| Author | Message | ||
     Ferris_von_bueller |
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| Froggy |
Awesome, they should also make a video about how Toyota may have killed 89 people due to unintended acceleration! | ||
| Datsaxman |
Frank, Sadly, those Toyota drivers could have 1. Shifted the car out of D into N. 2. Shut the engine off. 3. Stomped on the brakes until the car really did stop. Apparently, they panic and do not think of doing those things. But our society expects that we should be able to be passive passengers in our cars, and in our lives, and it should be impossible for any harm to come of it. You may not be old enough to remember the AUDI unintended acceleration fiasco. None of those cars accelerated except when they were told to. Didn't stop the hysteria. The Toyotas? No evidence that they had problems with the brakes, shifters, or ignition switches. Drivers simply did not use them, even though they could have saved their own lives and those of their passengers. | ||
| Pwnzor |
When we were kids, we used to say, "I'm outtie 5000" instead of "I'm outta here"... Because of the Audi 5000 supposedly accelerating on it's own. What creative kids we were. | ||
| Kenm123t |
The audi 5000s did start up and take off family across the street had one it started up ran through the garage wall family room and out through the glass sliders into the pool. This happened @ 2:30 am with no one home no keys in the car! Wild stuff 100k in damage to the house. Most of the interior walls on the west end of the house had to be redone and the pool coping. Crane that reached over the house to get car out of the pool was cool first 4 wheel steer in the area. | ||
| Just_ziptab |
"Is there an app for that"? People don't know how to think any more. People don't know what to do any more. People can't figure out shit on their own any more. I've had plenty of "runaway" situations in customer vehicles (as well as my own) as a mechanic for a couple of decades......saved everyone of them. Broken motor mount locks the throttle linkage wide open....saved. Cruise control servo stuck wide open......saved. Throttle pedal sticks wide open due to ice in the cable....saved. Throttle pedal caught wide open,wedged on the floor mat....saved. Governed 4V throttle body locked wide open from being worn out..saved. Throttle locked wide open from carb icing up...saved. On new car pre delivery road tests,we would chirp the tires to make sure the parking brake worked. First 5.0 Mustang II we got in .... and a coworker went with on the road test. Told me to check the parking brake and I yanked up the console handle to chirp the tires. The release button disappeared under my thumb as the handle grip slipped up the lever. Car was going to do a 360° at 40 mph. Saved before it even got to 45° by simply pushing the grip back in place to expose the release button. Most recently,the slave cylinder for the clutch in my truck went away as I left the parking lot at work. Made it through 9 stop lights and several stops signs on my 25 mile commute............with zero clutch disengagement.I doubt that anybody I was sharing the road with was aware that I even had a problem. Anybody else would have rolled over, gave up and called it a day. | ||
| Pkforbes87 |
"the slave cylinder for the clutch in my truck went away" Same thing happened to me not long after buying my first car, but the cylinder had bled out while the car was parked and I was away from home. Happened to be within sight of a shop owned by family, so I drove it there by mashing the clutch pedal to the floor (disengage the clutch-starter safety switch) and letting the starter drive me 1/4 mile  | ||
| Datsaxman |
Zip, You were doing great until you became the only guy in the world that could think. LOTS of folks I know have been through similar situations and learned to cope on the spot. I have better gear now, but grew up broke and scrounging. We mickeymoused a lot of stuff. MANY epic saves back in the day. Ken, Calling BS on your whole story. Got any references? | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
Had an old diesel van runaway once, apprentice had over-filled the oil-bath aircleaner. I got it stopped by simple expedient of slipping it into neutral & coasting to a screaming very smoky stop. Tried to stall it but just fried the clutch, it ran til' it grenaded. Happy days. | ||
| Team_ruthless |
I remember as a youngster we once took my friends parents audi for a spin around 1 am. we drove around for an hour and a half without incident but when pulling it back into the garage my friend hit the fad instead of the brake. Car went straight through the wall and ended up in the pool. We pulled the key out and ran to hide. We hid for hours trying to come up with a story. We finally decided to tell the truth and just as my friend was about to open his mouth his dad interrupted "you're not going to believe this! the car started itself and drove right into the pool" | ||
| Sifo |
I've got to call BS on the Audi starting up and driving off too. That would just require many failures to happen all at once. | ||
| Xodot |
want a good conspiracy theory? a computer programming dude - just to see if he can do it or maybe he holds a grudge and wants to damage the company- hides code in the vehicle's computer which will remain dormant until some random series of events occurs, such as at a certain time of day, if the left turn signal is on, ambient temp is a certain degree and the headlights are on (feel free to insert other random vehicle conditions here)- then the computer will make the vehicle die/accelerate/change gears/ABS system disable the brakes etc... and then erase the code so it can't be found. Yea thats just too crazy to be possible I know. | ||
| Sifo |
I know of a systems software guy that did that sort of thing when he left a company. It's not impossible. In the case of the Audi you would first need an ignition switch failure to both boot the computer and engage the starter. It would also require a failure of the gear selector to have it in gear while also bypassing the neutral safety switch. These are all separate systems that are designed to fail in "safe" modes and are not controlled by computer for the most part. BTW, the Easter egg left by the guy I know was found before it did anything. | ||
| Froggy |
It would be easy to start the car these days without doing anything with an ignition switch at all, the only safety that wouldn't be easy to bypass is the shifter, unless it is an electric/hybrid as many do not have any physical connection between the gear selector and the transmission. The Prius comes to mind, you press a button to put it in park, and the shifter is just a lever that you move to "D" for half a second (while pressing brake). I could easily see programming that car to start and go into drive. As for erasing its own code? Not impossible, but unlikely given that most of computer systems (including Buell ECMs) are on Read Only Memory. Like I said, not impossible, but unlikely. Also regarding shifting into neutral/turn key off/etc for dealing with a runaway car, that isn't always an option, and most of the runaway car scenarios have been situations where you only had a few moments to react to avoid a collision. I know for a fact that with the Prius (tried it first hand), you have to hold the power button in for several seconds for it to shut off, assuming it will let you shut off. The shifter isn't physically attached to anything either, so if you put the lever to "N", you are just asking the car for permission, it may or may not go into neutral. If the car is indeed bugged, it is very possible it won't let you pop it in neutral. Hell I've had the car get mad at me and refuse to shutoff because I had the doors open while in neutral. | ||
| Team_ruthless |
Maybe the audi was just a really bad case of turbo lag? Or maybe it was a manual transmission and a screwdriverleft under the hood by a careless mechanic fell on the solenoid and the starter just cranked it through the wall and into the pool? | ||
| Kenm123t |
DATA Ill look in my pictures collection its in the 35MM bunch It was wild stuff | ||
| Thumper74 |
I've driven all of the cars in the recall... Most of them cannot combine 'sudden' and 'acceleration' together. Sorry. I realize that people panic, but those accidents should have never happened on Toyota's side of things and on the driver's side of things. | ||
| Sarodude |
This again? The Audi thing turned out to be fat American feet not being able to distinguish between throttle and brake. Audi's biggest crime was a somewhat narrow pedal spacing. CBS news had RIGGED the car they used in their tests and got raked over the coals for it. They could not make this problem occur naturally. Unfortunately, when the real story comes out and it turns out that you, your neighbor, or your spouse is responsible for killing someone due to ludicrous incompetence, we don't want that story to take hold. The toyota thing is no different. Take a normal car. Mash the throttle. Then mash the brake while keeping the throttle mashed. Oh, don't do this with a 3 year old in front of you on a tricycle. I hope you guys really aren't serious about this stuff. Doesn't seem close enough to April 1. -Saro | ||
| Hootowl |
I've had the throttle stick on my truck due to the throttle arm getting wedged under my air cleaner when I neglected to install the spacer after doing maintenance. There was a brief moment of pucker, followed by a shift into neutral and a turning of the ignition key. I failed to smash into other cars or small children in the two seconds it took to recover. I certainly didn't have time to call 911 and complain that my throttle was stuck. FYI - mashing the brakes and the gas on my truck would result in acceleration. Drum brakes don't do shit when you're sitting on a 400 hp small block and 4:11 gears.  | ||
| Froggy |
Who is to say that the brakes will even apply? Many cars these days (even plain gassers) use electric throttle and brakes. If it is a software glitch and the car isn't responding to input, you can step on the pedals all you want. Your only hope is the parking brake, and that will not stop a car with the throttle suck at WOT. | ||
| Sifo |
There's a TV show (Speed Channel I think) "Dumbest Stuff on Wheels". The title describes the content well. They do a regular segment on folks who hit the gas instead of the brake and smash things up. It happens all the time with all kinds of vehicles. Every once in a while we bunch our panties when we hear of three people with the same brand that did this. Toyota really got raked over the coals lately simply because a government owned car company was trying to compete with them with inferior products. | ||
| Chauly |
I believe DOT still requires a direct mechanical connection between your foot and the hydraulic system of the brakes. It also requires the system be split so loss of fluid at any one wheel will not wipe out the entire braking ability of the car. Now, that being said, we've become such a nation of wimps that the average driver would not likely have the strength to bear down on the pedal should the electric, vacuum, or hydraulic boost go away, especially since the event would be met with several seconds of "WTF, I have no brakes!" rather than pressing harder and harder. In fact, pressing hard enough to actually stop the car would probably feel like the pedal bottomed out on the floor, when in fact the effort merely tripled! | ||
| Sparky |
I've had the opposite problem with my 7 yr old Vette. There were a few instances last year when the car wouldn't start after hitting the keyless start button. The most serious time was when I stopped at an auto repair shop to check on my cousin's car. After pressing the button repeatedly for about a half hour and charging the battery (which wasn't low on charge), it finally decided to crank with one more button press after sitting for a few minutes. There were other weird symptoms of electronic problems happening around this time too, like the cruise control and air conditioning would stop working, multiple alarms, ECL and signs (icons) of ABS & traction control malfunctions happening too. The car would run though. The dealer said these were indications of miscommunication between the various "modules" and sensors in the vehicle after I spent $105 to find this out. I took things in my own hands and removed every fuse one at a time, cleaned up some ground connections and checked for parasitic drains. It hasn't misbehaved since. Whew! Thank goodness. I seems that the more electronic features they put in cars these days for nanny safety and luxury items is just asking for trouble. Things could take a turn for the worst when the next solar storm hits the earth later this year and disrupts satellite communication and electronic devices worldwide. Ugh! | ||
| Chauly |
I remember an Audi ad bragging about the 5 miles of wire in an A4... | ||
| Hootowl |
"The more they overthink the plumbing, the easier it is to stop up the drain" --Scotty | ||
| Sifo |
Our buses get weird problems all the time. First thing we are always told is to shut it down and restart it. It's surprising what ailments this seems to fix. | ||
| Hootowl |
Its ECM must be running Windows | ||
| Thumper74 |
Froggy, what cars have electric brakes? Many cars have electric parking brakes, but I haven't seen one without a direct link from the pedal to the master cylinder... | ||
| Dennis_c |
I had 1990 Jeep start up on me two times the first time it cost me 1/2 tank of gas the second time I was laying in bed and I heard it start up | ||
| Gunut75 |
I had 1990 Jeep start up on me two times the first time it cost me 1/2 tank of gas the second time I was laying in bed and I heard it start up  Ignition switch malfunction? | ||
| Sifo |
I'd like to hear how this happened on the 1990 Jeep. Was the problem found? Did it have a remote start feature? Was it the ignition switch? I find it hard to believe that an ignition switch is ever likely to magically short out both the starter circuit and the start circuit at the same time (especially with it then returning to normal operation). I could see where a remote start feature could get triggered accidentally. If properly installed you could never put it in gear and move the vehicle though. Please tell the full story. | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
The Jeep-style of malfunction is better than the old recalled Ford ignition switch malfunction. Most of the failures resulted in a car that didn't start. Some of the "lucky" ones got a fire. Some of the "really lucky" ones got a fire in their attached garage. My friend's 1988 LTD switch failed him in the boring way. He had to hotwire his own car to get home. He ended up installing toggle switches in his dash for ignition, accessory, and start. (key was still required to unlock steering). | ||
| Tiltcylinder |
Way back when... I had a Suzuki TM75 two smoke. My first two smoke. Bought used for fifty bucks. Throttle would stick wide open, and for the life of me I couldn't figure it out. Replaced the throttle tube and cable, kill switch was missing as well as the wiring, so I tied a string to the handle bars, the other end around the plug wire. WFO, one handed in the dirt, yanking on the string... priceless! The PO had shimmed the needle, running it without the foam air filter. Turned out the barrel slide was so worn from the dirt entering the engine, the throttle cable tension would tilt it sideways, the raised needle then sitting in the throat instead of going back down into the jet. Reringed, rejetted and replaced the filter and slide (individual bits n pieces were available way back then) and set the needle back into a decent position. I was twelve maybe? Footpegs mounted to the bottom of the engine cases... tore them off doing a ridiculous jump... 20 feet in the air... that... ended badly!  | ||
| Blake |
>>> Many cars these days (even plain gassers) use electric throttle and brakes. Electric brakes on conventional vehicles?  |
