| Author | Message | ||
     Airbozo |
"Pretty chilling to consider how Big Brother it all is." I've been saying this since 1980-ish when I found out first hand what information the US has on all of it's citizens via the US Navy. Then the US government goes on and "invents" a way to keep track of all of the global communications via DARPANET and it takes off beyond their wildest dreams. Not to mention the cell phone and the ease of monitoring those devices and just for comfort a built in GPS is thrown in so they know where you are. And society is addicted to both. Of course I have been called a tin foilist for just as long. I have the last laugh. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Assange is an &**^&^&&. Manning was a patsy. Snowden is the one to be genuinely conflicted over... patriot or traitor? I'm thinking both, and the fact that the president and attorney general are abandoning the rule of law perhaps makes him a patriot. | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
It's odd the number of American's willing to call Assange a traitor for exposing the US governments murderous torturous dirty trick campaigns around the world. Including spying on you, the American citizen. Millions would like to know what Assange's crime was/is. Rocket in England | ||
| Cityxslicker |
There is no need for them to 'eavesdrop' into your conversation - most if not all of them have a direct side door into your data. If the teenage kid at the kiosk can hack an app to unlock your phone...... duh - the crew that get paid to do it (and have been doing it for decades) it is but a flick of the switch. It is why I do not have a cell phone, or a US Carrier anymore. EMCON - Emissions Control - you turn the shiate off and they have a very large disadvantage of finding you - witness the mess with the Missing MH360 flight. you quit broadcasting ... you become nearly invisible to them (if they task a drone to your ass - you are screwed - but SIGINT / IMINT are easily fooled and spoofed ) my tinfoil paranoia is ramping off the rev limiter - I am all consumed with the Tom Clancy death - he got too close to something and they whacked him for it. | ||
| Reepicheep |
I didn't call assange a traitor, I called him an ass&*&^. Because he is an ass&*&^. Glad I could clear that up.  | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
I didn't say YOU called him anything. Glad I could clear that up Rocket in England | ||
| Aesquire |
I stand corrected. ( cell phone small screen hasty read ) I meant Snowden. My bad. Assange is not a traitor to the US. Bad guy perhaps but not traitor. | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
Goodness me. Couldn't the White House find a more unconvincing story teller than Jen Psaki? Tut tut tut. She looks like a fish out of water and sounds like every word she says she herself does not believe. Talk about a puppet on a string. Rocket in England | ||
| Aesquire |
Missed her. What is the White House lying about today? Please post link for us to mock. ( Obama, not you ) | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
Missed her. What is the White House lying about today? Please post link for us to mock. ( Obama, not you ) Minute 1 to 19 http://www.c-span.org/video/?318728-1/state-depart ment-briefing "doesn't have that level of detail" No surprise there then. "well certainly, eh argh, the fact that um, you know, we see pro-Russian, ah separatists ah, take these actions in a range of cities over the weekend, ur that is of course concerning, in terms of the connections to troops and troop movements, I don't have anything, any independent confirmation of what that will mean but certainly we're concerned about these steps" So the pattern suggests pro-Russian separatists are starting these most recent of uprisings, yet the thousands of Russian military persons and equipment along the border, you're saying you have no idea what they're connection is (if any)  Amazing the US officials know who's in disguise with no i.d then. "I don't have more details than I've shared with you Ashad. Obviously this has just happened over the last 24 hours but clearly we've seen a pattern over the last couple of months these were pro-Russian separatists. Obviously we've expressed our concerns" A pattern of what. The US government lying? "Boosting the Ukrainian government" "Constantly in touch with the Ukrainian government" "Working closely with the Ukrainian government" As if any proof were needed the US are pulling the strings of their installed Ukrainian government. Rocket in England | ||
| Aesquire |
Thanks. Actually at this point I'm starting to believe that the US is a puppet of the Ukraine. http://www.daybydaycartoon.com/2014/04/08/ | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
You're convincing me Patrick, lol. Speaking of marrying well. Look who Cameron's married to. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samantha_Cameron Rocket in England | ||
| Cityxslicker |
The thugs are just as the thugs were at the WTO riots; shipped in, paid, and led to believe they are doing the 'right' thing. In Poltava they were put down by police and by by-standards; at then end of the day they were BEGGING to be returned to Russia.... we shall see if they are indeed allowed to do that - or if they are 'disappeared' - I am betting hard on the second. In Donetsk it was the same set up - 80-100 militant insurectionist that stirred up about 1000 bleating sheep - not unlike what we have seen with the OWS trype - most of them don't know what they are there for, and if you push them for an answer - you will get a party line rhetoric of 'oppression, corruption, social justice crap' I bet before the end of the week, since they have 'taken' the building - that it is simply surrounded, and they are gassed or starved out. In Lugansk - There were no buildings taken over and the halted the rioters with smoke, tear gas, and riot sticks; The Ukrainians Do not want the Russians further in the territory. This is from Social Media and First hand Friend accounts - you know - on ground intell that still needs to be vetted; but that is how you find out wtf is going on. not some talking head that is there because she graduated well - or was somebodies entitlement token. You get on the ground Dumb ass m-tfks are about to involve us in shiate we don't belong ..... again. | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
And contrary to your friends on social media telling you they represent all of the people coz they're on the ground, the news reels show that thousands of, not a thousand or less, east Ukrainians want a referendum and a return to Russia. Of course, all I have is a laptop and a TV so you're probably right. You know, being on the other side of the world and so well informed that you are. Do I believe you? No more and no less than anything else I've seen. Except your stories are much less convincing with only you to tell them, and your source being, well, not a lot of people (on the ground  ) Rocket in England | ||
| Cityxslicker |
woops, seems like the ruffians in Lugansk have taken a building and decided to use hostages to keep the police at bay. surely this is the act of a civil disobedient force protesting corruption and national ideology to be united with Russia .... ;?/ or more likely - desperate terrorists that have the idea that they will bully their way onto the news .... with in two months - every one of these f*ckers will be dead and buried somewhere the rebel rousing goes - show that the Ukrainians are cracking down on 'Russians' and the Russians will respond by crossing the boarder to 'protect' the Russian 'citizens' ..... it is like a bad afterschool special - worse that people believe it. It is pure Maskerovka - and has been done since the 1850's | ||
| Aesquire |
Let's think here. The EU. Bureaucracy from hell no respect for individual property steals people's money. History? Near continuous war except for the last few under NATO only a little genocide and oppression lately. The US. Going to a tyrannical Eurostyle Social Democracy. Bureaucracy from hell. Conquered half the planet saving it from tyranny. Insanely gave it back. Current leader socialist/communist liar. Russia. A century as the second most murderous empire in history. Bureaucracy from hell. Conquered half of Europe and only let go after collapsing. Hasn't kept it's word since the Czars. No respect for individual property or life. History. Lies. The 2 common trends towards bad? Collectivist religious war. Bureaucracy from hell. Who do you believe? Not the Eu. Not the Russians. Not the commie leaders in the US. Ukranian chicks. Or Russian Pravda. | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
I'm just wondering where all these bugged phone conversations are of Russian's plotting their goals in Ukraine. Where are the Youtube videos showing the Russian oligarchs pushing their way into Europe? You would think with all this super duper technology the American's have for eavesdropping on anyone and everyone, Youtube would be full of condemnation against the evil Easterners. How can this be?? There is no such stuff? Never. Get outta town! What, were raging war on a lie? We do that kinda thing do we? No way Tony have a nice day Blair, Georgie good boy Bush say. Rocket in England | ||
| Aesquire |
It's easier to spy on your own people. The NSA seems to be aces at that. The Clinton administration had cut human intel. Past the bone. Figured sat pictures were all they needed and they were cutting the military to expand the bureaucracy while lying they were cutting government. Bush the Younger did some good there but he still had to work with the mess Clinton left. The Entire Army Bush the Younger went to war with was smaller than the Deployed Army Bush the Elder used in Desert Storm. Thank Bill. Bill also was sure Saddam had lots of poison. The UN counted it. Most is STILL MISSING. Won't get into the wmds that the Brits are destroying. The Poles found. The US troops found. The Russian convoys took to Syria. There's still a Lot unaccounted for according to the UN inspectors. Why does no one talk about the missing poison gas? Right now it looks like Kerry doing fancy dinners and being stupid....... no war from the US. Doubt the EU has the balls and know it lacks the power. US news no longer covers the Ukraine. Must be all over.  | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
US news isn't covering the Ukraine because the US can't keep the lie up. As for eavesdropping. I'm pretty sure if GCHQ and the US can listen to Merkel on the phone in Germany whenever they please, they can listen in on Russia. As for Iraq and WMD's, there were non and non were ever found. Non were transported away. Had they been, they'd have been found, or at the very least found years later. Such things do not find themselves in ten and twenty year old hiding holes if they existed. They'd be for sale. Let's get real. Rocket in England | ||
| Reepicheep |
US news isn't covering the Ukraine because it makes their chosen one look feckless. | ||
| Cityxslicker |
They used to listen in - we used to have feet on the ground, assets and sources, we used to have leads and ops in play 24/7 The administrations since Bush I have cut and widdled HUMINT to nothing for the Russian Region; all efforts were dumped to the new game in town : The Arabs And now they pay for it. Simple as that. 'Nobody' saw it coming... because 'NOBODY' was tasked to watch it. on the NSA - they may collect a shiate ton of data - nearly every communication out there.... but if you have non trained in analysis of it - it is nothing but inordinate walls of chatter and chaff - you might as well just turn it off. It is the difference between DATA and Intelligence - and very few politicians ever understand the distinction. | ||
| Aesquire |
Rocket, you are ignorant of the facts re: WMD's. Your statements are wrong in nearly every particular. I'm not going to debate your parroting of jihadi ( and Democrat Party ) propaganda. If you like I can show you pictures of dead women and children killed by Saddam's poison gas. I can show you the mustard gas shells recovered by the Polish troops in Iraq, or point at the incinerator The UK built to burn the found stocks of poison. The UN inspectors reports? Lists of locations and quantities of poison gas? Would that be a clue? Or since you trust Russian Generals over EU spokesmen, ( who wouldn't? ) The book published by the Russian General who ran the Spetsnaz operation to convoy poison gas & precursor chemicals to Syria. Haven't seen it on Amazon in English yet, I should look again. Now, I will say I'm no fan of Bush the Younger. Seems like a nice fellow to go for a bicycle ride with, and there was the whole freeing 50 million folk from tyranny. But he screwed up the Iraqi occupation, mostly by occupying it in the first place. If you care to comment on any of the dozens of stupid thing he did, failures, etc. I'll be happy to agree with you. In fact he's really torqued me off. But lies are lies, and Bill, Hill, John Kerry, and Al Gore all were concerned with Saddam's chemical weapons stockpile, and his support for terrorism. It IS true that we did not find the number of weapons KNOWN to be there. (known, because Hans Blix and his merry crew of UN guys counted them. ) And I again ask, where are the rest? I have theories, glad to discuss them with you. As to Intelligence? The Clintons and then Bush, and especially Obama, have thrown away most of the assets we once had to watch the Russians. Bush looked lovingly in Putin's Eyes and thought him groovy. ( I think he used a different word, but he was still an idiot ) Obama wishes he WAS Putin. He sure didn't give a darn about keeping an eye on him. That wouldn't be flexible to cooperate now, would it. I do bet the NSA can pick up cell phone calls, but they cut most of the Russian interpreters to focus on Arabic, Farsi, and Pashtun. And no idiot on Earth would use an unencrypted cell phone for Strategic discussions. So the NSA probably has more cell phone calls about Pussy Power's arrest than there was mass storage on the planet 10 years ago, and no one to hear it. | ||
| Aesquire |
Oh, and by "lost" I mean they were killed. Clinton especially was infamous in intel circles for dropping some classified tidbit to reporters on how freaking awesome he was because we knew some info. Since such info is closely held, if you know the enemy ( us ) knows it, you can figure out who gave it to us. A lot of people died because of Bill's fat mouth. Bush was pretty good about that. Still he didn't repair the damage Clinton left him..... so phfftttt!  We won't even discuss how many Americans and allies Obama has got killed. | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
Saddam had no more gas or chemicals than the US have. After all, Rumsfeld brokered the deal personally with Saddam when the US sold him anthrax. The point you miss regarding WMD's is the lie that was told to both our nations by Bush and Blair, which certainly in the case of the British, had us going to war. It's long since been proven that Blair lied and there were no WMD's. LOTS OF FACTS / EVIDENCE SUPPORT SUCH. The other aspect which is always bolstered up by the US when it comes to WMD's, is in its original take where Iraq and Saddam were concerned is we were lead to believe these were nuclear weapons, or at least dirty versions of them. The very start of this was the British truck driver from Bradford who delivered a lot of pipes to Iraq on the back of his truck. These were said to be for a launching device which allegedly could have targeted Israel. Whilst said truck driver was imprisoned for being 'in on it' despite being just a truck driver delivering pipes, the Iraqi's remained no more capable of farting further than their own borders whilst we were lead to believe we were all under threat of a nuclear holocaust. Yes Michael Moore's book were an interesting read with many of the facts published with regard to UN sanctions, oil embargos, the closing down of a nation essentially, and those all important weapons inspections where no WMD's were found which threatened Bush or Blair. Please let's not do the Gulf War again. Rocket in England | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
on the NSA - they may collect a shiate ton of data - nearly every communication out there.... but if you have non trained in analysis of it - it is nothing but inordinate walls of chatter and chaff - you might as well just turn it off. It is the difference between DATA and Intelligence - and very few politicians ever understand the distinction. Which of course if were true, Assange would not be holed up in a Venezuelan embassy in London for 4 years, and Snowden at Large in Russia somewhere suppin' vodka cocktails. Rocket in England | ||
| Aesquire |
Yes let's not argue anything proven by Michael Moore. One question. Did they tell you Saddam had working nukes? In the US we knew that program was on hold after the reactor got bombed. I seriously doubt we would have sent troops to Saudi Arabia during Desert Shield if we thought he had atom bombs. I don't think Bush the Elder would have nuked Baghdad but you never know. Anthax? I'm still angry they never caught the murderer who killed my fellow workers with anthrax. If he had killed the politicians I would be less upset. A Soviet made breed. Since the Soviet island they tested that crap on is now a peninsula in a different ( and crappy ) country anyone brave & crazy enough can just walk out and get samples by filling a bag with dirt. Let's pray no one grows the modified smallpox still contaminating the soil there. ( 90+% casualty rate ........ ) Our intel community reflects the civilian leaders. Since the current crop openly envies the Chicom leaders. ............ but only in the ability to deal with dissent. Obama now has claimed the power to kill anyone he wants. ........ so he's on his way. I've long wondered about the CIA. I figure the tales of a hyper competent agency were propaganda. Politicians love to wave imaginary threats. Of course a smart agency would promote stories of incompetence to fool the enemy into complacency. The facts are most probably the same as Mi32 ( whatever your foreign intel guys are ) smart dedicated worker bees surrounded by drones, underfunded, while the management is butt kissing political animals. | ||
| Sifo |
Selling anthrax? I'd love to see the source for that. Anthrax is too easy to develop to have any sort of market. I imagine the CIA operates a lot like the military does. They rely on boots on the ground that are smart enough to get the job done despite what intelligence has told them. I'm just not sure if the CIA actually takes action on anything any more. Of course, the never did. Edited for spelling. (Message edited by SIFO on April 11, 2014) | ||
| Aesquire |
The Congress/postal attack was with a Soviet weaponized powder. Russian dna. Russian tech in preparation. There isn't a known US lab that can do it including AMRIID which uses a different experimental technique. Of course the CIA has never done anything....... Eastasia has always been our friends. | ||
| Sifo |
True, weaponizing anthrax is far more complicated than acquiring anthrax. | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
US Supplied Anthrax To Iraq By Geoffrey Holland (The Badger ) Documents purporting to link Osama bin Laden’s terrorist network with Saddam Hussein, discovered by a journalist in the former headquarters of the Iraqi intelligence service in Baghdad, are only the tip of the iceberg. United States Senate documents obtained from Washington by the badger provide evidence of a sinister link between the United States government and the regime of the fallen Iraqi dictator. Hidden from view for nine years, these hitherto unreported Senate papers reveal a tale of intrigue and deception which goes right to the heart of the American system. Here in Britain, after weeks of correspondence between this writer and every Member of Parliament, and following more than two-hundred written replies and several meetings with concerned MPs, we may now disclose what we know about Iraq’s weapons of mass destruction. First brought to the attention of the House of Commons by Labour MP Peter Kilfoyle on 26 February 2003, the Riegle Report details the findings of Senate hearings chaired by Senator Donald Riegle in 1994. The report confirms that when US Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld was a member of the President’s General Advisory Committee on Arms Control in the 1980s, biological materials were being exported to Iraq under licence from the US Department of Commerce. These included botulinum toxin and anthrax, later identified as major components in the Iraqi biological warfare programme. Following repeated denials by Mr Rumsfeld of any knowledge of this evidence, including in statements to the Senate and on British television, Conservative MP Sir Teddy Taylor pressed our own Secretary of State for Defence on 3 March to supply details of the extent of the weapons of mass destruction supplied to Iraq by the United States. Mr Hoon could only reply that the US Defense Secretary had categorically denied making those kinds of equipment available to Iraq. Then, in answer to a further question from Mr Kilfoyle on 10 March, Foreign Secretary Jack Straw said, as far as he knew, that anthrax did not come from the United States. Nevertheless, he did concede that if it did, it would have been wrong. To be fair, Mr. Straw did not appear to know very much at this point. Presumably, he had not yet read the Senate documents which conclude categorically that the United States did supply at least seven batches of anthrax to Iraq between 8 February 1985 and 29 September 1988. The following day, Sir Teddy Taylor addressed the matter to the Speaker of the House of Commons. Expressing a growing disbelief in Mr Rumsfeld’s denials, he requested an immediate response from the Ministry of Defence, repeating this request on 13 March to the Leader of the House, Robin Cook, and stressing that the information was urgently required. Finally, on 14 March, the Ministry of Defence replied to Sir Teddy Taylor with a written statement confirming that it was now aware of the Riegle Report, though it stopped short of providing any specific details. Three days later in his landmark resignation speech, Robin Cook made the first public declaration by a member of the British Cabinet that US companies had sold anthrax to Iraq. Here was an announcement of the greatest magnitude, pointing to a direct breach of the internationally binding Biological and Toxin Weapons Convention, signed by Britain and the US in 1972 and ratified in 1975. Yet, remarkably, the significance of Mr. Cook’s statement received no comment in the British press. In the final Iraq debate of 18 March, Sir Teddy Taylor was on the case again, this time urging the Prime Minster to make a statement before the war began, asking him, “Will he tell the House whether there has been any identification of the countries that have supplied these terrible biological materials - should those countries not be identified - named by the Prime Minister and condemned?” Mr Blair replied with just eight words, saying, “Much of the production is in Iraq itself.” Let us examine that answer. First, it does not answer the question. Second, it does not answer the question. Third, it does not answer the question. But Sir Teddy - an honest man who speaks the truth - answered the question himself. “Those materials were not produced by Iraq, but provided and sold by western powers. It is abundantly clear that the US Department of Commerce approved every single thing that went from the United States to Iraq. It was not a question of secret firms doing nasty things; this was approved by Government.” The British Government in its Biological Weapons Green Paper last year, in a section headed “UK Policy,” confirmed the Biological and Toxin Weapons Convention to be a “principal international and legally binding instrument” and said that “those at every level responsible for any breach of international law will be held personally accountable.’ But who is accountable to whom, and when? It is clear from the US Senate’s Riegle report that Article III of the Biological and Toxin Weapons Convention has been breached by the United States. Under Article VI of that Convention, Britain, having knowledge of the breach, should formally report the matter to the United Nations Security Council. Not only is this obvious moral responsibility, but it corresponds directly with UK policy. However, on Tuesday of this week two further documents have been received by this writer, which seem to indicate that it is the intention of the British Government to do absolutely nothing about the matter. The first is a public document, which may appropriately be termed a weapon of mass disinformation, as its cover explains that it is now being sent by the Foreign and Commonwealth Office in answer to many thousands of letters. Forwarded by the Iraq Policy Unit, it is chock-full of messages intended to jolly us all into believing that everything is quite alright. Buried within it is the following bland statement, which in one short sentence swiftly sweeps away any doubts we may ever have about US complicity in the supply of weapons of mass destruction to Iraq, saying simply, “The US is fully compliant with its international obligations on WMD.” The second document, forwarded to this writer by an honest MP, is an internal House of Commons Library paper, fresh from the desk of the International Affairs and Defence Section. This may well carry the British Government’s final word on the subject, as it points out that under the terms of the Biological and Toxin Weapons Convention the Government “may” lodge a complaint with the Security Council but is under no “obligation” to do so. So, there we have it; this is the state of play as you read this article; the crime has been committed, the evidence is there, Government policy is to act, but it may not do so. © Copyright 2003 the Badger (University of Sussex student magazine May 2003) Rocket in England |
