| Author | Message | ||
     Sleez |
limited in CA, thinking of either the Colt LE6920 at 1400 or an S&W mp15 Sport for 800??? | ||
| Nukeblue |
i'm thinkin....move | ||
| Sleez |
lol also found a PPT 6.8 SPC for 1600, with 400 rounds of ammo??? | ||
| Aesquire |
I wonder.... If I bought a Peoples Republic of Kalifornia modified AR, how hard would it be to convert it back to it's century old function? Yes, the AR was a late 40's/50's design, but the functional parts are more than 100 years old design. Eugene Stoner was tasked with using WW2 aircraft technology to make guns to make money for Fairchild Aircraft as the WW2 military contracts went away, and the company had invested and developed the technology to forge aluminum, mold plastic, and build precision cameras and planes. Using plastic instead of wood for the handles is the only change fire arms have really had in the last 100 years. ( and "plastic" or rubber handles actually date back to the 19th century ) | ||
| Ninefortheroad |
Sleez.... Go for the M+P Sport and buy more ammo when the prices ease up! Learn to and enjoy shooting more for less $. 6.8 SPC has it's merits but, ammo is even harder to find and more expensive. | ||
| Aesquire |
I agree. The 6.8SPC was developed by Army Sgts with assistance from Remington. The issue with the 5.56 has been that it's essentially a varmint round. It lacks penetration through cinder block and adobe walls, and is considered a 350 yard round in military form. ( Varmint shooters often hit small targets out to 400+ yards, but "in military form" I mean a M4 short barrel with FMJ milspec loads is dropping, fast, out past 300 yards and lacks the power to penetrate armor, vests, etc at longer range. ) So, the 6.8 was intended to be a better, harder hitting, replacement for the 5.56. The Pentagon dodn't go for it, for multiple reasons, but mostly the cost of re-tooling/changing. ( as a historical note the Garand rifle of WW2 was originally designed for a 7mm round, the .276 Pederson, which is darned close to the 6.8 of today. The Pederson round was also rejected because of the cost of change. ) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/6.8_mm_Remington_SPC http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.276_Pedersen The 6.8 SPC uses a ".270" bullet (.277") and is meant to increase the "hitting power" and penetration of hard barriers. It does so pretty good, but there were problems with pressures in it's initial version and the specs were a little unrealistic. The 6.8 SPC II is the current, safer, working version, and is pretty decent. It's NOT equal to a .270 Winchester ( a necked down 30-06 ) in range or power. It IS a decent deer round. The 30-30 isn't equal to a 30-06, either, and the 6.8 is close enough to the most popular deer rifle round in America to be plenty good enough for medium game ( and humans ). There have been cases of bolt failure with the larger case/rim diameter in the AR platform. In high volume rapid fire use at shooting schools. Since it wasn't ever actually an official issue to troops, I don't have field reports. Personally I like the 6.5 Grendel. It was designed as a long range AR cartridge using the lessons of the success of the .220 & 6mm PPC target rounds based on the Russian 7.62x39. It has the disadvantage of being fairly uncommon, although it's now SAMMI spec'd and in production by more than one company. The advantage is that while a 7.62 NATO bullet drops subsonic at 800 yds, the 6.5 Grendel is still supersonic at 1000. With far less kick than a 7.62 NATO, fitting in a standard 5.56 AR platform, and a "short fat" case and long for caliber 6.5 bullets, it's the distillation of experiments in long range shooting for the last century. While I've mostly commented on the long range superiority ( 1000 vs 350 ) of the 6.5 Grendel, it's actually quite versatile, and in the same ballpark as the 6.8 SPC for tactical close range work. Or deer hunting. I wouldn't hesitate to hunt Elk with one. Sure, it's no .338 Lapua, ( in power ) but thankfully, it's no .338 Lapua. ( in recoil and mass of weapon ) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/6.5_mm_Grendel For Sleez's purposes, he'd save a lot of money, short and long term, with a 5.56. | ||
| Sleez |
thank you very much, that's the way i was leaning, but was being seduced by the 400 included rounds of 6.8. i think i'll save some money by getting the MP, and possibly adding a 6.5 G upper in the future. my bud is getting a 6.5 G built at the moment, even though ammo will be tricky. thanks for all your input. having fired many round while active duty, i have not owned an AR platform in the civilian world, and want to make sure i do justice to it. | ||
| Buellinachinashop |
"thinking of either the Colt LE6920 at 1400 or an S&W mp15 Sport for 800???" Colt all the way. The LE 6920 is made in their Military/Law Enforcement factory. Open it up and compare it to an M&P, Panther or Bushmaster. You;ll see a much more rigid construction in the lower, upper and the in the bolt carrier areas. But, you're also paying more for it. The M&P Sport may well be the best AR platform for the price. Its comparable in cost to the DPMS ORACLE and the Bushmaster Carbon 15. It easily beats them both in quality. The C15 isn't an option if you ask me, but that's another story. Understand at that price point, you aren't getting things like a Forward Assist or Dust Cover, but as far as a shooter? Very nice weapon for the money. | ||
| Macbuell |
I have an M&P Sport and have had no issues with it. It functions flawlessly and I love it. If you do some googling you will find some that have done some good reviews on the Sport including some torture testing. S&W keeps the costs down by removing the forward assist and the dust cover. If you think those are important features you should look eslewhere. However, most have said, that under normal circumstances that most of us live in, those are features that aren't needed. As others have said, I'd save the $$, buy the M&P Sport and use the $$ on other things. I saved the money on the Sport and upgraded the stock and forearm to Magpul pieces, added a Angled AFGII Foregrip and a nice red dot site for less than most basic AR's off the shelf today. | ||
| Sleez |
thanks everyone, i think that is the way i am going, S&W. i bought an Aimpoint PRO last night, for just under 400 shipped, so i'll have less into it than the Colt, and be able to buy a few rounds. i may pick up a 6.8 SPC upper in the future. i will have mu GS get me on the list for the next S&W mp sport he gets in. | ||
| D_adams |
Well, my kids definitely like shooting more now. Took one of my girls to the range last night and spent a bit of time playing there. Went through about 500 rounds between the pistols and the AR. Scored a bunch of American Eagle .223 ammo a couple of weeks ago, then Saturday I found some S&W .40 at Cabela's online and ordered that. Not exactly ammo rich, but I think I can hold off the zombie horde for a little while now. Even got to correct a newb shooter's grip at the range before she got hurt (older lady in the lane next to us) and got to help out on the fear of that "scary black rifle" by letting her shoot it a couple of times. The expression on her face was priceless when she saw my 105 lb daughter shoot it rapid fire. It was like she (older lady) thought it would knock her over or something, but it didn't really even move my daughter around any at all. | ||
| Blake |
I got to shoot a .50 S&W Magnum yesterday. Awesome gun! | ||
| Blake |
Sleez-man, Colt LE6920MP with Magpul parts for $1,215 http://dsgarms.com/ProductInfo/COLE6920MP-B.aspx That's what Walmart was selling the std model for prior to the frenzy. | ||
| Sleez |
thanks Blake, that is sweet, but they don't sell that to CA, the one here is one that was already here or some such??? brand new, back in the warehouse. | ||
| Sleez |
got to shoot my desert eagle with 50AE and 44 barrels last weekend, damn accurate, and easier to handle than i thought it would be! | ||
| Rick_a |
Fun day at the range yesterday: | ||
| Bob_thompson |
My take on other calibers for an AR or other platform for SHTF scenario. What I have settled on after a little horse trading is a nice RRA Operator 2 for mid-range high volume defense and a new Ruger American in 7mm-o8 for a nice urban or long range sniper type of encounter. 7mm-08 is an under appreciated caliber that can beat any .308 round due to its superior ballistics and better ballistic co-efficiency out to 600 meters and with rather pleasant recoil and one of the most accurate, out of the box rifles I've had. And then a Glock 30 for close in encounters. The Ruger wears a nice 4-16 scope with mil-dot reticle for precise hits at longer ranges. Then there's a couple of .22's for small game harvesting if necessary. A Sig Trailside and a Ruger 10-22. All in all I'm pretty satisfied with what I have for most circumstances should the worst occur. Now just trying to stockpile ammo. And hopefully it'll all subside in 2016. | ||
| Swampy |
Looks like the panic buying may be over! I was at a Cabela's tonight and they had a half dozen AR platforms for under $1000! the also had a SHELF FULL of 5.56 for $10.99 a box with a 5 box limit! | ||
| Buellinachinashop |
There's still a bunch of interest, but people aren't willing to pay the 1800.00 for a Carbon 15 any more. I don't blame them. At any given point my Gander got in 30-50 AR platforms of various sizes, shapes, colors and calibers per week (Post Sandy Hook). What took hours to sell is now a week. Personally, in the last two weeks, I've sold a 716 SIG, 516 SIG, Bushmaster ACR, I bought a SCAR 17s and I've sold at least 6 DPMS, Bushmaster and Colt AR's. And I work part-time. We have .223 on the shelves, but it's match grade or silver tip hunting stuff for 25.00 a box. The ball ammo in 556 or 223 is kept in back for folks buying a gun. You can buy as much as you want. What was a seller's market, is quickly turning into a buyer's. | ||
| Sifo |
Just picked up some American Eagle 5.56 55 gr. FMJ 100 round value packs for $42.99 a pack a Cabela's. 43 cents a round is nice to see again. They actually had a couple of options of 5.56 ammo, but all was 55 gr. Still not a single .22 LR round in the store. No primers either. Maybe people have stock piled all they can rationalize and it's past the hump. | ||
| Buellinachinashop |
I'm not sure about people being over the ammo hoarding. I'm seeing 17 HMR now being the object of obsession. The ammo things is a going to take a while to get back to normal levels of demand. I'm beginning to deal with customers, who know we have ammo stock piled in back for folks buying guns, buy a firearm just to get ammo. Yup, that's right, I've sold a couple of 180.00 Hi Points to people just so they can buy 1500.00 in 9mm, 22 and 556. | ||
| Swampy |
Beuellinachinashop, Please, do tell about the Sig and what they are selling for... | ||
| Rick_a |
Things are getting back to normal in my neck of the woods. We're back to regular hours vs several hours a week overtime. Even black guns are back on sale. Ammo is still just trickling in. That should take a while to catch up. That said, all it takes is any talk of anti gun legislation in the news gets people excited again. | ||
| Buellinachinashop |
"Please, do tell about the Sig and what they are selling for..." The 516 and 716 Patrols are Sig's AR gas/piston systems. Unlike the 556, they're more standard AR based. Quad rails and standard charging handles. The uppers are interchangeable with the M400 gas impingement gun too. The 516 runs about 1700 the 716 a little over 2ish.  | ||
| Nukeblue |
I second the panic buy being over... trying to sell a full size a3 for $800 and nobody is biting! wtf. i've got a jeep lift to finance here! | ||
| Nukeblue |
local we have 1000 xm193 for $600 | ||
| Buellinachinashop |
Nuke, what A3 are you selling? | ||
| Nukeblue |
one i put together recently/ m&p reciever, lwrc trigger, palmetto state armory mil-spec bcg, bcm buffer tube, gun show upper 20" hbar 1/9, fixed front post. great shooter at 300 yds had no prob hitting 8"x12" plate with the irons | ||
| Rick_a |
Any 20" gun is a tough sell. Everyone wants a 16" or pinned 14.5" "M4gery." Even through the panic an Armalite 20" in the A4 style was the toughest gun to get rid of. Not being able to sell my Colt 20" Hbar at any reasonable price had me make what I wanted out of it...a 16" dissipator. (Message edited by Rick_A on May 04, 2013) | ||
| Nukeblue |
yeah it's hard to explain the terminal advantages of the 20" velocity to the tacticool crowd. i get 3200 fps out of the 20 vs 2800 out of my 14.5. HUGE difference for the 223 |
