| Author | Message | ||
     Fredfast |
"If the republicans did the same, ie, push a law through a narrow vetting window to find out what was in it later, would you have a problem with that?" Every president has an agenda. Faced with a hostile House they used what means were available. Universal healthcare was a priority to his administration. If that was the only way to get it through, more power to him. Didn't Bush boondoggle Congress into sending troops to Iraq. Want to talk about that mess? | ||
| Sifo |
It's the market place sites causing most of the problem but it's the best they could do given REPUBLICAN objections. So it's a compromise. Isn't that what government is supposed to do? FredFrank has alleged this multiple times now. It's pure fabrication. Republicans were not involved in the crafting of this law, in fact they were locked out of closed door meetings. To suggest there was compromise is complete falsehood. Many people without the means to pay for a doctor visit or a hospital visit now can. What more justification do you need? Another falsehood. More people are losing their insurance than getting insurance. That's the biggest fail of this law. It's going to get much worse too when the employer mandate actually kicks in. Explain to me again how we have selectively chosen to ignore certain aspects of LAW at the WHIM of a pResident. Can you say Banana Republic? | ||
| Sifo |
Sifo and I routinely bump heads. Perhaps some day we can bump something else...  Till then...  | ||
| Hootowl |
Whew! I'm glad you remembered to put the beer clinking emote at the end of that.  | ||
| Cityxslicker |
The only lie on Par with the President's "If you like your health insurance you can keep it" is Nancy's 'We have to pass the bill to find out what is in it' It was complete and utter BS. The bill was open source- both the house and congress versions were on line as the edits passed through the lobbiests - you just had to know where to look, and have the TIME to read it. I had both. And I knew BEFORE they passed it - this thing was a turd. And for the last 4 years - I have called that damn thing out time and time again - with great f'n clarity; why - because 1) I F'n read it 2) I understand insurance 3) I read history 4) I can smell socialism / communism from over the horizon. And I challenge you to find anything that I have said on this bill that turned out to be wrong. I have four out liner wickets It causes a crash of the economy It causes a failure of the currency It ushers in an excuse for martial law It causes a disruption / stay for the 2016 elections every other wicket - I hit. Now, what what happens when the companies in the 50-100 range have to justify their firings and UNDER threat of perjury swear that they are not lowering employment staff levels due to ObamaCare.... This is a second iteration of Sebelius' gag order from last year - where she formally admonished and threatened insurance companies for raising their rates because of ObamaCare. If you are not in the country for 330 consecutive days - you are not subject to this law. Watch the wave of expats swell - especially the baby boomers. That money, that talent - is leaving the US Going Galt. | ||
| Sifo |
If you are not in the country for 330 consecutive days - you are not subject to this law. Watch the wave of expats swell - especially the baby boomers. That money, that talent - is leaving the US Going Galt. You mean like this?  http://www.nbcnews.com/business/economy/record-number-americans-renouncing-citizenship-n27381 | ||
| Reindog |
If City had kept his promise, 2013 would have yielded a clean 3000.  | ||
| Cityxslicker |
I tried - I had the contract, but not the travel ; blame HR. note that the chart is the number that have RENOUNCED their citizenship - the tidal wave of those leaving the country that don't have the commitment is significantly higher. Just take a look at any of the stats on Real Estate Growth into Panama, Costa Rica, Ecuador, Belize, even Mexico. www.liveandinvestoverseas.com | ||
| Aesquire |
http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/371043/colora do-health-exchange-director-indicted-fraud-theft-j illian-kay-melchior I suspect this will be the norm and not a rare exception. Better yet, from THIS admin's point of view, it offers a supply of people to throw under the bus at times of complaint. When I read on a memo leaked from Obama's staff that they anticipated 193 million Americans will lose their insurance when the Employer mandate kicks in, I mentally add that to the 10+ million that already lost their insurance, and come up with 2/3 of Americans lied to by Obama. ( the memo dates from when Obama was out repeating the lie, daily ) Yes, many of these people will get insurance again. They will average 200-500% higher costs, since the IRS has "calculated" that an average family of 4 can "afford" $20k a year in Insurance costs. Since the average family of 4 makes $50k a year, and the average mortgage is upwards of $12k a year, this means that the average family will not be buying new cars, paying for college, or eating fresh food. The mortgage is optional. The ACA costs are mandatory. City may be dead right on all his predictions. FF wants "single payer" health care. Does he know what that means? That IS the goal of this deliberate mess. When the Insurance companies product is too expensive, BY LAW, the O anticipates a great outcry for HIS desire, "single payer". I bet anyone $20 that the O will berate and blame the evil Capitalist running dog lackeys in the Insurance industry for HIS mandatory price hike. After all, he felt free to blame the folk on Wall Street for the mess he helped create in the Housing bubble, ( To be fair, he had a small role, not like Biden, he didn't vote for the cause of the problem, he was a street level thug at the time ) at the same time he was cheerfully taking massive bribes and giving them your money. It's the Chicago Way. Faced with a hostile House they used what means were available. Another falsehood. He had both House and Senate in his pocket. For 2 years. Universal healthcare was a priority to his administration. Depends on your definition of "universal". If you mean he wanted health care available to those who could not afford insurance, so that every one would have access outside ER's & such? That's what he said, but he lied to you. More people will be without insurance than before, and his staff knew it. If you mean taking that much power he had no right to away from the American Citizens, then Yes. If that was the only way to get it through, more power to him. The ends justify the means, right. If his intentions are good, then it's ok if he lies to everyone, right? I personally don't think his intentions were good, but we won't know that until after the trial, when his minions start publishing their tell-all books. And.... no, I meant FF claims ignorance as a tool for deceit. When the Tailgunner Joe stuff comes out, and I recognize the lies, verbatim, from the CPUSA website, I know he's faking it. he may not even have the CPUSA website on he 'favorites, ( I do ) as the same lies are regularly published in Union newsletters, and I recently re-read it in The Catholic Worker. This is not just a "Useful" person. It is a malevolent denier of facts. I bet he would deny that the ideology he parrots has murdered more people in the last 200 years than War. Satan's greatest trick was convincing the world he didn't exist. | ||
| Fredfast |
"Satan's greatest trick was convincing the world he didn't exist." Pleased to meet you. | ||
| Aesquire |
http://www.pjtv.com/?cmd=mpg&load=9393&mpid=56 Here's a lovely explanation for why "Single Payer" ( which I still doubt FF knows the meaning of ) is, in fact, "single point failure". Years working with aircraft of various descriptions have taught me a few things. Most of them I did not own, most were simple, basic designs. One thing in particular struck me as important. Single Point Failure. In helicopters, it's known as the "Jesus Nut". That's not intentional blasphemy. It's the nut that holds on the rotor blades. It's the word the pilot is most likely to say, when it falls off. ( the word most often heard in flight recorder black boxes as the pilot's last before impact is 4 letters and begins with sh.. ) When the entire population depends on ONE mandated web site, or insurance policy, or Glorious leader, it will fail. And bring down the entire society. This isn't pessimism, this isn't paranoia. This is the experience of thousands of years of falling bridges, crashing airplanes, sinking ships, and mass slaughter by the minions of the Glorious Leader, and those who would become him. As to the notion that a State "taking care of it's people" was a Christian act? I'm not the best one to talk, perhaps, not being a practicing Christian. But. I was, once upon a time, an altar boy. I don't recall ( it's been at least a decade since re-reading the KJ Bible ) where Jesus told his flock that Charity was to have the Romans take their money, at sword point, if need be, and give it to the poor. I don't recall the part where the kid from Bethlehem insisted that being saved was a collective act. ( but I do recall Obama saying so ) I certainly don't remember the part where the Nazarene insisted that Charity was the responsibility of the Holy State, and that his followers didn't have to help the unfortunate, since the Roman's would handle it. Please correct me if I'm wrong. With facts. not bile. The notion of "Christian" as FF puts it is a perversion of faith. A deliberate lie fashioned by evil men to use another's religion to manipulate them into docility and get them to allow evil. A recent Pope accurately described such a perversion of faith as "demonic". I assure you the number of times I agree whole heartedly with a freaking Pope are rare, indeed. | ||
| Cityxslicker |
I have said it before and will reiterate it again. Obama's health Care Reform 2008 is NOTHING more than Lenin's Land Reform 1908 rehashed I am not psychic - but I am an astute observer of history and intelligence indications This thing Marches down the same road as the Soviet Experience, lie for lie, line for line Unfortunately - following that meme we get a bit of international global stupidity first before the hostile take over Watch for a bit of saber rattling this year - I am betting Syria, Iran, Iraq region. Quite possibly a good old fashioned assassination Coup d Etat Read History - we are about to repeat it | ||
| Reindog |
Patrick, F-Cubed is a troll and enjoys baiting people but I think you already know that. I admit it is hard to ignore such an obviously ignorant person but most of what he does is simply an act. He enjoys the attention he is getting and is sniggling in the privacy of his basement shielded from reality and thinking that he has got your pantyhose all wadded up. I actually pity this wisp of smoke. | ||
| Aesquire |
Reindog, I probably owe you an apology.  At first I hoped for rational dialog. Even with the contempt and classic Alinsky tactics, ( I bet he's never read the book ) I hold to the optimistic notion that Ignorance can be cured. But, yeah, I'm just using his predictability as amusement, now. The difference, I think, is in the statement "correct me if I'm wrong" I'd rather be right than win the argument. When I'm wrong, I want to know. I'm seldom as gracious as I should be when corrected, or acknowledge the lesson learned, but I appreciate the times I learn the truth. This leaves plenty of room for opinion, and we may never convince the other of our viewpoint, getting the Facts right is important. It should be the foundation for our opinions. Or they are foundationless. on a personal note, I had a room mate that got upset when I used words they didn't know. Thought I was trying to belittle them. Putting on airs. After much thought, no. My attitude is when I come upon a word I don't know, I ask or look it up. FF, Nice work on the veritas word. Credit where due, after all. Is this the Plate you were looking for? http://www.amazon.com/Club-Lone-Metal-License-Plat e/dp/B007CFJJF8 | ||
| Fredfast |
"Is this the Plate you were looking for?" Yes, but unfortunately they're car (or truck) size. I'm looking for motorcycle size but thanks anyway. | ||
| Sifo |
One more thing that we were lied to about. Obamacare Recruiting Illegals in California Someone owes Joe Wilson an apology! | ||
| Cityxslicker |
Gee - Illegals covered and 'recruited' under ObamaCare.... who would have thought....  / FIFTYS | ||
| Just_ziptab |
So I hear all these reports of premiums going up for tons of people...several hundred dollars a month. That's a lot of dough coming in across the country. Who is getting all that extra money that wasn't coming in before obammy care? | ||
| Aesquire |
The people Obama blames for high prices. The same people he will blame for Obamacare's failure. And......the same people who bribed Obama to get the sweet deal. ( not Ever understanding that The O is not an honest politician and won't stay bought. ) To be fair some Do know how Obama plans to destroy their business.....but plan to leave very rich first. | ||
| Sifo |
Who is getting all that extra money that wasn't coming in before obammy care? How many new IRS workers were hired as a result of this law? How many "navigators" were hired? How many hundreds of millions (or is it over a billion at this point?) were spent on a web site that still doesn't work? Has anyone EVER spent even half that much on a website before? This is government waste at it's finest. | ||
| Reepicheep |
There are more losers than winners under the ACA, but there are some winners. Some people that were paying a LOT of money for pre-existing conditions will be paying a lot less now. Before, it was hard for these people to get affordable insurance because both they and their insurance company can pretty easily predict that there their imminent care is going to cost a fortune. | ||
| Aesquire |
Like most of any "social"(ist) agenda there is always something good to point to as a reason for it. Most of the time (I do not recall an exception) the people held up as poster kids get the shaft. But...... that is a good emotional & rational reason for insurance law reform. I just assumed the reason it never happened before is bribery. The reason it's happened now is bribery. | ||
| Oldog |
Hey Fred just went to get some scrips filled under the ACA.. BP 10.00$ woot Cholesterol 10.00$ woot Ranexa time release cardiac electrical modifier 400$ per month, O.F.! not today.... I was forced to use a different pharmacy Ranexa was 60$ per month before, Please explain how does this benefit me? BTW, the Ranexa bill is almost what my insurance costs, the president is trying to kill me....... food or medicine........ | ||
| Sifo |
If the Cholesterol happens to be atorvastatin, Meijer is doing those for free. http://www.meijer.com/content/content.jsp?pageName =free-prescriptions-at-meijer | ||
| Ducbsa |
Now, isn't this hilarious! All the pajama boys can't enroll because the website continues to be a pathetic failure. http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2014/02/15 /Obamacare-Website-Down-On-National-Youth-Enrollme nt-Day Remember, not a single Republican voted for it. | ||
| Reindog |
Even the Regime's official mouthpiece of the Obama Administration, the New York Times, is preparing the American People for trouble. The quote highlighted in red speculates that many people are enrolling multiple times. This means that the 3.3 million supposed enrollees is lower, a lot lower. It is expected but too bad that this Lame Duck pResident refuses to be forthcoming with the American People. There are still a few wisps of smoke who desperately cling to Obama but their numbers are dwindling by the day. The only real solution is to vote the Democrats who blindly supported Obamacare out of office. One-Fifth of New Enrollees Under Health Care Law Fail to Pay First Premium By ROBERT PEAR . FEB. 13, 2014 excerpts:
source: http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/14/us/politics/one- in-5-buyers-of-insurance-under-new-law-did-not-pay -premiums-on-time.html?_r=0 | ||
| Oldog |
Related to my previous post, I don't have Lupus or MS, but I know/known people who do/did As the rats come out.... http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/02/16/obamaca re-patients-with-serious-pre-existing-diseases-cou ld-face-expensive-drug/ Food or Meds..... perhaps the idea is to be rid of those who are unwell.. | ||
| Oldog |
People could have many reasons for not paying their premiums. Some decided they did not want a health plan for which they had applied. Some never received an invoice from the insurance company, or received it late. In addition, phone lines of some health plans were overwhelmed. Even here in NC where the state Mandated BCBS-or approved affiliate via BCBS of NC. the initial payment was not properly recorded, I received a billing notice 1 week later, I sent a check and hand written letter to pay January's bill, the Card and needed info to get services showed up mid Jan, Feb's bill showed up on the 8th, NC has less variety, and Higher premiums but tighter rules than most states. The mess Reindog's post points to can't be that surprising, The real consequences come when the law is completely implemented } | ||
| Aesquire |
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-255 9860/Online-trolls-really-ARE-horrible-people-rese archers-Narcissistic-Machiavellian-psychopathic-sa distic.html | ||
| Sifo |
Aesquire, Isn't that a bit off topic.  Or it might be...  |
