| Author | Message | ||||||||||||||||||
     Brumbear |
Hello I am writing you to ask several questions about the 2013 tax increase. I will explain to the best of my ability my questions and frustrations. In 2012 my home was worth $248,400 with the rate of tax .02155 giving me a total tax of $5353.02 In 2013 my home is worth $160,400 with the proposed tax rate of .0304 giving me a tax of $4876.00 This is WITHOUT the 2013 budget increases making a difference of $477.00 which is going to be less. Now if I take my current value of $160.400 and use last years rate I save $1896.00 over 2012. Where in GODs name is this an acceptable increase I spend $1419.40 more then I would last year with the maximum deduction of $477.00 which will be less. Where does this money go? What services do I now have that I did not? Who decides this an acceptable rate of increase names please? I really want answers and I do not intend to stand idly by while my own local government is essentially price gouging me. I am a local guy who spends what little extra income I have in local establishment as are all my neighbors. We can not let this happen again and again our local governments must be responsible and are clearly not doing so. David Tweed This does not include my $330 per quarter sewer bill which will also be raised and attached to my tax bill!!! | ||||||||||||||||||
| Etennuly |
You weren't supposed to notice!  You are getting a tax reduction! Don't you understand that! Damn constituants.....politicians try to do them a favor and all you get is finger pointing and name calling!   You were supposed to receive your tax notice, not read or understand all of the little numbers on the page, and be happy you got in a few dollars less than last years tax bill. If everyone could or would read and comprehend what they read, political leaders would all be in trouble. Dumbing down America, grading on a curve.....it is good for all of us!  | ||||||||||||||||||
| Kenm123t |
All grading on a Curve does is let liberals get through school ! Then off to politics, they are incapable of productive work. | ||||||||||||||||||
| Blake |
I don't follow. They lowered the value of your property but raised the tax rate, but you are still paying less. Isn't that good? Or did you move into a less expensive home? Contesting property tax valuation is fairly commonplace. If you can meet in person with the applicable govt rep, then present a calm reasoned case, you'll often achieve a reasonable adjustment in your favor. Your letter prob didn't help. It comes off sounding a bit shrill. Be calm and go talk to the folks. | ||||||||||||||||||
| Blake |
What I should have said was that if all the home values in town drop,, as has happened in some towns, well the town still needs a similar level of revenue. The only way to handle the issue is that when they correct home valuations, they also have to adjust the tax rate. I hate property taxes. | ||||||||||||||||||
| Sifo |
I hate property taxes. I'm certainly not going to praise property taxes, but at least they are easy to pay. I just spent 6 hours today with TurboTax doing my fed taxes.  I don't even save receipts for sales tax deductions. I can't imagine doing this on paper forms at this point. The income tax system needs serious simplification! | ||||||||||||||||||
| Brumbear |
Sifo I just got done getting my business year ends today I hear ya. Blake I am sorry man but take a look at it again. Paying less is a good thing but It should never cost you money to do so. They lowered the value of the homes which lowers your taxes cause we are over taxed. They then raised the rate from .02155 to .0304 so now the difference is $477 when it should be $1900. What services did any of us receive to give a 29% increase because thats what it is. If you can't follow it's because like Etunely said thats what it is supposed to do. You can appeal but only the building not the property and not the rate!!!!! | ||||||||||||||||||
| Jcbikes |
NO Inflation we are told! | ||||||||||||||||||
| Crusty |
The income tax system needs serious simplification! O.K. How about this? 1) Do you have any money? 2) How much? 3) Send it all to us. | ||||||||||||||||||
| Etennuly |
The municipality got themselves into spending habits that they cannot back away from.....ergo tax rate increase to keep the fat on the table. It sucks when ALL of our governing bodies cannot follow the simple rules of spend no more than you have. Hell of it is, we are the one's letting this crap happen somehow. | ||||||||||||||||||
| Brumbear |
I am trying to stop the Bleedin ova here, but trying to get some folks to understand whats happening to em is like trying to nail jello to a freekin tree.  | ||||||||||||||||||
| Pwnzor |
The term "property tax" is an oxymoron. The concept of property in our current tax structure is an illusion. | ||||||||||||||||||
| Blake |
Dave, Put yourself in the city's position. How after a drastic drop in property value are you to pay for everything if the tax rate stays the same? Which schools are you going to close? Whether or not your city is spending judiciously is a valid matter, but that was even more an issue for 2012 it seems to me. The bottom line is how much tax you pay, not the rate or home valuation. Those are just parameters for arriving at the tax revenue the city says it needs to operate. I just don't know anyone else who would complain when their property tax drops by such a significant amount. If your situation is common to most homes in your city/township, then your city is obviously making do with less revenue. | ||||||||||||||||||
| Brumbear |
Wrong answer Blake the state pays for the schools in majority. How about we cut half of the dead weight from the towns payroll and the schools, dude we have 2000 children in the school system and a budget of $36,000,000 look it up I am not making this up. How about we get rid of the 4 aids in every class the child study teams all the extras we pay the teachers for like group leaders and crap like a superintendent in every school system and stop hemorrhaging money. When the regular citizen is over budget what do we do? And how come every other state can do what NJ does for 1/3 the cost? No the answer is responsible spending and start making asshats work for a living and stop giving out medicare like it's skittles and make it harder to survive on extended unemployment and food stamp cards rather than getting a job. WE ARE OVERTAXED see what I mean fella's Jello/tree??????????????????????????????? | ||||||||||||||||||
| Just_ziptab |
They all ready have TOO MUCH money if they can build a high school for 200 students that is "extra super top shelf everything",including a $200,000.00 weight room. $100,000.00 for an elevator installation that only ONE handicapped student could use and only for one upper floor class. How about laying to waste 400 acres of prime farmland to build a 10's of millions of dollars cloverleaf interchange connector..when they simply could have twined out the old highway that followed the rail line. Closing down a 20 year old school building (in city) and move to a school built out in the middle of nowhere where their is no quick police or fire support and every student has to be bussed in. But then,if we didn't pay taxes for those over the top construction project,there would be a huge shit load of people with out a job. Taxes seems to be a necessary and unfair evil. | ||||||||||||||||||
| Mikexlr650 |
The tax situation here in NY is out of control. It is not uncommon for the prop/school taxes to cost more than the house! To who this makes sense I do not know (and I am not talking about forclosed undervalued homes). My taxes are 40% more than my mortgage, this is criminal. Bloated gov't is a big part of the problem, we know the head of grounds for the middle school in the town next to us and his salary is 166k/yr, freakin really!!! | ||||||||||||||||||
| Blake |
I agree that you're overtaxed! I lived in an upstairs apartment in Rockaway, NJ for almost a year. Became good friends with the owners who resided downstairs. Was working contract, and was offered a job working direct. Looked into the real estate market and taxes. It's all too obvious that NJ is rife with self-entitled slugs and corruption. The valuations were astronomical right along with the tax rates. Like you say, "for what"? I agree with you there. The simple fact remains; they lowered your taxes. You're tilting at windmills. Do the math? Ok. $36,000,000 / 2,000 = $18,000 per student. Seems very high. Dave, Here's an informative article with lots of details on your new valuation and tax rate: http://hopatcong-sparta.patch.com/articles/581m-dr op-for-2013-hopatcong-property-values Sounds like you made out better than average! Following from http://www.hopatcong.org/TaxCollector.php
So your school tax comprises 53% of your property tax bill. According to that Hopatcong Sparta Patch report (hyperlink above), last year's (2012) total valuation was right at $2B. The 1.144% school tax should then generate almost $23M. You rich folks living by the lake gotta share the wealth you know.  (Message edited by blake on March 03, 2013) | ||||||||||||||||||
| Brumbear |
So I should just be happy they screwed me and gave me a 29% tax increase. I am not asking for them to give back what they STOLE in previous years. I am asking WTF they think they are doing, RESPONSIBLE SPENDING not smoke and mirrors Blake there is no decent deal here. I have no street lights no sidewalks the sewers were done 8 years ago and the roads have still not been completely repaired. The average teacher salary is $57,000 a year cause there are 5 new teachers or it would average way more. The only mistake I made in this is that it's not just NJ I was being selfish there, I apologize as my bordering and any state in the North East is currently over taxed. I do not know if Central, Southern and Western states are as effected as us I am sure there are some. What this amounts to without fancy grafts and lawyer talk is here ya go ••••••• pay for my greed. The Rich are here to make you think you will get there someday the poor are here to keep ya working so you don't end up like them, except nowadays the poor got more than we do !!! So lets see what happens when they start taking from the RICH and giving to the poor cause I quit they aint getting shyt more outa me. I am gonna do my best to start finding a fairer place to live. Will the last AMERICAN to leave NJ please bring the flag!!!!!!!!!! Piss down my back tell me it's raining and show me some con man grafts and numbers game JUST STOP BLOWING MONEY LIKE A PIMP. | ||||||||||||||||||
| Brumbear |
#1 Sparta NJ is not even on the same financial PLANET as Hopatcong and 53% is a majority and all of these drops are based on a 2012 budget not the current 2013 year so lets see how much less they are by summer. I know I have not gotten a raise in 5 years but they get there's every year so it's proof it's all smoke and mirrors. | ||||||||||||||||||
| Brumbear |
I hope this works this what we were given | ||||||||||||||||||
| Brumbear |
http://www.asinj.com/revaluation.asp?p=current&id= 278 or you can go here to read it | ||||||||||||||||||
| Kyrocket |
Well reading all your posts this isn't exactly applicable to your situation but I work in local government and the way I've heard it explained ; since there isn't much new construction going on and property values are going down the tax rate has to go up to pay for stuff everyone expects. Street sweeping, street lights, scraping and salting, leaf pick up, appliance and trash pick up in the spring, police service, fire service... it goes on and on. I feel your pain though. I can see where my city tax money goes but I pay three times or more as much to the county and get squat from them. | ||||||||||||||||||
| 01x1buell |
looks like dave and blake are getting along as always  i hear you dave, | ||||||||||||||||||
| Airbozo |
With respect to expenditure per student and the 4 aids per class, thank the "No Child Left Behind" act. When it comes to disabled (physically and mentally) children there is no expenditure limit and that is why the per student cost seems so high. Special Education departments are _required_ to spend whatever it takes to educate that child. Thank the parents and lawyers of those children. In regards to the elevator, if that was your child, you would be very happy it is there and if it wasn't you would be screaming all the way to the courts... | ||||||||||||||||||
| Johnnylunchbox |
Dave and MikeXLR I feel your pain. I pay about $1200 month (that's after the state kicking in a little for the STAR program). About 80% is school taxes. I've got no problem paying teachers and those who directly impact our students' learning, but the number of people in the costly rarefied air of administration and superintendancy (is that a word?) is obscene. My town and county taxes are reasonable, but I get nothing. No paid fire, no paid town police, no trash pickup, no sewers, got my own water well...you get the picture. In 6-10 (that's the plan in motion) years and it's sayonara NY. They will bleed no more from me. NY will lose our income taxes, tithes, and our business. Bye bye. | ||||||||||||||||||
| Johnnylunchbox |
Airbozo, I agree with you to an extent. However, couldn't they put a wheelchair ramp and teach that child on the first floor? | ||||||||||||||||||
| Airbozo |
I agree with putting services on the first floor, but the ADA does not. In public buildings they are required to allow access to all of the "normal" building (they are not always required to give access to maintenance rooms and the roof for example) to all of the public regardless of disability. It ends up taking on a huge expense to the construction of public buildings. My High School was built on a fairly steep hill and they put in ramps so every floor was handicap accessible. Made for some great skateboard races... In California they tried to tack that little gem onto the construction of ALL buildings public or private which means I would have had to install ramps onto my house when I remodeled. In a rare show of intelligence it was struck down. I agree about paying the teachers and aides that have direct responsibility for the education of the kids. Too many administrators and support staff duplicating jobs across even one district, let alone all the districts. There was a report about a decade ago, that just in one section of the Bay Area here in California, if they combined 5 districts they could save millions every year in administrative and maintenance costs alone. Instead they allow charter schools to grow almost unrestricted that suck more money from the public school system. They look good on paper because they are allowed to pick and choose the students they want in their schools. This shows an abnormally high test rate because the under-performing kids were refused admittance. There have even been instances of kids being removed from charter schools because they couldn't keep their grades up. The especially affects Special Education kids because the charter school is not responsible for the paperwork, IEP's or meetings with parents, rather their home public school is (which takes even more money out of that particular school). BTW: The SO is a special Education Teacher and Department chair at her school. She works 10 times harder than I do for less money. If I had one of my customers speak to me the way 50% of her parents speak to her I would be in jail on assault charges. ...and $1200 a month!?! That is insane!. I pay just twice that a year in property taxes. Just this year we got billed for "fire services" ($30/year) and now there is a lawsuit because of the way they handled it by calling it a "fee". | ||||||||||||||||||
| Brumbear |
You do understand I spend $5000 a year plus $1300 on sewers per year on a house worth $164,000 ARE YOU OUT OF YOUR MIND!!!!!! I don't care to much the special needs program to tell you the truth,there are 50 students in my sons 6th grade class that are in SPECIAL NEEDS give or take and guess what there are 2 thats right 2 kids that really need it. The state should pick them up and take them to a special school it would be cheeper and better for the kids unpopular maybe but THE RIGHT THING TO DO, and think about it before you say something.. what if your kid was a special needs kid and had to go to class with a bunch of children who were over medicated and off the wall cause mommy and daddy work to much or are just to lazy to give a shyt and had the kids classified and they are just constantly disrupting you child's class it's utter bullshyt and a waste. There is freekin 0 a bureaucrat could say to me and i'd probably end up stomping a mud hole is somebodys ass if they start with that bullshyt cause I AM PART of the SOLUTION not the farging problem they had there time game over it's time to take back whats ours. | ||||||||||||||||||
| Blake |
You seem to read past the part where I agree that your taxes are too high. Would you be happier if they revalued your home at $500,000 and reduced your tax rate to 1.5% ? You got a tax cut, but you're angry that taxes went up? Huh? | ||||||||||||||||||
| Brumbear |
Yeah Blake my taxes didn't get cut my property value DID WTF are on about? I paid 5353 on a house worth 248,000 in 2012 I am paying what seems to look like 5318 for 2013for a house worth 164,000 and I am not getting screwed you seem to be part of the problem as well. |
