| Author | Message | ||
     Gregtonn |
Just in case nobody was paying attention. The USSR backed out of (notice I didn't say lost) the Cold War because they went broke trying to keep up with the US. Guess what, thanks to 0 we're broke. Guess what else. Putin has recognized the advantages of capitalism and 0 is pushing farther into socialism. Doesn't anybody see how this will go if a large number of people don't get their heads out of... Oh hell! I'll just shut up, who's listening anyhow? G | ||
| Cityxslicker |
at some point you just sit back and watch it burn We are having our Bradbury era We have passed Orwell Thoreau has long since been forgotten Dostoevsky is all too apparent on the horizon Read Literature - it is more telling than the 'news' | ||
| Aesquire |
Gregtonn, I hear ya. You want to be soothed with assurances that it's all going to be ok? Sorry. Feeling upset that civilization as you know it is crashing down around you? Feel like a Cassandra shouting warnings to the oblivious crowd as the skyscraper falls upon them? Gaze with stunned amazement as a Vegan berates Hunters telling them to "buy their meat at the Supermarket where no animal gets hurt"? Shake your head in disbelief as the response to a logical argument is either "well HE did it too!" or "you suck"? Sorry fellow. That means you're awake. | ||
| Aesquire |
BTW, I think Henry ( above ) has some good points, even though I loathe the guy. These are principles, not prescriptions. People familiar with the region will know that not all of them will be palatable to all parties. The test is not absolute satisfaction but balanced dissatisfaction. If some solution based on these or comparable elements is not achieved, the drift toward confrontation will accelerate. The time for that will come soon enough. I'm pondering the balance, logic and uselessness of that. | ||
| Just_ziptab |
Rumor has it that Russia has just stop all export of ammo. Bye bye cheap 7.62x39 ammo  | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
The sad reality of what is written on BadWeB in these topics, and mostly why I try avoid them like the plague, and to generalise somewhat but the point I make still holds firm, is YOU Americans really don't have a clue about democracy and protest. You see a gun as a threat or a defense. Black and white. There seems never a middle ground. If someone has guns you want them put down. If someone wants guns you want them put down. If someone has no guns you want to be their guns. Ukraine has sweet FA to do with American politics or economy, but America really wants to make it that way. I don't have to ask myself why but I think a lot of Americans do. Don't you get it. The world is tired of America playing policeman. America has made the world a less safe place. This is the world we live in today. Whatever happens in Ukraine or Crimea would not be a major concern for the world UNTIL AMERICA GETS INVOLVED. The Ukraine is a domestic mess. Thanks to America it's now an international mess. What pray tell does America want here? And please, no one tell me this is in the interests of protecting freedom and democracy in Ukraine. The world is full of places where America can go play freedom fighter if that were the case. So come on tell what it is. Why does America want involvement here? Rocket in England | ||
| Sifo |
Rocket, I'm very confused by your post. I don't see that America wants to get involved in this. I certainly don't see where that stance has been taken here on BadWeb. Feel free to point out who has taken that stance. I KNOW I'm not pushing that idea. Here's the problem though. What is happening in Ukraine right now is beyond domestic. How you see this escalation as the fault of America is beyond me. They are a sovereign state that has just been invaded by another foreign power who is talking of rebuilding their empire. This is going on in your back yard, not mine. Europe has a history of ignoring this until the target is on their little piece of the world, then they sit and wonder why the world fails to help them. Your view has a special sort of irony given the rich history that Europe has with it's various countries that have tried to build their own world dominating empires. Have you ever seen the map of the world showing the territories that have NOT, at one time or another, been colonized by England? It's a pretty amazing map! Frankly, if Europe were a bit better and controlling themselves, there would be far less reason for the US to police the world. Europe's history on this point though, is dismal at best. The really sad thing is that the rest of the world EXPECTS the US to police the world through the UN. I would love for the US to exit the UN, and kick the UN out of the US as well. There's just nothing like having jackwagons from around the world coming into your country, ignoring your laws, and claiming diplomatic immunity. The worst part is that the US is expected to pay for the bulk of this and do all the heavy lifting. So perhaps you would care to expand on your thought about how the Ukraine has become an international mess is the fault of America? Keep in mind here, I REALLY hate to defend BO on this, but the only fault I see to place on BO is that he has weakened America to the point that other bad actors around the world are becoming confident that the US will not act as the world's police. | ||
| Sifo |
BTW, let's not forget the simple fact that the US is a product of... European empire building. | ||
| Brumbear |
Silly America going and getting involved in European situation for what the last 2 world wars that we started oh wait..... It's amazing how grown up the world has become since American aid freed it,...twice. | ||
| Court |
>>>>The world is tired of America playing policeman. America has made the world a less safe place You think . . . after a while . . . they'd all start refusing our money . . . including the $440,900,000,000 we sent to Russia in 2012. To get on the street . . . get off the teet. | ||
| Reindog |
A tyrant invades a European country and an Englishman seeks to place the blame elsewhere. Neville couldn't have said it better. The BAF movement (Blame America First) is tired and old. You can do better, Rocket. | ||
| Aesquire |
No it is our fault. We should have let Patton loose in 1945. | ||
| Sifo |
I can't locate the map showing the territories that have been under British rule, but here's one showing all territory that has been under the rule of European empires. The maps aren't all that different though.  Territories which have been, at some point of time, a colony of a European entity (dark blue) or under European sphere of influence (light blue). Oregon Territory, which experienced "joint occupancy" under the US and Britain, is marked with alternating gray and blue. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:European_empires .png And they point to the US for extending it's sphere of influence.  | ||
| Strokizator |
To think that just a few days ago I was lamenting that there was no modern version of Neville Chamberlain. Now comes Rocket to the rescue promising "peace in our time" if only the USA would butt out of the Ukrainian dust-up; which is really nothing more than a domestic issue. Thank you, kind sir. | ||
| Blake |
Imagine the world with an isolationist America? You think it would be less dangerous? Less dangerous for who? Nazis, Marxists, jihadi Islamist-fascists, tyrannical dictators? Get a clue and wise up! | ||
| Daddio |
I had a long response for Rocket, then accidentally deleted it. All for the better, I suppose... Putting the "F" back in freedom. http://images.fanpop.com/images/image_uploads/Team -America--World-Police-WP-team-america-3A-world-po lice-129929_1280_1024.jpg | ||
| Ferris_von_bueller |
Once again, I must remind you, Rocket, that YOUR freakin government is just as involved in playing "world's policeman" as the U.S. Furthermore, your Prime Minister hasn't been shy about voicing his opinions and concerns regarding Ukraine. Look, you don't have to like the United States and it's policies. My government disgusts me on a daily basis but I don't see any good alternatives. Do you really believe that if the U.S. were to completely isolate itself that peace would spontaneously erupt and the peoples of the world would sing Kumbaya? How naive | ||
| Aesquire |
Don't you get it. The world is tired of America playing policeman. America has made the world a less safe place. I respectfully disagree. Not that the "world is tired" of us, that makes perfect sense. But make the world a less safe place? True in the sense that without American military might, Europe and England would be peaceful subjects of the Soviet Empire. It is more obvious than ever that Russia & China are the supporters of terrorism, revolution, and mass murder. The Proxies may have changed, but the intent is the same. World domination. This is the world we live in today. Whatever happens in Ukraine or Crimea would not be a major concern for the world UNTIL AMERICA GETS INVOLVED. The Ukraine is a domestic mess. Thanks to America it's now an international mess. Actually it became an international mess when the troops crossed the border. Russian troops. America's involvement seems to be pure idiocy to me at this time, with our much beloved Glorious Leader promising a billion bucks he doesn't have to the Ukranian Parliament. I have no idea why. Don't expect Barry does either. I do appreciate your ( Rocket's ) posting some "news" from the Russian side. I like the perspective. Need it to make an informed opinion. I'm shocked by the bravery of the RT people speaking out against the propaganda they are given to recite. I wonder if we will see them alive in a month. Truly wish our "reporters" had the balls to do the same. Do you have anything from Ukranian sources? I still don't get the players. If the Parliament is a bunch of plutocrats, like much of our Congress, that would color my perception. ( rich, above the law, private club, believe they should rule instead of serve ) I understand that Putin has Europe over a barrel with his control of energy with the Nat gas pipeline. It would take years and billions of Euros to make Europe free of the threat of "lights out & freeze" that Putin has. Until we build & pay for the Transatlantic pipeline, I might suggest invading Libya and taking their oil. I was against our President's actions there, and can confidently say they were not the actions of America, but of one cabal of neo-Marxist twits that really need to be imprisoned. Alas, our Senate is run by a criminal who would never allow that, so unless we want a coup, we'd better vote with our heads & not our privates this year. | ||
| Cityxslicker |
I do think the US should stay out of it. But by that I mean they should QUIT ginning shiate UP. The power and money that is driving this current hub bub is not territorial, nor national - it is the power brokers that profit from playing one side against the other. when we kill them, all of them, may we actually find a peace. yes, I said kill. Keep your warm hugs for your Tickle Me Elmo | ||
| Aesquire |
http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/372398/putin- not-super-genius-jonah-goldberg | ||
| Cityxslicker |
Say - you want an international escalation and strike point to kick of a little territorial pissing match ? Hello USS Truxton http://rt.com/news/uss-truxtun-black-sea-586/ The Navy, Shipping and Naval Assets, have been the source of entirely too many of our global incursions watch this one close. | ||
| Cityxslicker |
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| Rocket_in_uk |
It would be impossible to come to the BadWeB, it being a minuscule representative of the American psyche, and expect any less a number of stupid unfathomed responses like the above. Non of which have any bearing on the current situation in Ukraine. The comments I refer to typify an attitude that when displayed by an entire nation from its people to its government, as they appear to be, serve to cement the way people outside of America only see America's role on the world stage as selfish and in it for themselves. 'We' don't see America as our great saviour and protector. That is simply because America is neither. In fact many believe it is America who is the aggressor in many of the worlds recent conflicts. Britain to some degree is complicit in this peacekeeping charade. Does anyone really believe America's interest in Ukraine is about Russia crossing a border into a country which is more Russian than Hawaii is American? Get real and stop flexing the American rhetoric. Rocket in England | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
Personally I blame the French, just think about it. If the French hadn't helped those misled American terrorists at Yorktown, America would still be British & neither the Germans or anybody else would have dared to take us on. Ok, let's have another more recent what if. I'm f*****g sick & tired of this "we saved your arse. Twice. If it wasn't for us, you'd be..." mentality. What if the United States had joined the Allies When They were Asked instead of worrying about german immigrants votes. Hitler would never have got his ball rolling, America's procrastination caused all this. You see, I can rewrite history to blame who I want along with the best of them. I can cherry pick key events & point to them saying "you see it's xxxxxx's fault because of..." But that's dishonest, which is why I'm not a politician or a journalist. Don't believe the hype, don't let your prejudices get the better of your judgement. The USA is not now, nor has it ever been, the "be all & end all" it's as dependent on everybody else now as it always has been. I watch with interest, & wonder what's going to happen when all that Chinese debt gets called in. Interesting times indeed. | ||
| Cityxslicker |
oh, yes, let us not forget the Chinese involvement in Ukraine They recently purchased their aircraft carrier from them, and have signifcant deals for wheat .... it will be interesting indeed | ||
| Ferris_von_bueller |
I watch with interest, & wonder what's going to happen when all that Chinese debt gets called in. You will be living in the streets along with 2/3 of the world's population. That debt will never be called in and if it were it would simply be ignored. It's a game(scam) with no end. It's a suicide pact and it probably was designed that way. | ||
| Ferris_von_bueller |
Britain to some degree is complicit in this peacekeeping charade There you go, again. You're in denial. The U.S. and G.B. are two sides of the same coin. I can't think of any policies or actions in my lifetime where our two countries weren't in lock-step with one another. For all your bitching about American's arrogance you sure do have blinders on when it comes to your own country. | ||
| Sifo |
So in one post we have a Brit telling us we are not their savior and protector. In the very next post we have a Brit telling us how we failed to be their savior and protector when asked. Are these opposite views? I'm not sure they are. The simple fact is, we didn't come running to Europe's aid right away. Why? We don't want to be savior and protector of the whole freaking world! The problem is that Europe isn't taking care of things in it's own back yard. This is a repeat of history. To believe that Putin wanting to restore the great Russian Empire means taking Crimea and stopping, you are fools. Even if that level of appeasement would work, you would not see it in such a good light if you were in the cross hairs. Who is failing to help who? In their own back yard!!! Then you dare to bitch that we aren't ready and willing at the drop of the hat when the bad guy is breaking down your door! That's just too freaking bad! Seriously, I wish the US would get out of the UN and get the UN out of the US. They do not serve our purpose, and forces us to serve their purpose, while blaming us for meddling. BTW, I blame the Borg. If not for 7 of 9 we wouldn't have the current turd of a pResident. | ||
| Brumbear |
Ok, let's have another more recent what if. I'm f*****g sick & tired of this "we saved your arse. Twice. If it wasn't for us, you'd be..." mentality. What if the United States had joined the Allies When They were Asked instead of worrying about german immigrants votes. Thats really not what was said but the fact that the US took Europe out of the fire twice in the last 100 years is true. I don't mean with troops I mean AID like $$$ food armament the whole lot. Let us please remember that Great Britain and France declared war on Germany in 1939. Germany declared war on the US and the US still decided to help Europe win before winning the war with Japan. It's easy to say Germany had to be defeated, now (present day)and correct as well but who knew that in 1939 and more so how do you sell it to a population nearly 1/3 ethnic German as the US had in 1939. Hell this is the 2000 ethnic census they are still #1 Rank Ancestry Number Percent of total population 1 German 42,841,569 15.2% 2 Irish 30,524,799 10.8% 3 African 24,903,412 8.8% 4 English 24,509,692 8.7% 5 American 20,188,305 7.2% 6 Mexican 18,382,291 6.5% 7 Italian 15,638,348 5.6% 8 Polish 8,977,235 3.2% 9 French 8,309,666 3.0% 10 American Indian 7,876,568 2.8% 11 Scottish 4,890,581 1.7% 12 Dutch 4,541,770 1.6% 13 Norwegian 4,477,725 1.6% 14 Scotch-Irish 4,319,232 1.5% 15 Chinese 4,010,114 1.4% Ancestry maps And they still helped. Like it or not the US has to be the world police who else will do it? I don't like seeing our kids deployed to foreign lands to help other people instead of us but in the grand scheme of things maybe we are helping us by helping them. | ||
| Torquehd |
Like it or not the US has to be the world police who else will do it? A handful of European countries, and Australia, and (regionally specific) Israel will do their part to help the rest of the world act like mature, well-adjusted adults. But it's quite evident who leads the way. And in the end, the same who will be blamed for everything bad in the world. Like teenagers who blame the parents who have worked so hard to raise them right. England used to be the premier power in the world. That has changed. It may change again, due to the idiot policy-makers in this country, and the idiot majority who has been snowballed into blindly following them. |
