| Author | Message | ||
     Buckley |
Hey guys. I finally sold an old engine that was sitting around in my garage so I have $800 of fun money. Figured I could put this to too use on my bike. Right now the bike has an aftermarket exhaust, airbox, and a soon to be installed A/F monitor. I was thinking about doing an engine upgrade next. Any suggestions on what to buy? I saw a link for a 1200 to 1250cc conversion kit. Will this make a notable difference in performance? http://www.nrhsperformance.com/ekitbuell1200.shtml I was looking for a 1200cc to 1400cc kit but couldn't find any information regarding this online. Plus I have a feeling this might be out of my price range (~$800). The bike is a 00' M2 Cyclone (Message edited by Buckley on August 07, 2012) | ||
| Jayvee |
No dyno charts I can find that compare 1201 to 1250 as the only change. They all have other stuff installed, to get 124 rwhp. You mention engine mods done, but how about suspension? Good shock installed? Gold Valve and/or new springs in the fork? Some other things may be limiting how fast you go besides the engine. But absolutely that kit is 'on my list'. | ||
| Cyclonecharlie |
Get a set of bolt-in cams...X1 cams work good. with a little change left over for a racing ECM to go with the cams. | ||
| Buckley |
Hmm I was considering new cams. How do the X1 cams differ? Do they just have a longer lift period? As for the racing ECM, my bike is carburated. In regards to suspension I actually just got a brand new rear shock. Any aftermarket ones seemed to run around $1000 haha. Have yet to check the suspension in the forks tho. | ||
| Jim2 |
I'd get a nice Corbin or Select seat if you don't already have one. Sorry, that wasn't really in line with your question. X1 cams move the torque up into a higher rpm region, right? M2 uses stock Sportster cams which produce more torque at lower rpm regions. That's how I've read it here but a nice detailed explanation from someone who knows would be great. | ||
| Buell_bert |
Even the carbed versions have an ECM. | ||
| Buckley |
I wonder if you would have to increase the timing then for those cams? If they're meant to increase the rpms I would assume that their radius is smaller (so that the lobes hit more frequently as the crank turns). Im curious as to if this would effect your engine wear and engine temp. I thought about getting a new seat but my stock seat has survived 5 hour rides without causing any aches. I'll have to check out the carbureted ECM then. How does that work? Sorry for all the questions. Just curious as to how I can get the best bang for my buck. | ||
| Wreaster27 |
I have a race ecu on my 2001 cyclone. All it really does is advance your timing a bit so it backfires at low rpms and takes out the electronically controlled redline. Its a bit faster and I get 62 MPG highway with jets and a borla exhaust. I like the sportster cams because you don't have to wind it up to get power, which is one of the main reasons I got a cyclone. | ||
| Buckley |
Wreaster, what kind of cams do you have in your bike? From posts I have been reading in other forums it seems like the X1 cams take away low end power, but give you more top end power. Looks like this ECM compliments that by altering your timing a bit and raising your rev limiter? So CharlieCyclone hit the nail right on the head in suggesting that :P. | ||
| Wreaster27 |
I've got the stock cams.... 90% sure though. Seems to come on between 3 to 4 grand... so they feel stock. If you change cams make sure you check your pinion gear too while you've got her apart. The stock ones are known to wear down and break apart, causing pretty serious chaos. I'm changing mine out right now at 18,000 miles even though it wasn't worn too bad... just to be safe. If you change your ecu to a race one ill be interested in buying your stock one. | ||
| Buckley |
I'm tempted to go with the X1 cams and ECM, but I did stumble upon this post: http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/384 2/10398.html?1059591514 Seems to indicate that the ECM makes little difference. If I do wind up going with those changes tho I will be sure to check the pinion gear. Might as well while I have it apart. | ||
| Wreaster27 |
You will need a special tool to get the gear off. Don't buy one, just borrow mine. I go to northeast Missouri on a regular basis to see family and I can meet you somewhere if you would like. | ||
| Buckley |
Sounds like a plan to me. I"ll have to do my homework and research what parts / gaskets I need for this job and let you know. | ||
| Dave_02_1200 |
I would get a Penske shock. | ||
| Buckley |
Hmm just found an aftermarket carb that is supposed to fit our bikes. I don't believe the claims that you can achieve 25% more hp, but I like the idea of being able to adjust the slow / idle jets without taking the carb off of the bike. Anyone have any experience with these? Can you adjust the main needle height with these too? http://www.power-barn.com/servlet/the-675/MIKUNI-H SR42-HSR45-HSR48/Detail | ||
| Cyclonecharlie |
Not a bad price for the kit....I wouldn't go larger than 42....I have one on mine and I like it.If you can find the screaming eagle 44 intake for your motor it works even better. | ||
| Buckley |
Hmm so a 42 is good for an aftermarket exhaust and airbox? Wasn't sure if I should get the 42 or 45 (the 48 seems to be for modded heads) Are there any adapters I need or is it pretty much plug on play with the cables and intake I have now? | ||
| Cyclonecharlie |
As long as you get the 42-11 kit (for Buells) you should be good. I didn't buy a kit,so I'm not positive. You don't have the motor for a larger carb., it will just hurt your bottom end torque. | ||
| Jayvee |
The jetting isn't changed often, once 'right' for the components installed, its done. Mikuni would be my last step, in a sequence of: big bore, heads, cams, carb. And then where's the low-end torque? Should have just bought an X1 or a Thunderbolt. I like the CV because it is less 'direct'. When I go over a bumpy road (every day) the bumps pass before the carb has a chance to respond to my jostled throttle hand. $300 for a carb is a lot. For this 'Fun Money' one dull thing you might consider is a lift. I recently got the EZ-Rizer Red lift, and it is way worth the money. Wish I'd gotten it years ago. Another capital-intensive idea would be a No-Mar(Cycle-Hill) Tire Changer. That's an investment that could pay for itself. Don't let the money burn a hole in your pocket, I've already had my M2 for 7 years this December, seems like yesterday... | ||
| Cyclonecharlie |
Sam, In the scheme of things, $8oo doesn't go real far. And everything guys have suggested are good.You just have to pick something that will go along with what you eventually want to end up with.And enjoy the experience. I've had my cyclone for 12 yrs. and I still change stuff almost every month.Trying different things is part of the fun.I have two tanks,three tail sections and seven seats(all different)right now it has an S1 tail and seat,next month who knows. I never get tired of it because I keep swapping things around.Same goes for carbs. and exhausts,have several. It's what keeps it interesting for me. So pick something, enjoy it and don't second guess what you got.  | ||
| Lakes |
I like the CV carb too, i just put a Screamin eagle cv44 manifold on & Bobby wood rebel 43.5 carb, performs good, only used this as i had it already, used to use it on my twin cam dyna, always got good gas mileage on long runs, only gained 2HP over a stock cv44 on my twin cam, but carb made motor run so smooth. the M2 runs nice with it too. Charlie i feel the heads are more important than the cams you use. the stock oo m2 heads do not have a swish in the chamber. if you found someone that knows i would getports cleaned up and a good flowing valve job,i saw a guy out here in Australia weld the chamber and machine a different style chamber, then deck the barrels to bring the stock pistons up in the bore & with tuning got a 25HP plus a good torque increase with stock cams, they also tried just head clean up with stock chamber and SE cams but that combination could not come close to the other combination and bike ran without pinging on pump gas was fun too. i've watched a guy change cams 5 times on a harley motor then dyno, all the cam change did was move were HP & Tq came in but did not increase HP & in some cases narrows the rev range you have HP & TQ to use. i test road a number of Buells when they were new & always had more fun on Cyclone that had Carbon AC 2.5" pipe & sports muff & the low gearing and Lightning ignition module. always remembered the test ride on that Buell | ||
| Cyclonecharlie |
Lakes, I agree with everything your saying, but the guy only has $800 and to flow heads that's just a down payment.And unless his mechanical skills are high,the labor rate to install the stuff is expensive also.Not that many of us can use what we have and if he wants to go fast, use the money on tires and track days. I had a CV44 on my bike and it worked really good, just wanted to try something else.So found a good deal on a damaged Mikuni 42 HSR, fixed it and I really like the throttle response. Whatever he chooses to do with the money,he should feel or see a difference in his investment....that's what makes it fun. | ||
| Lakes |
Charlie, my mistake i was not taking the $800 limit into account. & your right i don't need anymore power. i been spending some money on setting my bike up got a steering damper & fitted & done the front forks. next i'm putting the later gear shift linkage. i like the feel of the bike with the steering damper. that could be a good thing to do if not already done. | ||
| Jayvee |
Hammper Perf, and NHRS both offer basic head porting starting about $550. Probably more places do too. Start local, of course. | ||
| Lakes |
I would say the most noticible gain with thunderstorm heads would be to weld chamber & machine a swish , but would have to cut valve releaf, & valve seats hone bore & if pistons check out add new rings. but i don't have any idea of the price. i have an engineer friend that has a set of XB heads he has been doing flow testing and trying different valve sizes to see what works the best, he just takes his time, its for his own Buell. i'll be interested to see what he finds think he is just going to stick with stock XB cams & upgrade the pipes & order custom JE pistons. machine out his stock TB. but when he comes to the track he will find out just how hard it is to use that power! & how important the bike set up & how well you know your bike, when you have them set up and used to the set up its much easier to ride fast, change something and you have to start all over again. |
