| Author | Message | ||
     Aesquire |
The following is nit picking. It's also fact. The M-16 uses the 5.56x45 NATO round which precedes the .223 Remington by at least a year. So the AR-15 may or may not use the exact same round. Most do not. ( I need real numbers but I bet you a dollar ) Some do. Some use other rounds up to .50 cal. ( .50 Beowulf ) several .45's, .17 up........ So you can honestly say it is probably not even safe to fire M-16 ammo in an AR-15. Without having it checked by qualified personnel. ( you may be qualified, ) | ||
| Aesquire |
Btw the 5.56 round is 52 this year and the .223 is now 50 years old. Full disclosure. I originally had the above backwards but checked before finishing the post. Gun & computer geeks are much the same. The numbers are huge and the dimensions tiny. It makes a real difference in the real world and your life may depend on it...... but if you're not an enthusiast it can bore you. | ||
| Hootowl |
"the AR-15 may or may not use the exact same round" My ignorance was on parade! | ||
| Sifo |
So the AR-15 may or may not use the exact same round. Most do not. I was under the impression that these days, most are chambered for the 5.56. My experience with them is limited, but I thought that between people wanting the flexibility, and manufactures wanting to avoid any liability for people sticking 5.56 into a .223 chamber it was becoming the new "standard", if there is such a thing in the AR-15 world. Of course, some will want a rifle chambered in .223, so that will likely never go away. | ||
| Sifo |
BTW, the AR-15 can be an excellent hunting rifle for the appropriate varmints. It can also be an excellent home defense weapon, properly outfitted. These facts will never deter the anti-gun folks from claiming otherwise though. | ||
| Aesquire |
Hoot, it's a picky little point since the cartridge is the same physical dimensions. .....or so close as to be within tolerances. The military 5.56 is loaded slightly hotter. The chamber on the 5.56 has a longer throat, or smooth bore leading into the rifling. The .223 has a shorter throat in the chamber to maximize accuracy, and 5.56 rounds may....repeat, may crank up too high a pressure and break things. Foreign NATO ammo may trend hot. You can probably get away with using 5.56 in your .223 chambered rifles but to even say that is a lawsuit magnet. You just don't know if it's going to hurt you. So don't. ( others may disagree with everything but the lawsuit magnet. ) .223 can safely be used in any 5.56 chambered gun.no problem. Then there are other chamber designs like the Wylde that has a slightly longer throat than spec .223, but shorter than NATO but is good for both and supposed to be more accurate than the NATO chamber. End safety rant. Hoot isn't wrong, I'm being tech geek & safety nazi. Sifo.. I agree on your opinion of hunting suitability. I'd want to see numbers on the .223-5.56 mix in commercial AR's. If most current production is 5.56 then you could be right. Iirc most production 5 or more years ago was .223. I could be dead wrong on that. | ||
| Aesquire |
One of these days..... Many people fantasize about an African safari, or Alaska for Bear. I want a prairie dog shoot with a bench, cooler, shade, and catered ribs. A lodge with company after while detail cleaning the rifle after would be choice. 300+ yards and an overpopulated town. Lot's of ammo. If I'm lucky I might get a couple. Perfect cartridge & platform for varmint hunting. I hesitate to suggest any .22 on big deer but with premium bullets it's done. A .25-06........otoh, is considered good. Or a .243. I'll let the better hunters opine on that. | ||
| Sifo |
For what it's worth, my info about 5.56 being the hot set up right now was info from a counter guy in a gun shop. Good shop with good sales folks, but I take everything from a sales guy with at least one grain of salt. I can't support any of that with any numbers. My impression could be wrong. Still, most of what I've seen on the wall being sold was 5.56, at least around here. For hunting bigger game, I've got a friend with a .308 AR-10. He's let me shoot it, and it is a very nice shooting .308. I was expecting much more recoil based on my experience shooting my early '60s vintage Winchester .308. He had enough $$$ in the scope alone to pay for my AR-15 and my STI 1911. Really nice to shoot though! | ||
| Ducbsa |
Marylanders and travelers be careful: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/dec/30/gu n-owners-fear-maryland-cops-target-them-for-traf/ From the stories, it isn't clear if the one officer is extra zealous in looking for guns or these were normal stops, given MD gun laws. Since that NY neswpaper published the gun owner map, I was wondering if that public data comes up on the LEO's computer when he enters your license number to see if you have warrants, etc. I don't want to join a lynch mob like the Hands Up crowd, without having more confirmed facts. A friend in MD that reloads keeps his machines covered to not alarm neighbors who might visit in his shop, so the atmosphere, at least in his Bethesda 'hood, is wacky about guns. | ||
| Pwnzor |
Firearms being registered is a very bad thing. I don't ever want to be on a list like that. | ||
| Reepicheep |
I posted previously about what a PITA Maryland is with regards to respect for the constitution. I avoid it whenever I can, but can't avoid it now and then. Too bad, there are some nice places and nice people (ruined by some very not nice places and very not nice people and some emotionally driven and irrational policies). | ||
| Ulyranger |
Aesquire, you hit the mark above. The only item I think you may be off on is chambering production numbers. I have no hard numbers in hand but from my observations it seems the current vast majority of AR15/M4geries are chambered in 556 for off the rack rifles. I see most of the 223s being dedicated match or hunting setups. But I could be very wrong too.....we all know how accurate "observations" can be... I have friends that have harvested white tails with ARs, they are typically .223 hunting setups that will accept exceptionally long OAL loads with 80 grn pills. Good shot placement is key, but those rifles are tack drivers. My experience with mine is limited to paper and coyotes. The biggest problem with .224 caliber is pill selection for larger game, most of the hunting pills are not designed for the penetration required for the larger species. I hate picking bits of lead and copper out of my steaks. From experience I can attest to .243 is definitely GTG!! I should have my .25-06 ready by this fall, so that eval will have to wait..... | ||
| Aesquire |
Production numbers were a guess on my part based on old data. If 80% of the AR's made in the last 6 years are 5.56 then it's definitely the majority. My bet is they sold more civilian ARs since Barry got elected than before. You will like the 25-06. Kicks more than the .243 but shoots flatter & hits harder. | ||
| Swampy |
I was going through my father-in-laws garage and found a couple of boxes or 25-06, I am still looking for the rifle. The mother-in-law gave me a Remington Model 8 in 35 Rem that was stored under a bed in her house | ||
| Ratbuell |
MD has no reciprocity - even if I get a FL CCW, it would do me no good in MD. So officially I have to leave everything at home. I keep hoping the laws will change. And I believe that yes, if you are a MD resident and you get a traffic stop, the CCW and/or any registered weapons do show up when they run your soundex number (license number). EVERYthing in MD is tagged to that number. Out of state drivers...I just don't know. Out here in the sticks, you have to do something wrong with a weapon to get hassled, but down towards DC and Balt? People are skittish as hell and the mere sight of a weapon causes havoc. My suggestion to anyone if you get pulled over in MD (or anywhere, really..)? Turn on the dome light, open the window, turn off the engine, put both hands on the upper 1/3 of the steering wheel where they can see them...and sit. Don't fidget getting your wallet before the LEO approaches, WAIT till they get to the window. Then tell them what you're doing, every step of the way. If you have a CCW? "Here's my license, and here's my permit. I am/am not currently carrying a weapon." If you are carrying, "I have my weapon (in the glovebox/under my left arm/on my right hip/whatever) and it is/is not loaded", and offer to put it on the dash in plain sight for the duration of your meeting. Is it a pain? Kinda. But in my mind as a gun owner and 2A proponent...it's an easy step to take to keep an individual who's simply doing their job, from getting more nervous than necessary. Show respect, and you get respect. Who knows...it (respect) may even be contagious. And honestly? It could re-route the entire conversation from "do you know how fast you were going?" to "wow, that's a nice piece...how long have you had it/I used to have one/I always wanted one/etc". Change the topic, show some courtesy...and you never know. I've had a reroute work with something as simple as "yeah, I'm just tired, I do sound for bands and just finished a gig and I'm beat and trying to get home" - that turned into "oh cool, I used to play drums, I know how hard those gigs can be, slow down and get home safe". | ||
| Aesquire |
http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/395601/happy- new-year-happy-new-gun-control-nonsense-charles-c- w-cooke | ||
| Sifo |
I would add one thing to all of that Ratbuell. If the cop has a partner, ask that the officer convey the info about any weapons you may be carrying to his partner too. The partner will likely be on the passenger side of the vehicle where he will likely not hear a polite conversation. I remember a case where an off duty cop didn't do this. As he was reaching for his wallet, the partner cop saw it and opened fire. Sure he was wrong to do so, but... | ||
| Reindog |
I love Schindler's movie roles but jeez, maybe Liberalism really IS a mental disorder.  | ||
| Ducbsa |
Was he relying on these "facts"? http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2014/12/13 /everytown-s-100-school-shootings-include-non-scho ol-shootings-shootings-that-didn-t-happen/ " their list contains non-school shootings, shootings that did not occur, and accidental discharges of firearms that were legally possessed on campus" other than that they were just fine. | ||
| Ducbsa |
Now the little people know their place: http://nblo.gs/12R0S3 "Gregory was just too nice a guy and had no other criminal intent." | ||
| Aesquire |
No. He was a shill for people who violate the law of the land to steal citizen's civil rights and property. A loyal minion of the forces of evil. In comic book terms, the guy writing praises for Dr. Doom. | ||
| Macbuell |
Since when does the Attorney General decide who is and who is not arrested. I always thought they make decisions on whether or not to prosecute. Why didn't the MPD just arrest him? | ||
| Macbuell |
Number of people shot and killed by Liam Neeson in his movies ... 100's. Number of people shot and killed by the vast majority of law abiding gun owners ... 0! | ||
| Ducbsa |
Since DC is ruled by the Feds, the MPD wouldn't dare step out of line. PDs elsewhere are looking over their shoulder with the concern that Holder will send platoons of Civil Rights attorneys to investigate them. Darrell Wilson isn't under official scrutiny anymore, but the Ferguson PD is. I know I'm mixing issues, but Holder looks at the big picture, just like the IRS, EPA, etc. | ||
| Ducbsa |
Don't live in Nassau County: http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2015/01/shouti ng_match_leads_to_gun_confiscation_forfeiture.html "The suit contends that no charges were ever filed against Weinstein and that both his wife and son gave sworn testimony to the effect that the dispute involved no violence, no threats, and no brandishing of weapons; nonetheless, Nassau County Police refused to give back Weinstein’s handgun permit, his handguns, or his long guns." | ||
| Aeholton |
Don't live in Nassau County: Don't call the police to settle family arguments. | ||
| Aesquire |
I had a female friend who after her divorce moved into a bad 'hood. So we organized a few SCA armored full contact fight practices at her apartment building. She obviously kept up a supply of water and lemonade, while a half dozen plus of us armored up & sparred while the S.O.'s set up chairs & tables to watch and gossip. Naturally we invited any bystanders to try our sport ( very few takers ) and in our subtle way made clear we were very friendly. ( and who our friends were ) They may have thought her crazy, but she had no trouble at all in the months she lived there. Yes, the police showed up every time but I'm well rehearsed in cheerful explanations ( when your sport is loud and you dress funny you get practice ) & when our purpose was quietly explained, and invitation to participate politely declined, they would watch for a bit then move on. ("You're f...ing crazy" is polite, right?) | ||
| Ducbsa |
Don't go to bookstores in Cedar Rapids, either: http://thegazette.com/subject/opinion/blogs/lynda- waddington/why-your-gun-makes-me-nervous-20150110 The comments are good. | ||
| Aesquire |
How much you want to bet that is a paid fictional propaganda? Bloomberg, Cuomo, Obama, Comrade de Blasio, and the Center to Exploit a Crippled Guy, ( Brady ) all spend other people's money to lie to gain power. The fictional paranoid in the above "article" is pretty obviously a fake. Knowing the "tell" of women who carry in their purse, and scared of an armed citizen? I call B.S. | ||
| Rick_a |
Possibly...but plenty of folks are so indoctrinated they only trust their government with guns. People in our culture nowadays are raised to fear guns and those that own them. |
