| Author |
Message |
    
Oldog
| | Posted on Sunday, July 04, 2010 - 11:03 pm: | 
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Jim
so I am understanding correctly, the closed loop area is rich so the ecm is trying to lean the mixture, the afv is applied across the map ( I knew this )
so the extreems are way lean, and the CL area is close?
it makes sense, as the changes from pipe and intake would alter the breathing character of the system.
thanks for setting us strait. |
Kalali
| | Posted on Monday, July 05, 2010 - 07:46 am: |
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My next mod is putting an O2 sensor bung in my front header. It is a hit and miss when trying to tune the bike without one.
Keep at it. You will get it to purr like a cat... |
X1_rider
| | Posted on Monday, July 05, 2010 - 08:19 am: |
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Kalali, that is a good idea, you get a reading from both headers.
So would you connect one, ride around for the "learning", then connect the other and do the same? I was thinking about that but since there is ECM input for one sensor, I was wondering how one could go about integrating the signal from both.
I guess you could use something like the Daytona Twin Tech or Innovate units and monitor AFR while riding and do the adjustments after?
I found that the NTK 21002 O2 sensor is also a replacement option btw.
(Message edited by x1_rider on July 05, 2010) |
X1_rider
| | Posted on Monday, July 05, 2010 - 08:40 pm: |
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Quick update (I didn't get to do much because I'm in the process of changing the belt on my FatBoy as well).
I rigged up an inline fuel pressure gauge, the pump primes at 46psi and runs a constant 50psi with the bike running, all normal here.
I re-flashed the stock eeprom, and flashed the Race ECM fuel and timing tables.
I warmed up the bike with the O2 sensor disconnected, AFV stays at 100% after being reset to 100%.
One thing I found strange is that I get an EGO voltage varying between 0.49-0.50V with the O2 sensor disconnected, unless I'm totally missing the point of that voltage.
I shot propane around the intake flanges while warming up the bike, no change in rpm.
I didn't get to go for a ride because of my other project on the go. |
Kalali
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 06, 2010 - 04:09 pm: |
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I wouldn't ride for too long without the O2 sensor. As for the bung on the front header, you'd have to "read" them one at a time just like you described. A bit of a kludge but better than not having one at all. |
Natexlh1000
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 06, 2010 - 04:43 pm: |
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Is the Oxygen sensor putting out voltage when it's hot and disconnected from the ECU? |
X1_rider
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 06, 2010 - 04:51 pm: |
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Natexlh1000, yes, I thought that was weird, I was warming up the bike and monitoring with ECM Spy. The O2 sensor was disconnected, yet the EGO Voltage was oscillating between 0.49-0.50 V. I would have expected that value to be 0, with the O2 sensor being disconnected. |
Oldog
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 06, 2010 - 07:05 pm: |
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Rider I'll hook up to it this evening, and look cold, and if I can get to it unhooked. |
X1_rider
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 06, 2010 - 08:43 pm: |
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Oldog, I hooked up again tonight, O2 sensor unplugged, registered 0 volt at EGO (as would be expected with the sensor unplugged I would assume). I went for a ride, hooked up again and now I'm registering 0.49 V?!?! I'm officially searching for a race ECM (they're pretty hard to find nowadays). I'll see if the same things happen when I try yours.
I'll check my plugs tomorrow morning and see if I was rich, good, or lean. |
Oldog
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 14, 2010 - 12:34 am: |
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bump
hows it going Yves
BTW I came across a graph from VSDS ( before ecm spy )
the 02 input connected cold showed 1/2 volt I will try and post the plot which shows speed engine temp and o2 signal
as the engine temp came up the o2 signal osilates ( exhaust pulses ) stay tuned. |
X1_rider
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 14, 2010 - 05:27 am: |
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OK, that would be interesting, also I'd like to know if the EGO voltage shows 0 with the sensor unplugged (mine showed a 0.49-0.50 voltage).
My new ECM with the Race program was shipped from Erik Buell Racing on Monday, hopefully I'll get it for the weekend. |
X1_rider
| | Posted on Saturday, July 17, 2010 - 03:42 pm: |
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Well, I put my Race ECM in, TPS reset, etc...
Still getting some spitting between 2500 and 3500 RPM, looks like it's at a constant load (cruising, not accelerating or decelerating). AFV goes to 85.7% (2 separate rides), which is better than the 60 something I was getting.
WTH is going on!
I have new injectors coming in, and I'll try a third oxygen sensor and if that doesn't work, •••• it, I'll just disable the open loop learn function.
Edit/Update: I just checked the plugs and they're as white as the friggin' driven snow. I don't understand why if the ECM detects a rich mixture it leans it down to the point of running the risk of blowing up the engine.
Maybe I'll set the AFV limits between 95 and 105 and see what the plugs look like, I'd rather deal with blackened plugs then white ones with a blown engine.
What do you guys think? Isn't there anyone out there with a decent tune for a Force exhaust and Forcewinder intake, I'm not asking for a freebie, I'm willing to pay!
(Message edited by x1_rider on July 17, 2010) |
Kalali
| | Posted on Sunday, July 18, 2010 - 02:58 pm: |
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"...Still getting some spitting between 2500 and 3500 RPM, looks like it's at a constant load.."
So you're saying that the bike spits (backfire too?) with a steady throttle between 2500-3500 RPMs? If so, it sure sounds like either an intake or exhaust leak. As for the plug color and low AFV, I know it is not very intuitive but what happens is the O2 is only looking at a fairly narrow range (aka closed loop) of the fuel map but it will take fuel away (or add fuel) to the entire map based on the fuel levels in that range. In your case, it looks like the amount of fuel in your closed loop area (at least for the rear cylinder) is ~14% too high so the ECM is taking away ~14% fuel across the entire map front and rear. I personally don't thin your issue is your fuel map since the Race ECM maps are generally well sorted and should support a broad range of intake/exhaust mods. The only caveat maybe that Force exhaust requires more fuel than other aftermarket cans and in that case you should have seen an AFV>100. I don't know but maybe your timing is somehow messed up. Checking the static timing is fairly easy. |
X1_rider
| | Posted on Sunday, July 18, 2010 - 03:41 pm: |
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I checked the static timing (removed the timing plug, aligned the mark in the middle, and monitored the voltage on the wire to pin 3, gray connector).
If I had an intake leak, wouldn't the bike run lean and the AFV go up (the ECM trying to add fuel to correct the lean condition)?
I did test the intake (using propane) and didn't notice any leaks.
The spitting is through the intake only, nothing through the exhaust.
Maybe I should try removing fuel from the closed loop area and see if it will stabilize the AFV, I'm not too keen on taking away fuel on a bike that already has white plugs though.
...or I could just put my PCIII back in there, it ran fine with it, haha!
edit/update I just went back to the garage, put a rag in the exhaust and can't hear any exhaust leak, re-checked the intake with propane, and checked the plugs, they're still white with the 95% AFV.
I locked it at 100% and will go for a ride to see what happens.
(Message edited by x1_rider on July 18, 2010) |
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