| Author |
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Djkaplan
| | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 09:30 am: | 
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I've had a V&H since 2000. 24,000 miles and all is well. I never got the updated Y-mount either. |
Denfromphilly
| | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 10:08 am: |
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Tramp, Dude, come on, tensioners ALWAYS break and even if they don't do catastrophic damage they let the primary chain slap around and wear through the cover. My brother just bought an X1 and it too had a broken tensioner. I changed mine and it was broken at 14,000 miles and wore the primary through to about 3/4 of the way through the screw bosses in the cover. I think the shifter pawl is a waste of time, mine just shifts weird after I changed it. Keep playing with the adjustment to get it better.
You can stick a dental mirror into the primary inspection cover and using a flash light see the tensioner and tell if it's old or new.
My point is that there ARE some reported weaknesses with these high performance bikes. The oil pump gear and the tensioner are the most pressing and have both been addressed by HD in the way of improved parts. If these bikes were airplanes these defects would never be tolerated. Both the oil pump gear and tensioner are chronic affecting between 10 and 100% of the bikes and can lead to catastrophic engine loss failures. I don't want to lose my motor or bike, I want to keep riding. Broken front bolts on the mount are a little farther behind and the Y mount for the V&H has caused serious crashes and again was redesigned to address the issue.
Ignoring these chronic issues for the sake of arrogance is pure folly. An ounce of prevention is always worth a pound of cure. I own a high performance bike. I like owing and riding it. Every high performance vehicle is high maintenance, this is a given in life. You have ridden and done nothing to your bike but your bike is not the 10's of thousands of other bikes and to judge all by one example is pure prejudice. A Buell is not a shovelhead, or a panhead, or any other 40 year old HD. It is quite unique with it's own quirks.
We all have the right to live our lives and treat our vehicles per our personal beliefs and values. Don't judge and shame and scold others because they follow their own values. We could be equally harsh to you for not maintaining your bike for 200,000 miles.
The soapbox is all yours.
Den |
Tramp
| | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 11:28 am: |
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nice points, but i haven't needed to do any extranneous maintenance on mine.
you're dead wrong when you say "tensioners ALWAYS break"...mine never did.
you also say that "if these bikes were airplanes..."
...well, i got news for ya, den...they're NOT. you don't have to treat 'em like they are.
what does "affecting between 10 and 100%" of ANYTHING mean? that "stat" can be said of any condition... how about between .01 & 100% of our population will die tonight? it makes up, in accuracy, what it loses in concision.
"pure arrogance" is not why i chose to ignore these "issues". due prudence is why i ignore the alarmist shrieking of the webbuellers. if it were for any other reason, then, wouldn't my shifter pawl/primary tensioner/exhaust mount have failed by now? news flash #2: they haven't, "arrogance" notwithstanding
when you go on to proclaim: "every high performance vehicle is high maintenance"
wellll...clearly that's not the case. mine sure isn't. maybe most high maintenance vehicle owners are high maintenance.
look, i'm not opining here, in some analytical, dialectic philosophy. me and my buell are living proof that the above-mentioned quotes of yours are simply
wrong.
this final proclamation of yours:
"We all have the right to live our lives and treat our vehicles per our personal beliefs and values. Don't judge and shame and scold others because they follow their own values. We could be equally harsh to you for not maintaining your bike for 200,000 miles. "
...defies logic. m/c maintenance is NOT some fuzzy, subjective religion. "personal beliefs"??!??! forgetting all shaky pseudo-religious implications to the contrary, my buell's been fine without any extranneous maintenance. this is an absolute fact.
You want a religion, join a church/synagogue/temple
you want an airplane, buy/lease/rent one.
this is a motorcycle, devoid of all grey, arcane notions of technophilosophical dogma.
ride it and grin more ... |
Denfromphilly
| | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 11:58 am: |
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Well, there are service bulletins from the manufacturer to support my subjective beliefs. One fine example does not make a pattern and extrapolating it as such is merely bad science.
It's just that you give the same advise to everyone, "abandon what you want and accept what I want". You my friend are not a god.
Later,
Den |
Silas_clone
| | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 12:56 pm: |
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Aw geez fellas, I like the way to updated shifter looks, I want to open up my primary to see what it looks like, The y hanger makes more sense and the repack seems to be something that needs attention.
The shift pawl, oil pump gear and whatnot I'll do eventually because I like to fidget.
I believe in the manual, I always use it and I ride as often as I can, but not when it's rainin, too hot or at night [cause I don't see that well anymore].
I ride and wrench 'cause it makes me think, it challenges me and it educates me. It takes my mind off my worries.
I have owned a '64 BSA, a 46 UL a 37 UL and my Sportster. I think I know something about Harleys cause I completely rebuilt the last two bikes myself [no machine work or flywheel trueing, just wrenching] I am not paranoid, just fussy. My Sporty still works cause I'm fussy. I hate breaking stuff.
This bike [the M2] is so cool I want to keep it forever, however long forever is.
I don't believe in Single fire ignition, 44mm mikunis, nitous oxide kits, foo-foo's, hoo-hahs, do-dads or chromegofasters. But if I can make the thing a little better, why not?
I got the jack [this has not always been the case] and the tools.
All I wanna know is should I look for any landmines or booby traps when I unbutton the primary.
You know, stuff like forgetting to flash the generator when you install a new battery... |
Denfromphilly
| | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 01:24 pm: |
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No rocket science involved, the primary comes off with little fuss, make sure you COMPLETELY remove the shifter bolt, there is a grove in the shaft it rides in. It drove me nuts until I realized this. Use a puller to get it off too. A $5 battery terminal puller will work just fine. The X-Files has a good process for opening the primary that worked well for me. The process for the detent plate alignment is a bit confusing but you will finally get it right. You will need a tool to lock up the primary to remove the clutch and primary sprocket or you can stuff rags into the gear and chain, crude but works. The clutch nut is left hand thread. The sockets are hard to find, had to try three different Sears Hardware stores. Clean the threads really good, I used Acetone, otherwise the loctite will be worthless and you can trash your stator. Be careful with the shifter seal, it tore on mine, I didn't have a replacement and mine weeps a little. I don't see a way to slide the seal past the splines and not damage it. I covered the splines with electrical tape and it didn't help. Hmmm, I'm sure there is more but this is all I recall. Here's the x files link; http://www.saintjohn.nbcc.nb.ca/Marriott/x1/PrimaryWork.htm
Tramp and I work from opposing and yet parallel philosophies too and as I am Irish I simply like to fight and argue. Of course there is beer too...
I like to work on my bike too, it's fun to tinker. I have primary custody of my son so I'm not always free to ride. Besides even if these bikes are not planes they need a good walkaround before riding. I am sure that if Buells were cars and the oil pump gear gernaded in 1 of 10,000 units there would be a recall. The rate of failure is a lot higher than that. The primary tensioner seems to always be broken. 50 Ford Explorers rolled over and Ford replaced every tire on the entire fleet of a decade's worth of Explorers. Buell riders just don't have that clout.
Regards, Den |
Henrik
| | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 02:10 pm: |
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Silas, since you've owned - and therefore no doubt wrenched on - a '64 BSA, you've got all the go-getter attitude necessary for a good and lasting relationship with your M2 
Henrik |
Silas_clone
| | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 02:59 pm: |
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tough wrenching that one with the whitworth hardware, I couldn't do much on it.
The M2 reminds me of the Beeza, the way it handles. M2 comes outta the hole a little more briskly, I would say  |
Tramp
| | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 05:47 pm: |
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den, didn't think i was claiming godliness.
whatever.
silas-
please-
do NOT parallel limey iron with the buell.
i spent much of my wrenching time in the 70s and 80s and early 90s wrenching on/riding british stuff. the infamous a65 crank bushing was a maintenance hand-grenade.
they also handled for sh*t.
be at ease,
you are NOT dealing with a beezer, here.
let the paranoia go.
whta i see happening, time and again, is that
guys who insist on looking for maintenance issues,
who dp 'proactively' wrenching on them
create maintenance issues, eventually.
funny thing- a very close, old friend, whom i haven't seen in 16 years, just move moved to my
small town, here. with him, he brought his enormous collection of limey iron. (he purchased a place with a 7-bay garage) i've been using a bay for a few of my projects, and the mere sight of the whitworth tools on the wall is giving me a whole new set of neurological isssues, such as twitching, stuttering, and curling fetal while murmuring "find the happy place" as if "Sea Bass" were standing above me....
my buddy offered to give me, as a gift, a norton featherbed frame and a nice '71 t120 engine (that was the worst frame year for trumpets, yet a good engine year) and ALL associated parts (he has two bays stuffed with just spares).
I declined. i'm done with that limey-iron, pure and simple. old boxers, sure. gimme a nice /5 any day of the week.
no more limey stuff.
silas- exhale and say it with me
"i am a bueller, and i will enjoy clean nails" |
Silas_clone
| | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 09:17 pm: |
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I'd still like a ULH, maybe a '71 Commando, a Ducati Monster, an H2 Kawasaki, XB12, keep my Sportster. But to ride, gimme the M2.
The BSA Thunderbolt handled great, it was great to ride. I did blow the crank.
I wouldn't buy one again, but it was fun to ride. |
Tramp
| | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 09:24 pm: |
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of course you blew the crank. unless someone (like me) had refitted a bearing where birmingham put a bushing, it had to go, eventually.
what state are you in?
i dig ULHes. the commando was sort of a major, influential buell predecessor, what with the isolastics, etc. |
Silas_clone
| | Posted on Saturday, August 20, 2005 - 08:50 am: |
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Nawth Car'lina
'n yew?
Well, I thought about going back to a flathead, they have "something", can't explain what. But when you are trying to go 70mph, you better have some things worked out, like how to stop!
My old Sporty is a blast to ride, but it is OLLLLD and I didn't think it would be worth dumping a ton of dough into it to make it uglier and less reliable ['74, '75 XLCH is still the prettiest sickle ever made]
Really got interested in Sportster SPORT, but as I researched, all my info led me to wonder, "why not a Buell?"
When I realized that I could go Buell, get a better performer and pay almost half, it was done.
Interesting thing was the Monster I rode in March, looking to buy. The flywheel effect is so ingrained in my concept of what a motorcycle is, I doubt that I could ever just ride a Duck.
Sporty flywheels in an M2 might be a hoot, they are heavier, correct? Maybe some T&O stroker wheels, moderate displacement, of course.
Oh yeah, besides a kicker, I would like the M2 to have a foot clutch!!! |
Bikerjim99
| | Posted on Saturday, August 20, 2005 - 10:05 pm: |
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Hey Tramp
You really like the /5 Boxers?
I had a new 73 R75/5, worst bike I ever had.
I barely got my new bike home when it quit. Points assembly full of rubber shavings, cleaned out. A bit later, the points seal let go, was replaced by dealer by prying out seal with a screwdriver and replacing it, with a permanent slow seepage of oil from the pry area. Most of the rubber parts were cracked after one winter of storage. Clutch seal let go. Battery far to small, and when kickstarting, I screwed up the left footpeg when the starter lever would hit it. Fuel taps were replaced 3 times, always leaked. On and on it went, for a total of 1800 miles, when I sold it. Obviously you have had better luck than I. My 99 S3, with 20,000 miles, has been quite troublefree. Interesting.
Jim |
Silas_clone
| | Posted on Sunday, August 21, 2005 - 07:43 am: |
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Well, old guys tend to rise early, even if they have the morning off.
Haven't ridden since we began pre-season, August 7th. thought I'd sneak an hour in, just got back.
Tramp, my man, I'm starting to get used to all the little clicks and farts this thing makes and am slowly losing my "new toy" paranoia...didn't have fun with the Sporty either 'til I started to ride it, hard [at least for me]...natural progression?
On a Sunday morning ride at 6:30am, this thing is sublime.
This bike is the bike I've wanted since I began to ride. |
Tramp
| | Posted on Sunday, August 21, 2005 - 08:16 am: |
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glad to hear it, silas- my a*s has a big crack in it and makes all manner of noise, but IT works just fine. |
Ceejay
| | Posted on Sunday, August 21, 2005 - 10:18 am: |
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you older folks and your dribble, makes a person realize what is important about owning a scooter, mine might just go back to worry free flat black again.... |
Silas_clone
| | Posted on Sunday, August 21, 2005 - 12:05 pm: |
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Dribble?
That's feelings, junior. These things have got lotsa history attached to them. Before the Harley Davidson cycle became "acceptable", people who rode them had to love them, or needed somebody who did love them to keep them running right ['cause they'd usually run in spite of whatever you did to 'em].
Points, generators and pushrod adjustments forced you to pay attention. After a couple of hours of "tuning", you could go for a ride and feel proud...or not.
Sorry that I'm new to the "pain-free" ownership experience. It is a good thing, but it doesn't make me forget the guys who taught me about V-twins, or the good feeling you get from riding one.
But please, grace me with your wisdom, what is important? |
Natexlh1000
| | Posted on Sunday, August 21, 2005 - 02:58 pm: |
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Conan, What is good in life?
To crush your enemies.
To see them driven before you.
To hear the lamentations of their women. |
Silas_clone
| | Posted on Sunday, August 21, 2005 - 05:36 pm: |
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Other good things:
-friendly barmaids
-friendly DMV inspectors
-free beer
-cheap beer
-farmers who don't know how much that bone stock WL in their barn is worth
Imagine a guy who has always looked down his nose at evo motors.
Imagine this same guy, who thought that motorcycle evolution went downhill from '75 on.
Imagine this guy, never having rode anything newer than an '86 Lowrider, suddenly finding himself looking over the foo-foo fairing of a pretty well maintained M2 going 80mph...
Do you see why this guy might wax poetic?
I'll refrain from expressing my joy here at "Old School Buell". |
Road_thing
| | Posted on Sunday, August 21, 2005 - 06:17 pm: |
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Tramp, this is for you, buddy, guaranteed to give you a case of the mumbling tremblies:
rt |
Tramp
| | Posted on Sunday, August 21, 2005 - 08:01 pm: |
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F'in Lucas Zener Diode
...must..............contact...............enterprise...........spock........... ..heat sink..........KHAN! |
Ceejay
| | Posted on Monday, August 22, 2005 - 11:14 am: |
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Silas-
"friendly barmaids
friendly DMV inspectors
free beer
cheap beer
farmers who don't know how much that bone stock WL in thier barn is worth"-haven't personally come across this, fingers still crossed
Those are a few of the important things, the folks I work with all got the new harley's along with that attitude, while I grew up around the old ones, if it don't start go back inside and drink another beer, and try again, so me wrenching on my ride comes as second nature, I am just getting pissed because I decided to repaint, which is bubbled now so I am repainting cause I was getting tired of the new harley guys looking down thier noses at the little step child that is buell. despite the fact that none of them ride anywhere close to as much or as nice as the little lady. |
Denfromphilly
| | Posted on Monday, August 22, 2005 - 11:47 am: |
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God, don't even get me started on yuppie snobs that ride HD's. They ride for the image and that says it all, they are not comfortable with who they are, they need to be baaadddd. Their bikes are immaculate, tassels, flags, chrome, they wear $3,000 worth of dealer leathers and doo-rags, can't ride to save their life. My favorite thing is to get behind a pack of them, they see me in the mirrors and rev their motors at stop lights thinking I'm on a GSX600. They will accellerate away in a thunderous crescendo but the bikes actually accellerate pretty slow, much slower than me. After maybe a traffic light or two when there are no cops present I simply twist the throttle and waste em in a second. They get to hear my Harley roar and occasionally they will catch up at the next traffic light and ask "what the F-- is that?"
I had a woman HD rider actually "dump" me because my gold wing was too dirty and had a deadish battery for 2 years (this was before my Buell). She would wash and polish her bike for hours after a two hour ride, I was not a "serious" biker like her. I rode 10,000 miles a year and she rode 800.
When I was a youngster everyone rode Harleys to be a rebel. Now we don't ride Harleys to be rebellious. One genuine lifelong biker I know summed it up like this.."all them yuppies sure ruined a perfectly good bike". REAL bikers, the long hair bearded, committed bike riding types always appreciate my Buell, know what it is and ask what it's like. I even let some of them take it for a spin and they often come back and comment "wow, makes me want to buy one".
Just waste em at the traffic light and let em catch up, then lead em into a turn that's a little faster than their ride and skill can handle. Mean but effective...Den |
Silas_clone
| | Posted on Monday, August 22, 2005 - 01:55 pm: |
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One thing you learn as you get older, don't ever apologize for doing the right thing.
Den, I'm not much for Gold Wings, but I'm not a biker, never rode more than 200 miles in a day. I never make fun of real "live to ride" guys, no matter what they ride.
CEEJAY, I am not much for the Harley Boutique set either, but at least some of their money helps float the boat [the MOCO]. What's the difference if they are on soft-tails or Lincoln Navigators? They don't get it and while they may some day if they stick with it, they'll probably never will. If they don't like you, don't feel too bad.
30 years ago, I met a few "club members" and started to hang out with some other "hard core" types, they at least would tell you if they didn't like you, but if they did like you, well...they liked you a lot. They would share knowledge and the best of them were VERY smart men [who used the manual] and loved to ride.
We all know guys with 30k "choppers" who can't change spark plugs, they are not part of the equation. Never were. Don't feel anything towards them, 'cause as we say in coaching,
"they don't know they don't know"
but by the same token, can you criticise Arlen Ness or any of that bunch for doing what they love and making money doing it? Just not my cuppa tea...
Seems like "we" all should know that "brotherhood" means blood, not money. In the old time biker community it used to be a pretty serious deal, now it may mean that "I have the same sort of expensive bike in my garage as you do" [maybe next to the John Deere lawn tractor] But so what? Let them live, I say, think of all the cheap bikes and parts there will be when they decide to go back to golf full time!!! [nothing wrong with golf either, just not for me]
Heck, anyone with the $$$ can own a bike, itsa free country. But you don't hafta acknowledge them. Besides, I have lotsa people I consider brothers who don't ride anything.
It's like anything else. People that "know" are deserving of respect. "Dis" the others, life's too short.
I like flat black and I use spray bomb when I paint, can't see putting 2 grand into paint when it can be spent on performance or reliabilty, but that's me.
Buell seems to have found the essence of something that I dig, a fast V-twin that handles and has lotsa torque...gee, that sounds like a Sportster ad from 30 years ago!!! Does this make me a bad person?} |
Hotrodsportster
| | Posted on Monday, August 22, 2005 - 02:06 pm: |
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Nope
Just more enlightened than most |
Ceejay
| | Posted on Monday, August 22, 2005 - 09:35 pm: |
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Money is always good, especially when it helps the R&D team make better scoots, just wish it didn't give certain folks the need to feel holier than thou because they spent more money than I did on what amounts to garage art, must keep fist away from jaw, must keep fist away from jaw, must keep fist away from jaw... |
Denfromphilly
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 23, 2005 - 10:31 am: |
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Yo Silas, I was not much of a gold winger either but one of my brothers had an old one he kept trying to get me to buy. I resisted as I had always rode Triumphs and Nortons, my other brothers Sportie, my other brothers softail a couple different Kawasaki's, Honda's etc. What was I going to do with a big boat? It finally came down to my brother saying "give me a dollar for it so I can get the room in my garage to buy this antique moto guzzi with a seized motor". I always wanted an old guzzi to ride so I bought it. Never did give him the dollar but I did get him a pack of cigarettes one day so I figure we're even. I always wanted to strip down the GW so it loses about 200 lbs but the bags are convenient too. GW's are interesting, they are a bit top heavy in parking lots and take a bit of finesse at low speeds but get em going and you can throw them into turns like a dirt bike. I scrape the floor boards on mine quite often, it will do whatever you ask it to do.
I never rode more that 300 miles in a day but I ride just about every day and have a few different bikes. I ride in the rain, I ride in the winter so long as the roads are not covered with snow and ice. I just like to ride. I would love to buy an old rat Harley. When I go to my local HD dealer I take my sons little CB200 that's 30 years old with flat paint and park it right out front to leave a few oil spots and mark my territory. Some of the yuppies love it and some hate it like a sacrilege.
I can understand the chopper guys that make money and many bikes are real art but some guys just hype. There is one episode of monster garage and JJ has a stroker 350 motor that he built but never used. He brags about the god like perfection and power of the motor but it's seized and never ran. They take it apart and there are copious metal shavings in the cylinders and the stroker crank is too long for the block!! The counterweights hit the casting! What an idiot, why is this guy some famous motorhead? They run it and it leaks coolant and after two tries he turns his back and walks away. What a big baby.....Den |
Silas_clone
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 23, 2005 - 12:03 pm: |
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Show biz...JJ's got himself a pretty hot squeeze, he don't need a stroker!
I would give ya $1 for the Gold Wing, did you see that movie elsewhere on the BADWEB of those two riding the "Dragon" on GDUB's?
I have my Sporty up for grabs, 3K for you.
"Chopper Bake-off" or whatever that show is called made Indian Larry into a celeb, so those shows can't be all bad. I really enjoy the Tuttles |
Denfromphilly
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 23, 2005 - 01:40 pm: |
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Yeah, I admired the Indian Larry show and the Tuttles are so dysfunctional I wonder if it's scripted. They do a lot of artistic stuff I admire, I really laughed when they put the Shelby bike on a dyno and blew it up. The chopper build off show had some young asian guy that built this scoot with hydraulic/pneumatic suspension that had no kickstand, just settled down on the frame. It was one cool innovative ride. No I didn't see the GDUB's Dragon...can you point the way? |
Natexlh1000
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 23, 2005 - 02:35 pm: |
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I dropped by with my '79XLH this one time at Sheldon's and there was an older female employee outside with others smoking.
She asked "what kind of bike is that?"
My reply? "It's a HONDA."
She said "oh. Looks nice"
TOOL. ha ha!
I don't think she works there anymore >
I don't think she survived the ribbing aftermath. |
Silas_clone
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 23, 2005 - 09:37 pm: |
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Den, trying to find it, maybe someone else knows?
It's somewhere on this site.
Nate, it is amazing...but it happens a lot.
When I go to get parts, I look for the oldest guy in the place, then keep my fingers crossed. |
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