| Author | Message | ||
     Deltacruiser |
I previously had some minor leaks from my rocker gaskets, both front and rear on my 99 X1. I've got close to 7K miles on it. Then this weekend I took off the stock bread box and added a race oval, new breather bolts and catch can. The problem is that now after adding all this, the oil leaks from the rocker gaskets are spewing all over. The breathers are routed down and hoses run between the cylinders to the left side, where a catch can is mounted to the frame tube near the horn. I have double checked and the oil isn't coming from the breather bolts or hoses. Although, none of it seems to be ending up in the catch can. Before anyone asks, I cleaned the engine completely and then rode around very slowly & double checked the source of the leaks. There seems to be a lot coming from the rear of the rear cylinder and another on the right front corner of the front cylinder. The rear is the worst. I know I'm going to have to replace the rocker gaskets, but I wanted to get some thoughts from you all on a theory I have as to what caused this. My thought is that the new breather bolts route out to a 5/16" hose instead of a 3/8" hose that was on the stock fittings. My guess is that the smaller diameter fittings might be causing more back pressure & therefore making the leaks worse? Anybody have any thoughts on this? My next step will be to replace the rocker gaskets and I may convert to the XB rocker covers at the same time since I'll be in there anyway. Thanks in advance for the responses. | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
Did you verify they the blow-by was coming out your breather tubes? Hey- you might not have done anything wrong. It might have just been a coincidence. I think my first set of rocker box gaskets leaked at about 10K-12K. | ||
| Deltacruiser |
I can't find anything coming out of the breather tubes. I think it may be just a coincidence, but just thought I'd ask around. I figured they may not even be leaking that much worse, but without the side scoop and big ugly bread box on the side blocking some of the airflow it might just be blowing around a lot more. Any recommendations on rocker gaskets? Are the newer metal Harley gaskets as good as the Cometic gaskets sold by NRHS? | ||
| Seth |
I think my original rockerbox gaskets started leaking as I was pulling out of the dealership parking lot  I've got a set of James gaskets in my front cylinder and a set of the new metal HD gaskets in the rear (don't ask). Neither have started to leak thus far but it might be interesting to see which starts first. In my opinion, clean gasket mating surfaces and proper torque should keep any gasket you choose doing it's job right. | ||
| Velocity |
It is possible that the gaskets squeezed out or were not seated in the groves, when you tighten them down. It can be towards the inside,allowing the oil to seep through and the air blows it all over the motor.My opinion on the hose dia. is it should not matter breathing is breathing. How are the umbrella seals in the rocker boxes,are they there? Did you over tighten the bolts in the rocker boxes? Than can cause them to leak.Just some things to check. Scott | ||
| Deltacruiser |
I haven't actually taken the rocker boxes off yet. These are the original gaskets that are leaking. I'll keep those suggestions in mind though. Looks like they will be coming off very soon. | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
There SHOULD be air coming out of the breathers. Sounds like you have a block in the line? I have banjo fittings on my breather and I had to space them out with two aluminum washers to make the little ports line up with the surrounding fitting. I thought the oil filler plug pops out if it's blocked off? | ||
| Deltacruiser |
Thanks for the suggestion on the breathers. I'll double check to see if air is coming out. I didn't even think of that. I didn't even check for air coming out. I just noticed no oil spitting into the catch can. | ||
| Cyclonemaniac |
Delta, Natexlh1000 is right. There def. should be air coming from the breather bolts. If you don't have, the umbrella valves in the rocker boxes may be sludged up. If you do change out the rocker gaskets, I suggest Cometic gaskets and check all rocker box parts for warpage.  | ||
| Jackbequick |
There should be a light suck and blow sort of pulsing at the end of the breather tube(s). A little more blow than suck and the amount of oil should not be a lot at 7k miles if engine is otherwise healthy. I used a slightly experimental approach on my breathers. I have been assured by numerous people that it would leak and gush oil all over the place. But that has not happened yet. My gas filter "catch tank" has only accumulated maybe 1/2 a teaspoon or so in 2,000 miles, the tubing itself is lightly oiled on the inside and there is only a trace at the outlet. You can see how I did my breathers here. My rear rocker box cover just started leaking (2000 M2, 4,000 miles) between the head and lower cover and also the lower and middle cover. It shows as light oil accumulations, it is not excessive yet. I'm going to work on it over the winter and will just deal with it for now. I was reading the SM procedures for pulling and replacing the rocker boxes. It requires quite a bit of attention to detail on fitting of gaskets and seals and on the torque values and sequences. Attention to that and cleaning all the surfaces carefully should leave me in good shape for next year. Jack | ||
| Deltacruiser |
Jack, I was in the same boat as you before, with just a slight leak. However, all the sudden I have oil all over the place along the right side and even dripping off the bottom of my oil bag. I almost seems like it must be spraying out. It if was a light leak, I would just do the same and wait for winter, but this is bad enough now it needs immediate attention. | ||
| Mmmi_grad |
I remember sitting in Harley School [aka MMI] and being told about the redesign of the breather. It was shown to us for the first time. I WAS SHOCKED!! WE were warned how this thing was going to fail , I had a bad feeling about it then. I am still shocked it hasnt been able to improve for these motors. | ||
| Mbsween |
If you want a more permanent fix that is pretty simple and not too expensive (I think the whole thing is less than 100.00). Check out Jose's solution http://204.232.5.159/Rocker.htm You replace the 3 piece rockers with the newer 2 piece items from the XB series | ||
| Jackbequick |
Brett, Thanks for the details, we're just starting into fall here and I'm not sure how much more time I'll get on the bike. But as soon as it gets anywhere near what you describe, I'll park it until I can do the work. My plan is to drive it into the basement (radiant heating in the floor, stays about 55-60F all winter long) and play with it over the winter. Jack | ||
| Firemanjim |
What's this "winter" thing you guys speak of? Rarely more than a day or 2 in a row when I cannot ride to work.Makes it hard to decide when to do any upgrades.Might be why I try to have 2 running streetbikes at all times---course my excuse is,it's for any visiting friends. | ||
| Seth |
I just read Jack's fuel filter/ catch can procedure; great idea! I went a "slightly" different route with my catch can. I bought an 11 oz. fuel bottle from a camping supply store, stuck a little filter in the top and placed a hose in the hole I drilled in the side. 11 ounces! my lazy arse will never have to empty it  | ||
| Jackbequick |
Seth - To be fair about it, another guy here told me that the element inside the gas filter would eventually fail/disintegrate/plug up the vent lines. But that has not happened yet either. I have pulled the filter and blown through it several times and there is still virtually no back pressure from the oil wetted element and accumulated oil. I used the better quality NAPA Gold 3003 filter over the cheaper WIX, maybe that is the difference. Since I did that I removed the "breadbox" air cleaner and put a AFT billet filter housing with a K&N filter on. That is working good, and I did not even have to change the jetting on the carb, the plugs are looking fine. That is a beautiful filter housing and it tucks in nicely against the bike. Pretty unobtrusive. I "find" the back edge of it with my knee a little more than the stock airbox when I bring my knees in against the bike but I don't feel it in my normal riding position. Jack | ||
| Djkaplan |
"To be fair about it, another guy here told me that the element inside the gas filter would eventually fail/disintegrate/plug up the vent lines." It'll work for awhile, but it will eventually start clogging. The paper media in the fuel filter doesn't flow air very well when it's saturated with oil. I tried the very same thing you did and it never worked as well as a proper catch-can. Once the filter starts impeding airflow, spooge will start coating the insides of the breather lines, further impeding flow. It never completely clogs up, though. The filter itself doesn't keep oil mist from escaping and it creates an oily mess where ever you mount it. Does it work? Yes. Does it work well? Not in my opinion. You need to route the lines to a vented can where the oil mist can be taken out of suspension and collect. This is my $5 solution... http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/3842/128427.html?1116420688 I just recently installed XB rocker covers and PCV valves. It did away with the breather lines tied to the frame. | ||
| Deltacruiser |
Winter is pretty weak here in the Sacramento area too. I ride all year around. Usually a day wrenching is a day missed riding, but has to be done. An update on the breathers. Last night I checked the breathers and the air is pumping out of both lines just fine, so that is not the problem. It appears the rocker gaskets are the culprit. | ||
| Jackbequick |
Dan, We'll continue the test. But it is working very well up to this point in time and, like I said, as soon as it quits working well I will post the info here. If any oil mist is escaping through the filter it is very little. I park it in the garage in the same spot all the time, not a single drop of oil has been found on the garage floor below the outlet tubing. If there was any oil mist accumulating on the tubing walls beyond the catch filter it probably would have produced at least one drop of oil in 2,000 miles. I like the XB rocker covers, if I find a set of those at the right price I may try them. But otherwise, mine will get re-gasketed and put back this winter. Jack |
