| Author | Message | ||
     Greatlaker |
http://jacksonville.com/breaking-news/2015-05-13/s tory/jeb-bush-struggles-clarify-stance-wisdom-inva ding-iraq Struggling with the shadows of Iraq, Jeb Bush said Tuesday he would have made a different decision than his brother to invade Iraq in 2003 had he known what he does now about flaws in the nation's intelligence. But he didn't say what that decision would have been. Bush's comments came as he tried to clarify his stance on the unpopular war started in 2003 by President George W. Bush. Yet his murky remarks underscore the challenge he faces in managing his family's foreign policy legacy while setting out his own approach to world affairs. Several of his likely rivals for the Republican presidential nomination leapt at the chance to definitively answer a question that Bush did not. In a radio interview Tuesday, Bush said it was clear there were mistakes in reports claiming Iraq had weapons of mass destruction. Had he known about the faulty intelligence, Bush said, he would have made a different decision about sending tens of thousands of U.S. troops into Iraq. "I don't know what that decision would have been," Bush said on Sean Hannity's radio show. "That's a hypothetical." The radio interview came a day after Fox News broadcast an interview with Bush in which he sidestepped the question about whether he would have sent U.S. troops to Iraq, knowing what is now known about the intelligence that led his brother to invade. Hannity made a point to ask Bush if he wanted to clarify his answer from the previous interview, and Bush replied that he had "interpreted the question wrong." A follow-up query from the conservative host, repeating the original question, led to Bush's "I don't know" answer. Bush is on the cusp of formally launching his campaign, and some of his rivals for the nomination seized on the opportunity to draw a distinction with him on Iraq — a war once strongly supported by the GOP. Kentucky Sen. Rand Paul told The Associated Press it's "a real problem if he can't articulate what he would have done differently." Paul, who stands out in the GOP field by supporting a smaller U.S. military footprint around the world, has said it was a mistake to topple Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein, pointing to the chaos in Iraq that followed the U.S. invasion. New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie said going into Iraq was ultimately the wrong decision. "If we knew then what we know now, and I were the president of the United States, I wouldn't have gone to war," Christie said in an interview with CNN. In a pointed jab at Bush's evasion, he added that he wanted to "directly answer" the reporter's question "'cause that's what I do." Said Texas Sen. Ted Cruz, "Knowing what we know now, of course we wouldn't go into Iraq." Former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee declined to address the question directly, but in a statement praised soldiers who "poured their sweat and blood across Iraq." "Unfortunately, they were let down by poor intelligence, a botched military strategy and an Iraqi people more interested in pointing fingers and placing blame than taking control of their future," Huckabee said. Not all Republican White House hopefuls have disowned the decision to invade Iraq. Florida Sen. Marco Rubio defended the war earlier this year, saying "the world is a better place because Saddam Hussein doesn't run Iraq." A September 2014 AP-GfK poll found that 71 percent of Americans said they think history will judge the war as a failure. Among Republicans, that assessment was even more prevalent, with 76 percent saying the war would be seen a failure. Most of the GOP White House hopefuls argue that President Barack Obama overcorrected after ending the long and expensive war by withdrawing American forces, yet they are mindful that many Americans remain skeptical of large-scale U.S. combat efforts abroad. With the U.S. back in Iraq in a more limited way to help fight Islamic State militants, Obama's successor is all but sure to confront lingering fallout from the original invasion and its aftermath. Tackling America's difficult history in Iraq is most challenging for Bush, given his family ties to the war. He has sought to distance himself from his brother's foreign policy in recent months, even as he relies on many of the same advisers and cites his brother someone he relies on for advice. Democrats had their reckoning with the Iraq war during the 2008 presidential election. Obama's early opposition to the war helped him distinguish himself from Hillary Rodham Clinton in the Democratic primary. Clinton, who voted to authorize the war as a senator, has since said that based on the revised intelligence, she would not have voted for the war. | ||
| Figorvonbuellingham |
Two words in the title pretty much sum up all Bushs'...."Bush struggles" | ||
| Pwnzor |
would have made a different decision than his brother to invade Iraq in 2003 had he known what he does now Right... just like I would have avoided going to prison if I had known the future. Idiot. | ||
| Mackja |
Our foreign policy in the middle east has been screwed up for decades, and the current idiot is just making things a lot worse. Unfortunately we have not fought our last war their yet | ||
| Pwnzor |
Poor, poor Obama... only 2 of the 6 Arab leaders he invited to his summit are showing up... they would rather go look at horses instead. | ||
| Aesquire |
Jeb is a dishonest POS. His minions have made it plain that they'd prefer Hillary to Cruz as President. Do I need go further? With 20/20 hindsight, ( or the rational objections of most of the centrists ) EVERY foreign policy effort of this regime was wrong. The dead pile up in Ukraine, Iraq, Syria, Libya...... the list is going to be endless. Barry, Hillary, and the treasonous Kerry have given the planet ISIS, the rise of the Barry supported Muslim Brotherhood, and before the presidential debates have started, a Nuclear Iran, and the need to keep people indoors to avoid the radioactive fallout. Possibly to avoid the election. I've read post apocalypse novels for decades, I didn't think I'd be in one. I do now. | ||
| Sifo |
Plenty of reasons based on current events why I wouldn't vote for Jeb. If you really have to go back 15 year or so to find a reason, who does that say something about? | ||
| Zane |
I lived in Florida when Jeb was governor and we actually had good state government while he was in office. That said, I won't vote for him in the primary. He seems to have shifted left on issues that I care about. | ||
| Pwnzor |
Agreed... Jeb's not the guy. | ||
| Teeps |
I won't vote for another Bush... end of story. | ||
| Hootowl |
Yes. Enough with the dynasties. Kennedy, Bush, Clinton... | ||
| Sifo |
It's a shame Clinton wont get grilled on this issue after having voted for the authorization to go to war in Iraq. Who deserves more grilling, the one who was involved in going to war, or the one who has a relative who was involved in going to war? | ||
| Aesquire |
Yet doubtful as the decision to free Iraq from tyranny may have been, & certainly I think George messed up the aftermath, abandonment of a people who welcomed our aid after we freed them then fought both AQ and Saddam's relatives and won, must be the most evil done in this country since the D party abandoned the Vietnamese to tyranny. More evil since it was guns smuggled by Hillary & Barack that armed the lunatics who today run slave markets and brothels in an Iraq we have responsibility for. I'm not ready to believe Barry intended ISIS to conquer the region, but if so capital punishment is far too lenient | ||
| Greatlaker |
Get your facts right Aesquire. The United States left Iraq because the democratically elected government of Iraq did not want U.S. troops on the ground in Iraq. Iraq refused to sign another SOFA agreement which would have protected U.S. troops from judicial persecution by the new Iraqi shia government. "Without a SOFA, any American soldier in Iraq could be tried in Iraqi courts for anything those courts found a soldier to be plausibly guilty of." Obama's failure to have a SOFA agreement ratified by the Iraqi government has more to do with Iraqi politics and Shia/Iranian political wrangling than anything else. George Bush created a democratic monster in shia dominated Iraq. Obama was simply playing by the rules. "Given that the U.S. would never agree to leave its people to the mercy of an Iraqi court, Iraqi demands for this condition seemed to be a calculated plan of Shia politicians who needed America out of the way in order to finally advance Iranian hegemony in Iraq. But recent reporting by The New York Times’ Michael Gordon paints a more complicated picture of U.S. incompetence and disengagement. Most notably, the Obama administration’s insistence that any Status of Forces Agreement be ratified by Iraq’s parliament set the stage for the inevitable failure of any agreement. Simply put, while a number of Iraqi political leaders may have privately wished for continued American involvement to serve as a buffer and broker between both domestic rivals and neighboring regimes, far fewer were willing to support this position in a public, contentious debate. No one wants to be regarded as an American stooge in the prideful arena of Iraqi politics. Backing parliamentarians into a corner by demanding public ratification doomed a new SOFA to failure." http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2011/1 0/us-troops-are-leaving-because-iraq-doesnt-want-t hem-there/247174/ http://cnsnews.com/news/article/terence-p-jeffrey/ obama-pulling-all-us-troops-out-iraq-was-not-my-de cision “Under the previous administration, we had turned over the country to a sovereign, democratically elected Iraqi government,” Obama said. “In order for us to maintain troops in Iraq, we needed the invitation of the Iraqi government and we needed assurances that our personnel would be immune from prosecution if, for example, they were protecting themselves and ended up getting in a firefight with Iraqis, that they wouldn’t be hauled before an Iraqi judicial system. “And the Iraqi government, based on its political considerations, in part because Iraqis were tired of a U.S. occupation, declined to provide us those assurances,” Obama said. “And on that basis, we left. We had offered to leave additional troops. So when you hear people say, do you regret, Mr. President, not leaving more troops, that presupposes that I would have overridden this sovereign government that we had turned the keys back over to and said, you know what, you’re democratic, you’re sovereign, except if I decide that it’s good for you to keep 10,000 or 15,000 or 25,000 Marines in your country, you don’t have a choice, which would have kind of run contrary to the entire argument we were making about turning over the country back to Iraqis, an argument not just made by me, but made by the previous administration. “So let’s just be clear: The reason that we did not have a follow-on force in Iraq was because the Iraqis were--a majority of Iraqis did not want U.S. troops there, and politically they could not pass the kind of laws that would be required to protect our troops in Iraq,” said Obama. | ||
| Reepicheep |
I guess Obama didn't have a pen or a telephone or any way to do what he thought was right. Darn those laws and constitution anyway. He sure doesn't care about ours, I wonder why he felt so compelled to follow their so promptly. Its almost like he was looking for any excuse to get out at the earliest opportunity. | ||
| Tankhead |
Ok. I have to say that if we get a Clinton or a Bush again that is the last straw for America. You will have to realize at that point that it really doesn't matter who you vote for. The corporations, the congressman, senators and the military industrial complex all win. We, at that point, can sit back and let them stick it up our asses with new new false flag event. If you think 9/11 was bad just wait. I can't believe I sound like old cityxslicker but man I am tired of it. Look what happen to the people in military, government, media who tried to speak out, they got whacked. Get rid of the electorate. Get rid of the patriot act. Any politician who voted for the bill needs to go. Challenge voter fraud. Never vote again for a Washington insiders and abolish the damn lobbyists. The founding fathers warned us about the bank and power. What a ••••••• mess. | ||
| Tankhead |
And while I am at it..... Let's get our asses out of every middle east country and every other country now. RIGHT NOW. Stop paying ISRAEL 8 million dollars in aid a day and let them fight their own wars by them selves without our support. Take that money and military and educate the boys that come home and take care of the veterans who need proper medical care. ••••••• sick of it. | ||
| Airbozo |
Tankhead: I am amazed that it would take the election of another Bush or Clinton for you to reach this reality. Your vote for president has not made a difference in a very long time. The people with money, get the person/party in office they want. The rest of the people blaming solely Obama for this mess must have just woke up cuz their party didn't get elected. Really? It's taken a long time for this country to get in the position it is. Longer than one administration. | ||
| Two_seasons |
It's been in the making, the "progressive movement", for almost 100 years now. It's been moving faster since Kennedy was assassinated. | ||
| Aesquire |
Tankhead, how about we double Israel's aid and turn them loose? Not going to happen with this regime's glorious leader, but a thought. Of course we'd have to actually become energy independent since pulling out of the middle east leaves all the oil to Putin and his allies. But if you want to watch the world burn, by all means let's go isolationist. Greatlaker's version of history is fed him by the folk who support the Muslim Brotherhood and rape gangs in the streets. Anyway you cut it...Jeb's a jerk. | ||
| Pwnzor |
Obama was simply playing by the rules.   | ||
| Ferris_von_bueller |
I'd take Bush over Clinton any day | ||
| Aesquire |
http://www.amazon.com/CTHULHU-Election-Vinyl-Bumpe r-Sticker/dp/B00MLFI7SY | ||
| Tankhead |
Tankhead: I am amazed that it would take the election of another Bush or Clinton for you to reach this reality. Your vote for president has not made a difference in a very long time. The people with money, get the person/party in office they want. read again I will re post: read S L O W L E Y AND COMPREHEND!!! Ok. I have to say that if we get a Clinton or a Bush again that is the last straw for America. You will have to realize at that point that it really doesn't matter who you vote for. The corporations, the congressman, senators and the military industrial complex all win. We, at that point, can sit back and let them stick it up our asses with new new false flag event. If you think 9/11 was bad just wait. I can't believe I sound like old cityxslicker but man I am tired of it. Look what happen to the people in military, government, media who tried to speak out, they got whacked. Get rid of the electorate. Get rid of the patriot act. Any politician who voted for the bill needs to go. Challenge voter fraud. Never vote again for a Washington insiders and abolish the damn lobbyists. The founding fathers warned us about the bank and power. What a ••••••• mess | ||
| Tankhead |
Yeah aesquire lets become less energy dependent. •••• it. between us and canada we can deal for awhile. As far as Israel.... the more I learn the less I am impressed. and quite honestly, have you taken a look at who has been in office behind the office..... if you know what I mean...for the last well let's say, 20 years...... take a look.... not so glorious.... open your eyes. it's a google search away........ | ||
| Tankhead |
Turn Israel loose???????? I think they have been doing just fine loose loose loose. I think it's time to re think that bullshit. And stop the poor anti semite crap. we are doing exactly what they want at the cost of our own men. politically correctness needs to be flushed down the ••••••• toilet. 8MILLION DOLLARS A DAY | ||
| Tankhead |
USS liberty........ go ahead and defend it I dare ya. the soldiers on the ship don't agree. | ||
| Tankhead |
OUR SOLDIERS | ||
| Aesquire |
By all means keep in mind a nineteen sixty seven shameful act. I won't ask if we should forgive the British for the eighteen eleven invasion, that would be silly. I'm a bit less inclined to forgive the Russian leaders for all the lives lost in Korea, Vietnam, Africa, and the middle east. ... where they to this day support the enemies of Western civilization. Killing our soldiers. Today. You may be more cynical than me. That takes some doing. Unfortunately we could be independent of the arab oil, but that is not the policy of the current U.S. government. It wants us to be broke paying for terrorists and taxed to death to save the planet from ourselves. Unemployment has gone up for years while the apologist leftist media supports this regime as they trash the military, screw the veterans, our allies and the rest of civilization. Get rid of the electorate? I'm guessing you mean the electoral college? I disagree. All on board with stopping voting fraud and bribe reform. | ||
| Aesquire |
http://www.pjtv.com/special/vodkapundit-600/ So, Mr Aesquire, If you knew then what you know now, would you have invaded Iraq? Answer: Yes idjit reporter, I would have. The actions of President Bush, who let the military experts run the show, led to one of the most one sided victories over a bigger foe in history. Remember Baghdad Bob insisting the U.S was on the run while in the background you could hear U.S. tank guns polishing off the cream of Saddam's elite guard? I do. We freed over 50 million people from tyranny. Good call, and Hillary Clinton AGREED. Now, the after victory, where we rebuilt Iraq at tremendous cost, fought over cities multiple times, and left a corrupt regime in Baghdad, those I would have done very differently. For one thing, Saddam's tribe fought for the Nazis in WW2, fought for the Soviets after the war, and were one of 3 major problems we faced in a Free Iraq. They wanted to rule again. We should have made it crystal clear that wasn't going to happen, and held their home region with an iron fist. We NOW KNOW we should not have disarmed the Iraqi Army. Or the Iraqi people. We needed to purge the Iraq army of Saddam's loyalists, and put the Iraqi army to the task of keeping down Saddam's tribe, and securing the cities. Then I would have addressed the political situation. Hand Iraq a turnkey Constitution, with first and foremost freedom of religion speech, and self defense. Make it clear there would no longer be a Sunni and Shia Iraq, with one lording it over another. The post WW2 Japan model of transition would seem to be the best. Absolute hell on corruption, and pride in being the One functioning nation in the region. ( besides Israel ) I would have asked the Kurds to hold off on independence for the next shoe any idiot could see drop. The second enemy was, of course, Iran & Syria. With the Iraqi Army and police keeping peace in the cities, I would have moved our troops to an interdict position near the borders. Iranian supplies would be destroyed before they reached Saddam's tribe. AQ and Iranian fighters would be stopped, killed, and burned with the smoke in sight of the border stations. If the "moderate" muslims insist AQ is not Islam,then the defilement of their corpses is no concern to them. Own it or quit would be the choice they had. They would quit. One day after absolute proof that Iran was invading Iraq, I would eliminate the Iranian leaders, the Revolutionary guard, and cripple the armed forces so they had no power to attack anyone. I would invite the UN to come in and oversee the election of a new Iranian government, with, again, a charter of freedom of religion, death to corruption, and and end to all stupid sanctions. Since Iran had declared war on the U.S. during the Carter regime, when he & his idiot State dept. gave the green light to the coup, ( giving the people who declared war on us power ) there'd be no need to consult with the UN before eliminating the leaders of Iran. With Iran & Iraq no longer a threat, the Kurds could have their own homeland, and Turkey would just have to suck it up. I don't know if the current islamofascist palace building loon would be in charge after that. The Kurds would be our BFF. And mean it. Syria, because of it's Soviet warm water port would be a tougher subject. I'd still have the funeral pyres for the AQ coming across the border, but would negotiate with Russia for their port, and their control over Assad. Also the Russians would be publicly asked to join us in peacekeeping in the Islamic horror show countries, and pressured to stop their proxy war on western civilization. ( ongoing to this day ) Without Iran and Iraq to use as puppets, Russia would have to deal with the new normal, and our stopping aid to Chechnya flowing from Iran would be the carrot. A very different approach would be taken in Afghanistan. Instead of a remote, corrupt central government that the Afghans don't want, no matter who's in charge, I'd establish a Federation of Tribes, and, again, be death on the corruption that has made the Afghans hate their central government since before Rome. Pakistan might find itself in a very cold place if they did not cooperate..... India would be happy to be our friends. That's how I would have handled it if I knew then what I know now. Oh, and Saudi Arabia would't be trying to buy nukes to keep Iran at bay, they'd be trying to reform their own hell hole fast with them no longer being the prime source for oil. If they can't pay off their young men to not work, Arabia falls apart. Hard. I'd also be working hard to actually make the U.S. free from needing foreign oil, ( since I know fracking will happen ) and be pushing a New Green Agenda of clean safe Thorium nuclear power to replace the coal plants and 1950's tech Uranium ones. I figure by 2008 the next President would inherit a booming economy, a world at peace, except for the very unhappy Chinese and Arabians, and a country that had strengthened Constitutional freedoms. Does that answer your question? Instead, when GW Bush began his presidency, Ramadi was a city ruled by tyrants. When he left office AQ had been mostly destroyed, Ramadi was free, and so was Iraq. Now Ramadi is again ruled by even worse tyrants, and you know who to blame for that, even if you won't. Oh, and Jeb Bush is a turd. |
