| Author | Message | ||
     Sstlouisjak |
My bike was shifting fine last time I rode it, but I had to take my primary cover off to replace the started gasket and noticed that the shifter shaft had a lot of play in it and the plate had signs of being rubbed by the big gear the started engaged to start the motor. Everything seems to be in tack, but the shifter shaft has a lot of play in it, and the wear marks have me worried. Is this normal? Thanks | ||
| Sstlouisjak |
 This isn't a very good picture, but you can see the wear on the shifter shaft plate arm. | ||
| Jim2 |
Your right, it's not a very good picture  | ||
| Jim2 |
 Like these marks? | ||
| Jim2 |
 | ||
| Jim2 |
I assumed that my marks were caused by my bearing problem as evident in the first picture. You may want to check that. The bearing problem was probably caused by running with the primary chain too tight. This is a well know problem as the factory service manual has the adjustment wrong (too tight). Oh, and also compounded by running without primary fluid because the starter was loose. I thought the oil everywhere was coming from the valve cover gaskets because there was oil everywhere from the valve cover gaskets. It never occurred to me that it was also primary fluid. You say you had to replace the starter gasket. Did you run it low on primary fluid for awhile? (Message edited by jim2 on November 06, 2011) | ||
| Sstlouisjak |
Thank You Jim... Yes, the marks are very similar to the ones you have shown. What you are telling me then, is the shifter shaft play is normal, but I probably need new bearings ? I have been running the primary chain to the specs in the manual. What is the right setting for the primary chain ? In answer to your question if I ran it low on fluid for awhile I'd have to say that the right amount came out when I drained it,but Id added some to it awhile back so it might have been low for awhile and I didn't realize it. | ||
| Jim2 |
I think that the shift shaft play seems excessive because the primary cover is off and there is nothing holding the outside of the shaft in place with the cover off. With the cover on, it should be held firmly in place. I can't say if you need new bearings, I was just sharing what happened to me. You would need to pull the rotor/sprocket, clutch-shell/sprocket, timing chain to see the bearing. When I did that I could feel movement in the main shaft. The primary chain specs in the manual are wrong!! The primary chain should be adjusted to +/- 3/4 inch travel at the tight spot. Badweb user Buellistic has been providing people with a good writeup, "primary adjustment 101". I'm sure I could find it and forward you a copy. I don't really think my primary fluid was ever dry either. I also had a bad main oil seal and I'd keep adding engine oil that was being forced into the primary which would then spit out the back and also the loose starter. I also had a fried clutch spring pack that was causing an off balance situation that also may have contributed to the clutch/shell sprocket rubbing the shift shaft. It's hard to say what problem was causing what. I had a fried clutch spring pack, bad main oil seal, leaking starter seal, and fried transmission shaft bearing. All at once!!! It's all been fixed for thousands of miles now with no problems. You also need to check to see if you have the updated primary chain tensioner. Some of the 2000 M2's had the updated one and some did not. The new one is much thicker. The old one is known to fail. I've seen pictures on here of both side by side for comparison. If your in there you should check and replace if necessary. You may also want to replace your clutch spring plate with one fiber and two steel plates instead. You don't need the spring plate anyway and it will fail at some point. | ||
| Sstlouisjak |
Thank You Jim for the information. I agree with you on the shaft being loose while the cover is off, that sounds logical. I'm wondering why the wear on the arm behind the biggest sprocket is evident. I guess the only way to find out if I need new bear or not is to get down to it and see. I do have some play in the sprockets, but it don't seem like the shaft is moving any. The primary chain is still on it and I can move it in and out about an 1/8 inch or so. My primary chain tensioner seems to be in good shape. I'll see if I can get a better picture this time. I've tried and tried to get a better picture of the wear marks I'm talking about, but the one I have posted is the best I've got as far as showing the wear without taking the sprockets off...  | ||
| Sstlouisjak |
This is the best I could do far as another picture of the wear marks.  | ||
| Jim2 |
It looks like you have the updated chain tensioner. The metal plate looks like the thicker one. No problem there. If I were you, I'd go ahead an pull the sprockets and check the bearing. How much metal was on the primary drain plug when you pulled it? Were there any chunks of anything. I supposed pieces of debris could get between the sprocket and the shift shaft and cause the marks. I had chunks of torn up bearing spaces all over the compartment. To pull the sprockets you need a 1 1/8" socket for the main nut which is standard threads (the front one that covers the stator). You need a locking bar (door hinge works) I used a cut down electric edger blade. I can get you the dimensions if you want. You also need a 32mm nut (I believe that is correct) for the rear clutch hub sprocket WHICH IS REVERSE THREADS. I used deep wells for both but I think that only one needs to be a deep well. The 32mm size isn't the true size but the closest to the true size in metric. The English unit size is difficult to find. You will need a very big torque wrench to put it back together. The main nut should have Red Locktight applied and I have the torque value somewhere (it's a high torque value). The torque value and Locktight are critical as you don't want this nut coming of when your riding. That would be very bad for both you and the bike. The magnets for the stator will make it seem like the front sprocket is not going to come off. It takes a hefty pull to remove it. (Message edited by jim2 on November 08, 2011) | ||
| Sstlouisjak |
Awesome Jim Thanks... I noticed the drain plug was full of small metal shavings when I took it out, but no chunks where on it...I seen no other signs of any debris other then the marks on the shifter shaft arm behind the large sprocket. Everything looks pretty clean in there... Will I need to pull both sprocket or just the back one ? Thanks... | ||
| Jim2 |
You must pull both; you won't have enough play to get the back on off byitself. If you look around here you'll find pictures of the locking bar in place. I mentioned you'll need a big torque wrench (to 250 ft/lbs. or more) to get it off (edit; I mean to get it on). You'll want to use a long stout breaker bar to get it off. The longer the better. Support the bike well so you don't dump it. You may need a helper. Don't forget the clutch hub is reversed threads. The front sprocket is standard threads. Take pictures along the way so you have reference to put back together. Do you have the Factory Service Manual? If not, you really should get one. Parts book too. Like many have said here, there will come a time when you can't get them anymore. (Message edited by jim2 on November 06, 2011) (Message edited by jim2 on November 08, 2011) | ||
| Captainkirk |
Your problem very well could (also) be loose pins in the shift drum. The detent plate rocks, the c-clip flexes, cracks and falls off twenty miles from the middle of nowhere. This has happened to me twice. The detent plate should NOT rock side to side with finger pressure; check it before proceeding. You're gonna have to change the detent plate anyhow (around $7.00)If you find this to be the case, apply red LocTite to the pins and tap them back in with a pin punch until the plate sits flush. Install a NEW c-clip ($.50) Then count your lucky stars. | ||
| Sstlouisjak |
Thank You both for the information. Here is a link to a little video I did showing what its doing. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfocvswUVxc | ||
| Captainkirk |
You need to pull the primary and clutch basket for further inspection. Follow the FSM instructions. Remember; the clutch basket nut threads are LEFT HAND THREADS. | ||
| Jim2 |
Thanks Captainkirk for pointing out that the clutch basket nut threads are LEFT HAND THREADS. I had in incorrect in my previous post. I've corrected my previous post after double checking in the FSM. Sstlousjak, I hope I didn't mess you or anyone else up on that! Get the Factory Service Manual and follow it. | ||
| Sstlouisjak |
Thank You Both...You've been a big help. I'm trying to round things up I need to dig into her deeper. I will let you know how things are going as they progress... Thanks Again ! | ||
| 93jrh |
Those marks are there from the factory. there is nothing rubbing. |
