| Author |
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Ratbuell
| | Posted on Sunday, October 14, 2012 - 01:05 pm: | 
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I've run an SS2R on late M2's, and there was one on my S1W when I bought the bike. All thunderstorm motors.
Swapping to a Buell race header and muffler (which is a 2.5" to 2.5" "swap") gave each bike a TON of midrange that wasn't there before. And once I jetted everything properly for the race cans...wow. Different motorcycle.
The V&H likes to fall apart - aluminum bodies break off the rear 'shoe' mount; CF bodies either tear the stainless mount or just blow apart the CF, even when mounted properly. I don't like the sound, I don't like the 'performance', and I don't like the fragile nature. Don't get me wrong, V&H is a good company and make good pipes for other bikes...but they went cheap on the tubers.
I've also had great luck, as mentioned above, with the IDS Supertrapp (at the time it was a Buell-branded slip-on upgrade).
but the articles I read said the V&H was just about perfect for the early engines
That would be NON-thunderstorm. Your M2 has thunderstorm heads and torquey cams. The earlier "lightning" motors didn't breathe nearly as well as a thunderstorm motor, so didn't "need" a good exhaust quite like a thunderstorm does. |
Littlebuggles
| | Posted on Sunday, October 14, 2012 - 04:41 pm: |
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Rod,
Muffler shops weld all day, every day. They work with different materials depending on what exhaust a customer wants. Unless they are a high end specialty shop you are likely to get the best price from them as well.
SLHD would most likely farm your work out or have one of their speed shop guys do it, they do a lot of other work and are probably not as proficient with what you need as a muffler shop would be. I like the guys at SLHD, but it is my opinion that you would probably better work from the muffler shop, especially if they are coming with high recommendations. |
Littlebuggles
| | Posted on Sunday, October 14, 2012 - 05:39 pm: |
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Joe,
I respectfully disagree. I know you were up to your eyeballs in Buell working at a dealership for some time, and I know you ride, a lot. Your advice carries significant weight. So I took the time to consult my materials to verify what I thought I knew, I'll quote some of it momentarily. Did you read the articles, specifically the one titled Pipe Dreams by Kip Woodring (Winter 1996 print)?
The scanned pages pertaining to this conversation are 17-21 of Funjimmy's Photobucket articles. Page 22 is another article by Mr. Woodring regarding why the the aftermarket performed so differently from 98 to the 99 model years where there was such a significant difference in how useful (or not) the V&H proved itself between those model year series'.
In my experience with mufflers I was previously in the same house as you regarding the V&H, I was not impressed with the way it performed on my Thunderstorm motored Y2K M2, there was a noticeable drop in midrange going to it from the White Brother's pipe I had to get off my bike.
Rodrick is running a 98 S1 (not W) so his bike doesn't have the Thunderstorm motor. His bike also runs a 2" collector, not the 2.5" that came along with that years T-storm motors.
According to the 98 marketing materials the Thunderstorm was on the S1W, S3 and the S3T. The S1 did have the Lightning cams, giving it 91 hp at the crank, the M2 was rated at 83 hp, the eight hp difference due to the sportster cams. The materials don't specifically mention cams but we know this is how the difference was accomplished with the early stock Buell motor.
"Powertrain
All Buells are endowed with a 1203cc V-Twin engine, but the power characteristics of each model are slightly different. The M2 Cyclone has the strongest midrange power. The S1 Lighting tenderizes the meat of its horsepower band at 4000 rpm, pulling hard to the rev limiter. The S1 White Lighting and S3/S3T Thunderbolts get their 101hp from the Thunderstorm engine and really start striking at 3000rpm through red line. All models have a rev limiter standard at about 6200 rpm, but "short shifting" these bikes really makes them fun to ride. On a Buell, you'll find the flat, broad power curve forgiving. Downshifting through curves to maintain peak power is usually unnecessary."
The 1998 model year brochure is one of my favorites, I love the bikes, pictures and information in that model year line-up's marketing. |
Coxster
| | Posted on Sunday, October 14, 2012 - 08:50 pm: |
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My broken V&H mount. Grateful for a fellow tuber selling it to me at a great price
Follow the set for the whole repair:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/14445024@N04/sets/72157631771573676/ |
Ratbuell
| | Posted on Monday, October 15, 2012 - 08:01 am: |
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Littlebuggles - unless I'm reading your post incorrectly...it appears you are saying the same thing I did.
Regardless - I don't ride articles. I ride Buells. I know how to tune them properly for whatever intake and exhaust they're wearing and to get the best performance out of a given setup. I don't like the SS2R, for reasons I stated above. And unless I'm reading it wrong, it seems your quote on "Powertrain" is describing a stock set of motors...and discussing the difference between the three (Lightning, Thunderstorm, and M2).
And Coxster's photo is a perfect example of one of the reasons I so dislike the pipe. |
Blks1l
| | Posted on Monday, October 15, 2012 - 09:37 am: |
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The picture showing the damaged rear mount, did it have the correct mounting hardware used? It seems odd for it to be damaged like that if it was using the original mount link that goes in that channel. |
Ratbuell
| | Posted on Monday, October 15, 2012 - 08:21 pm: |
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I've seen (and owned) SS2R's that were properly installed, with proper hardware...that did just that.
There's a reason the factory mufflers use a horizontal bolt through vertical holes, instead of vertical bolts through horizontal holes. There's just too much movement fore-and-aft and up-and-down...and as a note, the breakage on the CF versions isn't around the (vertical) bolt holes, but normally a tear in the strap itself due to being too thin. But those vertical holes hold up fine. Hmm. |
Ft_bstrd
| | Posted on Monday, October 15, 2012 - 08:26 pm: |
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I dumped parts of the SS2R "attached" to my M2 all over northern GA.
Giant piece of crap.
Still have the end cap hanging on the wall in my garage. |
Coxster
| | Posted on Tuesday, October 16, 2012 - 10:21 pm: |
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my home-built mod that fits the Z bracket almost perfectly:
reinforced with aluminum and stainless inside and out |
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