| Author | Message | ||
     Desertfox |
Because I was too dumb to look up in-depth directions for rear isolator replacement, I messed with my tie-bars in the front. I believe the lower tie bar was adjusted to the point that I could turn the central adjusting nut by hand (meaning no pressure). The upper was not adjusted much, if at all. The rear tie bar is exactly as it was. Did I mess it up by doing this? On the one hand, the work I did made the bike far more stable. On the other hand, it looks like adjusting tie-bars would affect the alignment of the rear wheel (I could be wrong, but that's what I'm seeing). Is there a proper way to adjust it if I messed it up? | ||
| Oldog |
yep you messed up those are do not adjust parts, some one will need to take that one off and measure it, and send you the center to center distance you will have to reset to that distance, I believe that they are all the same.. ouch! | ||
| Desertfox |
daaang...  | ||
| Fuzzz |
I have a set of tie bars from a bike that was "rednecked", I'll try to get to them today and measure eye to eye. | ||
| Desertfox |
Thanks fuzz! You rock. Yeah, I just need the front two measured, just so you know. | ||
| Fuzzz |
Well, I've got good news and not so good news.... For reference, the bars in the picture are arranged Front Lower, Top, and Rear. I measured between the flats on the eyelets on the set pictured,(With the bolt holes at different angles, it was hard to find a baseline to measure from) and the tie bars on my "spare" Cyclone, and the front lower one on my daily ride, and got different readings...top # is set in pic, 2nd # is set on track bike, 3rd # is off my daily M2. That's a fair amount of difference, so I'd guess you'll have to devise an accurate device to measure vehicle alignment and use these figures as a starting point. Hope this helps.  | ||
| Desertfox |
I can probably get away with averaging the numbers, honestly. I might *groan* take it to a dealership and see if they can finalize the alignment... | ||
| Akbuell |
Ouch!!! Would seem to be a serious error. Sec 3.4 of my '01 X-1 service manual has a caution: "Do not adjust tie bar assemblies. Tie bar tension is set at the factory..." Might be time to contact EB and find out what the procedure is.... | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
They must have had a jig to hold the front and rear just right. You can just imagine how badly it would affect the handling if the front and rear weren't pointed in the same direction! | ||
| Oldog |
fuzz can you get the eye to eye length for Fox? and any guess at position? | ||
| Fuzzz |
All I have is a dial caliper, and trying to get an accurate eye to eye number is difficult, to say the least. My best guess would be to make sure the rear wheel is aligned in the swingarm properly, install tie rods, then adjust the center till the flat to flat measurement is within .10 or so of the #'s I found, then use a straight edge attached to the rear wheel and check front wheel alignment. Then I would recommend using a laser level or plumb line to verify the vertical alignment of both wheels. HOWEVER...I am not an engineer, so take this a helpful suggestion, not gospel! | ||
| Gunut75 |
Fuzzz, measure the distance from inside of the holes, then outsides of the holes, then subtract the hole diameter. That will give you center to center within a few thousandths. I would get the procedure first though, as the length can vary per bike. | ||
| Jos51700 |
You need to set this by wheel alignment. The front wheel needs to be aligned with the rear in both dimensions. On FLT Harleys, we used to do this with really long, really straight aluminum tubing and a variety of levels. It was a PITA. However, when the rear tire is wider than the front, this becomes more of a major hassle (you strap the bar or tubing to the rear tire, and then measure the distance from the tubing at BOTH the front and rear of the front wheel. Problem is, how do you know when the front wheel is straight?). The lastest cool tool to come from HD (IMO) was a tool that bolted to the frame on the FLT, and aligned the chassis automatically. You bolted it on after removing all the tie bars, and adjusted the tie bar to suit. Something similar may or may not have been used at Buell, I don't know. Unless you set yourself up at Computrack or any one of the motorcycle frame alignment shops, you may be screwed... Realise, too, that the rear wheel MAY not be directly in line with the front, and possibly on purpose. This is the case on more bikes than you'd realize. I never had to replace a tube-frame tie-bar so I can't say how they're adjusted at that point (I can't imagine needing to replace one in a scenario where the frame wasn't bent, either.) I always marked and measured beforehand. There is NOT a service adjustment procedure that I am aware of. Good luck with it! (Message edited by jos51700 on September 16, 2010) | ||
| Fuzzz |
DesertFox, So what did you decide? Have you made any progress? | ||
| Andymnelson |
2 (probably non-helpful) thougts on wheel alignment: 1) I would think that, with the separate rear axle adjusters, trying to adjust the tie bars by wheel alignment is futile....unless those rear adjusters are in the same or correct spot. 2) on my X1 (and every chain driven bike I've owned) I check and adjust rear wheel alignment with simply a rear stand and piece of string...nothing fancy required! | ||
| Oldog |
fuzz using the inside measuring points measure across the out side of the holes, subtract 1 hole diameter you got the c to c distance. the tie bars should be about the same bike to bike, as the frames are built in a jig and the motor mounting points are machined skip the rails strings and foolishness set the tie bars to the same spacing as fuzzes location for location and put it together, these were mass produced not rolexes... | ||
| Desertfox |
Fuzzz, I decided to let it sit for a bit because suddenly wiring issues are popping up like crazy. I'm buying an ecmspy cable today to work out the TPS. I decided to use the lower end of your lengths and didn't notice any real change in handling while it was running. | ||
| Tattoodnscrewd |
It's not just about wheel alignment. Those tie rods are more so to keep the front to back vibration of the motor in line with the 'whole' of the bike. They are there to prevent lateral vibration/movement and to assure only front to back vibration of the motor/bike. So yea ... those aren't to be adjusted. If that is out of spec that could make for a pretty squirrelly ride, as well as a bit risky, as that would change the handling characteristics quite a bit as well as affecting wheel alignment. And just because the frames were built in a jig doesn't mean they are all identical. I would be in contact with Erik Buell Racing and ask them the best way to get it corrected, there are still guys there that have been there since the tuber days. (Message edited by tattoodnscrewd on September 20, 2010) |
