 pm: |
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I'm with CJ.
I looked at OZ's original post more like a rant, or vent. I just chalked it up to a miscommunication that could have been handled better.
It was the post by the owner and employees of American HD that would keep me from visiting said dealership if I was in the area. |
Wyckedflesh
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 01:21 pm: |
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None of us were there for the phone conversation or the conversation at the shop
It wasn't, OZ went into the dealership on Monday in person and brought everything back on Tuesday. That is why I keep asking if the policy of only mounting tires they sold is posted. |
Buellishxx
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 01:35 pm: |
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I buy my tires from Blackfoot Honda in Calgary, and can get OEM Harley / buell tires for %70 of the price that the harley shop charges. Blackfoot says they charge $10 over cost (who knows), but it's still a great deal. Both my local Harley dealers will mount balance and repack bearings, at about $65(cdn both tires). It's still a big savings. |
Loki
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 02:31 pm: |
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Dino,
You hit the nail on the head!
A manufactuer specs out a tire for the intended end product. Sometimes that tire IS NOT the same tire you buy from a wholesaler or other shop.
This for cars but; I know of a place that WILL NOT mount/balance a tire not purchased through them or is not a size spec'd for the vehicle. So if your car had only P205/75R15 on it and no other tire options. That is all they will mount on said car.
It is frustrating when you need a tire and The Shop wants to rake you over the coals for a tire.
I know I can mail order a set of Sportecs for just over what a shop quoted me for just the rear. I can justify -in my mind- paying $25 more locally. I can not stomach $80 more a single tire and then $40 to mount and balance it(off the bike).
as a side note: It is nice to see specific shop policies posted when you walk into the place. That prevents alot of misunderstandings and ill will. |
Wyckedflesh
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 02:51 pm: |
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The couple of shops I have walked into that have that sign posted...don't charge for mounting or balancing the tire, as they put it, its already in the price of the tire. If its still on the bike, the do charge shop rate for the time to take them off and put them back on the bike. |
Shky_jake
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 05:40 pm: |
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M2me I see and understand your post but like cj I was looking at the way the shop posted and what was said. Take it that what someone types and says is not always the same, things like body and voice tone mean a lot when dealing with the public but you can still chose your words carefully. The have a policy not to mount 3rd party tires and that is fine but we all just do not buy tires. So our money is now going to another shop. If I was close to said shop I would avoid it all cost if possible. But that is me and I come from customer service line of work. |
M2me
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 07:57 pm: |
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OK, I'll admit it. I didn't read all the posts carefully enough. I even thought Oz first called the dealer on the phone. 
If you have a guy standing in the shop talking about tire mounting it should be common sense to mention your policy of only mounting tires that you sell. If somebody calls on the phone I can see where that might be skipped. It shouldn't be skipped, but it's more likely to be over the phone.
I also didn't read American_HD's responses very carefully (I won't bother to comment on this Splinter person). You people are right. Instead of defending and explaining the policy, American_HD should have just said, "Sorry about the misunderstanding about our tire mounting policy. We should have made that clear. Hope you got your tire mounted and have a fun and safe trip!"
Nuff said! |
Budo
| | Posted on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 09:05 pm: |
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I think that we all chimed in because so many of have had a bad experience with our dealer, unless it is just me. Within two miles of my local dealer there are three independant HD shops. One even has a HD factory trained mech and they claim they can do warranty work. Now either there is so much business the official dealer can't handle it all and it over flows to the other shops or they have crummy customer service. It is of course the latter from my experience. HD dealerships are a unique thing in the motorcycle dealer world. As always YMMV |
Ezblast
| | Posted on Saturday, July 31, 2004 - 03:18 am: |
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Personally I would never bother the dealer here in SF for such a thing - there is a great local independent (KC Eng.) that has specialized in tires here forever - costs a Buell owner about 70 to mount and balance both and they will have or order and have it for you in a quick time and you know your getting a good deal to boot (I go through a set every 2000 to 3000 plus miles) - at least compared to the dealer mark up. Some things it just doesn't pay to have a dealer do, it doesn't make them a bad dealer, though customer awareness is sadly lacking in this incident.
GT - JBOTDS! EZ |
Newfie_buell
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 03, 2004 - 09:57 am: |
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Ozz's Inferiot NON-APPROVED HD Tire is alive and well!!!!
 |
Newfie_buell
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 03, 2004 - 09:57 am: |
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Ozz's Inferior NON-APPROVED HD Tire is alive and well!!!!
Please DO NOT look closely at his clutch hand!!! |
Budo
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 17, 2004 - 05:13 pm: |
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So what is it about the HD culture that promotes this kinda of treatment? |
Blake
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 18, 2004 - 01:29 am: |
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Just like spoiled children. They don't know any better and don't care. |
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