| Author | Message | ||
     Dave_02_1200 |
My S 3T has a race kit ECM, Carbon Air Filter, and muffler and it runs great. However, it is really too loud for my preference. Is there another alternative pipe that would still run well but with less noise? I am not too concerned about maximum RPM HP but I want to retain the smooth acceleration and good midrange I have now. It seems that a slightly more restrictive pipe would mainly affect maximum RPM operation anyway and my DDFI would maintain the current correct (slightly rich) air/fuel mixture with another pipe. Does that make sense? Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks, Dave | ||
| Steveford |
Vance and Hines might be a good alternative. | ||
| Djkaplan |
If your bike has the full race kit exhaust system, a V&H won't fit the race header without being modified. If you did modify one to fit the race header (like I did) you'll find that it isn't appreciably quieter than the stainless steel race muffler. I don't believe anyone in the US marketed a 'quiet' muffler for the race header, but I've seen links to TUV Eurospec mufflers. They must be frightfully expensive though. Have you considered putting the stock exhaust system back on? | ||
| Jayvee |
I've been looking high and low for a bolt-on 'quieter' muffler for the race header, and the HSA is is the only thing close I have found so far. The HSA Race muffler has a mechanical sound adjustment at the outlet tip, you can see how it would work in the photo. Here's the link: http://www.speed-of-color.de/index.php?cat=AUSPUFF SMX&product=AU-009 You can use Babel Fish or Google Translate, but there is no useful information there, it only says its "TUV compliant" in the Quiet position. I have read that Germany is strict about loudness, so that's encouraging. The price of $562 (+ shipping)is not so encouraging. Also how would those rear mounting tabs work? I don't know in detail how the Buell Race muffler mounts the rear, but that just doesn't look right. So, choice of one, so far, and it looks like a poor choice. I emailed ArcFabrication to see if they could custom-make something, but they're moving to West Virginia right now. KDFab is backlogged, and likely to stay so... What I did is buy a used SuperTrapp, with the intention of copying Djkaplan's adaptation of his V&H, then, taking out a bunch of disks. I have no idea yet how I'm going to do that though... Let us know if you find something! | ||
| Djkaplan |
Jay I cut the 90 degree inlet off the V&H and got the stub expanded at a muffler shop to fit over the race header. I had to shorten the aluminum body and steel perforated core about 2 1/8" so the V&H rear mount could line up with the V&H hanger mounted to the frame. I also had to redrill the holes in the hanger about 1/2" inboard to so the header didn't empty into the muffler at an angle. By pure luck, this all worked out as I went along... there was no grand plan. If you try this with the SuperTrapp, make sure you can move it inboard slightly or you'll have to put up with a slight mis-alignment between the header and muffler, or you'll have to somehow bend the header outlet to get a straight shot to the muffler. Also... make darn sure you haven't created a future catastrophe by having the front of the muffler slip off of the header. With the V&H hanger creating a positive stop, it would be impossible for the modded V&H to fall unless the muffler or the header itself fell apart. I can post some detailed pics if you want. | ||
| Djkaplan |
Moving the muffler inboard may have been more of an issue with production tolerances with my race header - you may not encounter this with yours. I noticed that the SS race muffler that came with my race kit had an interference problem with the shock, so it may have been an anamoly with just this header. I never did install the Buell race muffler... I still have it, brand new in the box. Oh... and shortening the V&H by over 2" made it even louder. | ||
| Ratbuell |
Your race muffler should be an internal disc system - take the rear endcap off, and you should see a set of supertrapp discs. Hopefully an endcap, too. To quiet it down, either add an endcap and some discs (if it / they was/were missing) or if you already have one, remove some discs from the stack and reinstall the endcap. More discs under the endcap = more noise. Fewer discs = quieter. No endcap = max rumble. | ||
| Xldevil |
Hi. You can ask Lucky http://www.luckyhands.de/parts_RR.html He will build you a muffler of your personal needs.That price will be a little higher than that of the mentioned,made by Udo Hüls. http://www.hsaexhaust.de/shop/index.htm Both guys have a very good reputation in the German Buell scene. I'm riding a (street legal)HSA for more than 40k kilometers and I'm really satisfied. Ralph P.S. Forget that babel fish thing.The translations make no sense. (Message edited by xldevil on September 24, 2007) | ||
| Djkaplan |
"Your race muffler should be an internal disc system - take the rear endcap off, and you should see a set of supertrapp discs." I'm not sure what muffler Dave_02_1200 has, but the race muffler I'm talking about is the straight through, perforated core stainless steel muffler that came with the Pro Series Race Kit and is not interchangeable with the SuperTrapp race muffler made for for the stock header. | ||
| Yo_barry |
Dave... If you don't have the race header.. a supertrapp is probably the way to go. You can tune the sound by using different packing materials and can reduce the sound by reducing the discs. Everything is inside the SS can. I don't know where you can find one, I got mine on ebay, new in 2004. What do you mean by the Carbon Fibre air filter? Did you replace the S3 airbox with the Buell C/F Hamcan? Barry | ||
| Dave_02_1200 |
Yep, It is a carbon-fiber ham can air filter. I just looked at the header more closely and I think it must be the "race" header, It measures two and one-half (2.5) inches where it enters the muffler. Also, the header enters the muffler from the front so the muffler does not have a 90 degree bend like the stock one in my parts book. I think I am going to leave it as is and accept that I'll just have to get used to the noise because it runs really great and I don't have any of the problems other members have described with their set ups. Maybe I can develop a soft touch on the throttle and short-shift when necessary to avoid attracting too much of the wrong kind of attention. Thanks, Dave | ||
| Bluesboy |
It should`nt be THAT LOUD.If it is RE-PACK IT. THAT SHOULD HELP.Sorry im yellen,my muffler is SO LOUD. | ||
| Tunes |
I agree with repacking the Race Can. I must perform this procedure every coupla years... I bought the repack kit from American Sport Bike. Better kit than from Buell (if they still sell it). Everyone comments on how quiet my S3 is. | ||
| Jayvee |
Should mention, I already wear foam earplugs almost any ride over a few blocks. This really helps, even with the stock pipe. Ralph, can you clarify anything about the relationship of "TUV compliance" to sound level? For example we have a federal standard of 80 Db at 3500 rpm for stock exhaust. Would the TUV review require a maximum sound level, or is it only the construction quality they are concerned with? I'm still interested in the HSA Race pipe, despite it's high cost, primarily because it's a "bolt-on". Daniel, saw the pictures you posted earlier, and appreciate the additional info. The Supertrapp is held up by straps in the back, so I don't think I have to shorten the muffler. I am thinking on a "fail-safe" front hanger, maybe a loop of cable, similar to the Race Muffler Recall Kit. I don't think the angle of transition between the header and muffler is critical, doesn't the stock muffler abruptly change the course of the exhaust gas twice? I'm not after ultimate performance, just reasonable. Home-made solutions being so problematic, I'd about decided to just keep it stock, until couple days ago I'm cruising my commute on the highway, slowly overtaking a car to my right, and I realized I can't even hear my bike. It made me nervous. A little TOO quiet. Temporary answer: wick it up! If I have to change anything, I'm pretty sure I want the Race header in the mix. It's just a shame no aftermarket company in this country makes a muffler for it (other than the notoriously loud D&D.) Oh yeah, here's an interesting test, why don't the aftermarket manufacturers publish their DB levels like this? http://www.bikernet.com/news/PageViewer.asp?PageID=902 (Message edited by jayvee on September 25, 2007) | ||
| Djkaplan |
"I don't think the angle of transition between the header and muffler is critical, doesn't the stock muffler abruptly change the course of the exhaust gas twice?" When I originally installed the modified V&H onto the race header, it was slightly cocked to the outside using the stock V&H rear hanger. I ran it like this for a couple months before I moved it inboard so it could get a straight shot through the perforated core. The difference in performance was quite noticeable (not dyno tested, though). I believe the performance increase had more to do with pressure wave resonance of the entire system than just flow through the muffler... but maybe it was a little of both. Either way, it just made sense to keep the header aimed as straight as possible through a muffler that had a straight path going through it. | ||
| Jayvee |
Wow, that's interesting. I based this on old memories. There were two-stroke expansion chamber kits sold in the 70's. You could buy a kit of tubes, cylinders, and cones and the formula for your engine parameters and desired peak power rpm. As long as the math was right, the shape of how the pipe looked (the angles) was immaterial. That's why there's such wierdly-shaped pipes on MX bikes, especially after hydro-forming became the norm. It could go low like Maico, or high like Yamaha IT, didn't matter. Basically I don't know anything about four-stroke exhaust design. While browsing looking into it, I did find an vivid "critique" of Supertrapps, and some interesting info at the RB Racing site here: http://www.rbracing-rsr.com/lsr21.htm | ||
| Brokeneck |
My 2000 S3 is running the stock headers and a Supertrapp and made 93 hp on the dyno at NRHS. Thats with Colorado's thin air. The Supertrapp is almost as quiet as the stock system at idle and not obnoxious at higher rpms. My 2cents -- If you really want something that is quieter but still has performance -- I would put the race exhaust up on Ebay and find a stock header and get the Trapp. | ||
| Xldevil |
Ralph, can you clarify anything about the relationship of "TUV compliance" to sound level? For example we have a federal standard of 80 Db at 3500 rpm for stock exhaust. Would the TUV review require a maximum sound level, or is it only the construction quality they are concerned with? I'm still interested in the HSA Race pipe, despite it's high cost, primarily because it's a "bolt-on". The meaning of "TÜV compliance" is,the exhausts will not produce more than 80dB(A) while bike is passing in a specific distance and angle to the micro and the engine is in the middle of it's maximum revs.For the Tubers that should be close to 3500rpm. Seems like the EU standard is close to identical to your federal standard. I'm sure German traffic controls of noise regulations and fines(money,licence penalty points and temporary confiscation of a muffler that is too loud,sometimes of the whole bike) have been way more restrictive during the last decades than yours. The quality of the regular TÜV legal HSA,that is the one I own,is very good.No rivets used and no need for repacking.Actually it's the most popular street legal exhaust for the 2" collector header (standard header for German tubers that was til the end) in Germany. I can not say anything about the quality of the race header compliant HSA.It's rarely used in Germany. If you need any further info on German Buell parts,don't hesitate to ask.I will be glad if I can help you. Ralph  (Message edited by xldevil on September 27, 2007) | ||
| Jayvee |
Thanks, and thanks guys. Hey Brokeneck, how many Discs are you running in your SuperTrapp? | ||
| Homebrewed1 |
If you can find a stock header and muffler, the Drummer muffler for the S3 is great, and not loud at all. Lots of power down low (where the race system doesn't have it) and all up top too. Has a throaty sound to it, sounds like a v-twin, but pretty low on the noise level. I can barely here it over the wind noise on my full face helmet. I have Bub Rinehart duals on my Harley Electra Glide, now that is loud. You will need the stock header and muffler for this setup. If you can't tune your muffler to your satisfaction, you should consider it. | ||
| Dave_02_1200 |
Right now I'm leaning toward keeping it "as is" because it runs so well in its present configuration - but I definitely will consider a Drummer on a stock header. Thanks for the recommendations. Dave | ||
| Brokeneck |
You know I'd have to take it apart to count -- whatever it came with stock and whatever you can add without buying new screws -- call NRHS and talk to Dan he'll tell you how many that is -- I love that guy -- In a macho Buell way of course -- | ||
| Buellistic |
Want pictures of OEM "PRODUCT IMPROVED" Muffler ??? Send me a private message and "i" will send some to those of you that ask ... In BUELLing LaFayette (Message edited by buellistic on September 28, 2007) (Message edited by buellistic on September 28, 2007) | ||
| Jayvee |
If Drummer sold any kind of muffler for a tuber "off the shelf" I would be running one now, or at least would have tried it. But they are only custom-made, for tubers, is my understanding. On other threads, he's indicated a substantial backlog. | ||
| Iamike |
I really like the Supertrapp because of the ease of changing the discs. I have run as few as 3 to keep the noise down but had trouble going over 100mph. 8 discs are a good compromise between noise and power. I have been running 12 lately and put the open endcap on if I like to be kind of rowdy. Since I leave for work at 6:15am I like to keep the noise down. | ||
| Buellmeister57 |
I've ran a Borla CF on my Cyclone the last 6 years. Throaty but not too loud. Don't know if they even make them anymore. I can idle out of my neighborhood at 5:30am without annoying my neighbors. | ||
| Oldog |
Watch which version of the super trapp that you get if you can find one, the flat end one can fail and "polevault" you, the later one with the tapered end is the best its sturdy and well made, I don't know if they are available any more if so good at the price, I run all of the supplied disks and the closed end, its loud! |
