| Author | Message | ||
     Gregtonn |
Do you really want to know why covid-19 is spiking in Florida? https://www.foxnews.com/health/coronavirus-update- florida-labs-not-reporting-negative-test-results-r eport Not something that will be widely reported. G | ||
| Aesquire |
Heard this on the radio this pm. But have NOT found confirmation! Please correct this RUMOUR or post confirmation. ....CDC announced the spikes in southern vacation states are driven by tourists from the Northern ( blue ) states. FL, AB, AZ, TX, etc. have spikes as you'd expect when travel increases. .... Unconfirmed rumour from biased political talk radio. Makes sense to me that you expect a rise in cases as: travel increases people have parties businesses reopen Sporting crowds Street crowds AND Individual relaxation of social distancing & mask use & hand washing & etc. Etc. Etc. All the above change the numbers. It would be easier to see the patterns if there was a spaced out in time phenomenon, but we got bars & restaurants opening, vacations, ( usually a dominant factor ) and summer party time. And...?? | ||
| Fireboltwillie |
Aesquire, yes, the tourists have had a big effect on the virus here. i live on the Panhandle, Santa Rosa Beach, a big tourist/vacation spot. all of the counties here have seen a spike in cases since memorial day, when the short term rental ban was lifted and the bars started getting packed. | ||
| Whatever |
Gregtonn... hate to break it to you, but two negatives don't make a positive. DeSantis said it was beat. Trump said it was beat. Stupid, science denying idiots listened. There are more stupid people in Florida per capita than anywhere else in North America. Case closed. | ||
| Whatever |
Oh and fyi... nobody in the public will know now what is really going on since all data is going around the CDC and straight to the White House. Healthcare systems are walking a fine line with HIPPA and data has to be devoid of any identifiable personal data. We are likely to see a spin that "things are getting better" from POTUS, when it simply is not true. More people will die as a result. | ||
| Gregtonn |
Char, Not sure what your logic is in referencing two negatives but a lie that inflates positive cases by 1,000% is a false spike. There are more stupid people in Florida per capita than anywhere else in North America. Case closed. Source? Are you Florida resident? You certainly sound like you would fit into that category. G | ||
| Aesquire |
Hey! Ad hominum attack. Insult instead of facts. Gregtonn auto loses. Apology and intelligence expected. Try kindness and logic to counteract apparently ignorant parrotting of Party Propaganda. Might just be a misunderstanding. And I'm waiting for an answer to my non political question. Re: therapies. (Message edited by Aesquire on July 16, 2020) | ||
| Gregtonn |
Ah, the over used and largely misunderstood ad hominem (please note correct spelling) accusation. The ad hominem attack was Char's statement about the people of Florida. Without that my observation is totally innocent. G  | ||
| Ratbuell |
The VIRUS is not beat; until we have a medicinal cure, it will remain. I truly believe the overall DANGER, however, can be mitigated. Poor case reporting not withstanding (FL is inflating numbers; neglecting to report negative test results; and according to the Hopkins Covid Tracker website is one of the few states that is not posting "recovered" numbers...hmmm....), this virus does not kill near as many people as we were initially told it would. We are finding more and more cases where people are either a) asymptomatic, or b) mildly symptomatic. Case counts are up, yes - primarily among the young, who HAVE travelled to FL in droves as soon as things opened up (my mother lives in FL, so I know from her direct involvement). As we are all learning, the young are not nearly as susceptible to this virus - you have to have a co-morbidity for it to be truly dangerous to you. And although case counts are skyrocketing...death tolls continue to decline, hospitalizations even in the worst areas are at a static rate and in most areas are still on the decline. More cases. Less fatalities. One size does not fit all. If you are "at risk", be responsible and protect yourself. If you are the government, step the hell back and let those of us who are NOT at risk, get back to our lives, and our economy, and our way of life. I am curious - what is the true science behind these lockdowns? Please tell. Because to this point, all I have seen is speculation; models that are so far off that they'd fail a third grade science class exam for lack of procedure; and abject horror from the mainstream media. Potential medicines are pooh-poo'd - regardless of potential viability - just because the White House endorses them. The public at large is not given the opportunity to get information on their own, without a political slant. So...where is the science? Please, I would love to know some hard facts. | ||
| Tpehak |
The economy is dead. | ||
| Whatever |
I have spent plenty of time in Florida observing its residents.... and the obfuscation of data on a PUBLIC health crisis has already started.  | ||
| Whatever |
Tpehak... not if you work in healthcare... | ||
| Whatever |
Hospitalizations and fatalities are skyrocketing in NC. The data is not publicly available because of HIPA, bureaucracy, and politics. At least that is the data from my employer, which again, is a world class medical institution. They update us with facts every two hours. Even Johns Hopkins I would expect has lag time in their reporting. Positive reported should be a simple enough number to track. Reporting as a % is just further obfuscation. (Message edited by Whatever on July 16, 2020) (Message edited by Whatever on July 16, 2020) | ||
| Whatever |
So Johns Hopkins website is reporting 55% of what the actual deaths are where I am at. So look at that website and double it and that is much closer to the truth...  (Message edited by Whatever on July 16, 2020) | ||
| Court |
>>>Source? Are you Florida resident? You certainly sound like you would fit into that category. I am in Florida . . . and I think Char's statement may be an understatement. I also think the folks from The White House AND the CDC would meet all the entry qualifications to allow testing to be waived for entry. I fled here in early February and am going to flee back to NY. Good news . . . I am a Global Idiot and welcome in 4 locations. :-) | ||
| Ratbuell |
OK, so that's some numbers, and some potential politicking (false reporting). Case counts are fudged, and have been for months. "If it looks like COVID, just call it COVID". I ask again - where is the science? Hard numbers - how many people get it, how many people recover, how many people go downhill and/or die? FWIW, the Hopkins site updates daily. What do we know about transmission rates? Do we have scientific evidence (not political...SCIENTIFIC) that cheesy cloth face coverings that partially obscure mouth and nose, actually slow this thing down? Do we have scientific evidence that closing schools and businesses saves enough lives, to make it worth the damage to our economy, and to the mental state of the affected business owners, and children who will not be socialized because they're being cooped up and kept away from other people for...how long? We've been dealing with this thing for going on five months now. We're still pissing up a rope when it comes to these things - there's no evidence for anything at all at this point, only speculation and theories. Show me some hard facts, and some actual scientific data. Please. Not case counts, because we know they can be fudged ("if it looks like COVID, just call it COVID...and you'll get your funding"). Scientific data about how it spreads. What's the R0, based on our current testing levels (not guesswork that "there may be this many people out there who have it"). What's the acutal findings about virus life outside a host - hard surfaces. Soft surfaces. UV exposure. Nobody talks about any of those FACTS. "Wear a mask, don't go to work, don't go to the beach, don't go outdoors, stay 6 feet apart". That's all we're told. That...is NOT science. Five months, and we have zero science. I'm finding it more and more difficult to believe that we have to shut down Western Civilization, over a virus that supposedly can't be cured/medicated/killed...but we can stop it by putting cloth over half our faces (with NO actual seals, mind you, and plenty of gaps where anything can get in or out), and washing our hands, and spraying things with Lysol, and not going to work. Again, please - share some of the science. Some of the facts. Please. Not about cases. Not about "rates". How about some facts about the virus itself? Y'know...so we can decide what precautions actually need to be taken? Because right now I'll swear the "cure" is killing as many people as the disease itself. Riots. Suicides. Murders. Violence. If people were at work? They wouldn't have TIME to do all this other crap...and they wouldn't be SCARED for their future, or feeling the need to commit crimes in order to provide for themselves (or, because they're bored and can't think of anything better to do). I'd love to hear some facts. SCIENTIFIC facts. | ||
| Hootowl |
“since all data is going around the CDC and straight to the White House” Sigh. The data is going to HHS not the white house. CDC is under HHS. CDC is not publishing fast enough, so HHS wants the data. CDC is still receiving the data, and is free to wait a week, as they’ve been doing, to publish it. TDS on display. | ||
| Court |
Good . . . it's a group not known for doing anything well, fast, efficiently or honestly. They have a pronounced number of places to choose from that bring much credibility to the process in the eyes of the American people. Here's a sweep of some news outlets . . Probably doesn't help that Debra Brix and Co. worded the story like they did . . .
It could be going to the Denny's out on the interstate for all we know. | ||
| Hootowl |
“Hospital data on coronavirus patients will now be rerouted to the Trump administration” There’s some twisted thinking. CDC, a unit of HHS, is just as much a part of the Trump administration as HHS. One could make the argument that the hospitals have always been reporting the data to the Trump administration. The more truthful interpretation is that they are giving the data to CDC’s parent organization so that it can be more quickly consumed and disseminated. I suspect the author is biased. | ||
| Whatever |
Rat, the problem is that Johns Hopkins looks to be at least three weeks behind. They are probably relying on coroner reports, which, as you know can take time. There is no real time reporting available to the public. Period. I would have absolutely no problem taking Johns Hopkins as fact if I didn't get first hand data from work. It isn't falsifying records if you actually take the time to verify everything... which I am sure they do. Transmission data will probably be a few years out when there's an accurate antibody test. There isn't. Sorry to be the deliverer of bad news, but it is what it is. When this is all said and done, this info will be debated for decades, maybe centuries. Oh and the thought of Court hanging out in Florida... lololololol (Message edited by Whatever on July 16, 2020) | ||
| Sifo |
So...where is the science? Please, I would love to know some hard facts.  That's rich! I posted plenty of videos that had hard facts, that were complete with links to the scientific studies being discussed. These videos were done by an epidemiologist! Specifically, you, Blake, and Greg completely dismissed all of that information. It wasn't what you wanted to hear, so you just crapped on the messenger. Now you are hearing it from someone with first had knowledge, and you are crapping on that information too. It's people like you who dismiss the reality of the situation, refuse to do simple things to mitigate the threat, like wearing a mask in public, that will ensure that states will take far more draconian measures. You still claim it's not as deadly as they said, but we are in the 138,000 140,000 range depending on what numbers you are looking at. I seem to remember estimates that were dismissed as pure fantasy had 150,000 as the low end by the time it's over. The simple fact is, it's going to blow right past that number. It's far from over. You could see that if you were to pull you head from your ass. It's far more than just deaths too. It's been known for a months that people with mild cases were getting permanent lung damage. This first came out from a DR. that certifies commercial divers that had to tell a bunch of them that their carriers are over, after a companies dive teams got hit. It's been confirmed with other studies now. We are now finding that even people that were asymptomatic are showing permanent lung damage in CT scans. They are documenting people with damage, not only to the lungs, but also the heart, liver, and brain. Despite, what you claim to know, that if you aren't old, or with comorbidities, you will be just fine, we are finding out that health people from all age groups are having their organs damaged. To make things even worse, there are confirmed cases of people who are getting infected a second time, just months after being cleared of the virus. It seems, that for many at least, the antibodies are not retained for long. Those are some scientific facts that are coming out, but most people are too caught up in the politics to have the least clue about it. It absolutely boggles my mind what passes for good information in this thread. The "Plandemic" video? Please!!! Endless stories from the American Thinker. Nice site for one sided political commentary (which I do like BTW), but certainly not where I would head for sound medical advise. A video on the Prager-U youtube channel featuring a "DR." who is flaunting right wing political pins on his lab coat? Hey, Dennis Prager is great, but it's the wrong place to get good info about this right now. To make things even worse, I seem to find myself in solid agreement with Char! Now I really do fear that it's the apocalypse! | ||
| Aesquire |
only half the folk I know in Florida are crazy. So Char is right there.  I no longer care about the politics so much, since 80+% of anything I read about Trump is lies and I don't buy his stuff much either. I repeat the question to someone in the business. What therapies seem to be effective in your experience? | ||
| Whatever |
To make things even worse, I seem to find myself in solid agreement with Char! Now I really do fear that it's the apocalypse! I was thinking the same thing... lol So, let's put it this way... a billion dollar health care institution that has world renowned medical experts and epidemiologists, and a team of at least 60 lawyers, and are absolutely terrified of law suits, is protecting almost EVERYONE at the institution and ANYONE who visits by making them screen for temperature, wear the surgical (disposable) masks, wash hands and use hand sanitizer... but somehow they are all lying and just pulling data out of their butts to be mean. Like I said, I have been going on hospital wards with covid positive folks (albiet they are isolated) for three months and have no symptoms... but, no, wearing a surgical mask is too much to ask for the general public... absolutely astounding and utterly ridiculous. Also, something to think about... a serious concussion (which I had about three years ago) puts me at a much higher risk for a stroke if I end up getting carona... but, somehow the medical community is trying to pull one over on me by having me follow the well publicized CDC guidelines... I knew I shouldn't start posting on here...  (Message edited by Whatever on July 16, 2020) (Message edited by Whatever on July 16, 2020) | ||
| Tpehak |
Government hides real fatalities numbers. The fatalities numbers are skyrocketing but government and another sources lower the deaths numbers to prevent panic. | ||
| Hootowl |
Here you go. Long, boring, and informative. https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.05.13 .20101253v2.full.pdf | ||
| 86129squids |
Char- thanks, very large thanks. It's too rare a treat to read your posts, and I appreciate your input. My sister has been notified that she'll be returning to work within the next month or so, as a hospital chaplain in AR. DANG if I don't wish she'd retire. Worries the living hell out of me. | ||
| Aesquire |
"Wearing a mask in an epidemic is an IQ test. And you people are flunking it." -Karl @InRange. His comments about people who left rude comments on his video, complaining he wore an oppression mask while running an action shooting competition. ( meaning you move between targets ) All invited were asked to wear masks, all who chose to come did. Safest gathering in the state.  He even notes the irony that in THAT group of competitors, if the match required WW1 gas masks to up the difficulty level and teach historical context, they'd all love it. None of the competitors complained. Just internet troll fools. | ||
| Whatever |
Brad. Your sister will be fine if she remains vigilant. It is easy to get complacent. You just simply cannot let your guard down. Not for one minute. I was potentially thinking of doing something that I shouldn't... and then I realized it was just a ridiculous risk to take. Then, every little thing you feel you are wondering if you got "it". Headache for more than one day? I was checking my temperature two to three times a day... (hello hot flashes!)... runny nose from allergies... maybe it is'nt allergies? Indigestion? Maybe something I ate, maybe I will be dead soon. Loose stool... look it up, is that a symptom too? Really, there is no better thing than common sense. Also, food for thought, I just assume that I am covid positive and asymptomatic. I wear the mask so your children and grandparents don't end up dead. Yes... dead. Dead and never coming back. Dead and you didn't get a chance to say goodbye. Dead. Alone. With the only people interacting with them being entirely unable to communicate because they have a Powered Air Purifying Respirator with a hood, googles, N95 mask, full body suit, gloves, shoe covers, etc. It isn't that things are being hidden from the public (at least from the medical side), it is just that this is such an extraordinary situation, even the best of the best of the best in the business is figuring things out as they go. And there is no way to have any kind of real quality control on data on the ground because things are changing from day to day. During our lockdown there were a certain number of admissions, positive tests and deaths. Then we started to open back up, and these numbers tripled within one week. ONE WEEK!!! THEY KEEP GOING UP!!! No one knows when it will even out and go down. The lockdown provided the time to get procedures in place, get people trained up (some folks had to be moved around to different units), people to figure out what they should do with their family (some folks are not even going home in order to protect their family... they are living in hotels)... also special negative pressure air systems had to be put on some rooms. Covid pantients have to have a special type of air flow and filters. They had a certain number that filled up and they had to build more. And, the deaths are part of a bureaucratic process. Insurance, health care, medical privacy... and no tools for folks to deal with this kind of data all play a part. Like I said after looking at the Johns Hopkins site... they are running three to four weeks behind what is happening on the ground. I thought maybe they would be a week behind, but they are essentially reporting numbers from early to mid June. The general public doesn't understand metadata and the scientific process, either. The respectable places have to vet the data, and make sure they are not putting something out that isn't accurate. They can get sued for that. They are not calling a covid death just because... oh, hey, it might be covid. We are talking about accurate testing that they do turn around in 24 hours. The lab had to find new people to learn how to do the tests... more folks to move in from other departments that learned new skills and processes and had to get efficient and accurate in record time. If a patient is positive, there are procedures, PPE, medical waste disposal. Everything has to be incinerated, and even where it is incinerated, they have to have special protections in place. These processes didn't exist before this crisis. Then they HAVE to have a medical examiner review everything for the cause of death. How do you train someone to be a medical examiner in a few weeks??? Hell if I know... Soon Florida will have overwhelmed morgues like happened in New York. Can you imagine? Then, when someone survives, there is the effects of folks who were basically in a medically induced coma for 2 to 4 months so they could be intubated and treated without dying from a panic attack induced heart attack. Also, if they are starving for oxygen, it makes sense to shut down a person's non-essential functions. People are having to learn to walk again. People are having to say goodbye to their loved ones over Zoom. Visitors were not allowed in the building for the first 12 weeks, unless, of course it was a minor in critical condition. But people are so wrapped up in their own out of touch narrative that they think, oh, this could never happen to me. It does and it can. | ||
| Tpehak |
Things are getting worst from day to day. More we know about coronavirus more we embrace the fact there is no escape. It is mankind devastation. (Message edited by TPEHAK on July 16, 2020) | ||
| Whisperstealth |
Char, I more than realize "This could happen to me." I firmly believe most in The United States of America will get the virus at some point, including me. Given the poor state of my health I'm 'High Risk'. I just refuse to live in fear or with a spray bottle constantly in my hand. (Message edited by Whisperstealth on July 16, 2020) |
