| Author | Message | ||
     Ft_bstrd |
http://www.pjtv.com/s/GQ3TOOI "The rich get richer and the poor get richer too." The "war on poverty" is as feckless as the "war on drugs". Entitlements have NEVER been about fixing a problem. Entitlement programs are about wealth redistribution, control, and vote buying. It's about confiscating from one group to buy the vote of another group to permanently perpetuate power. | ||
| Oldog |
cant get that to work. been watching c-span so I have it in "their own words" careful, Social security is an "entitlement" WE paid into it, WE are entitled to draw from it... WE have paid into and for Senior care programs as part of our taxes, WE have paid for Unemployment, etc WE ARE ENTITLED TO DRAW FROM THESE ( those who paid into them ) What I want to KNOW WHO ARE THE 51% who are not paying taxes, Why are they out walking around, why cant they pay their fair share? | ||
| Teeps |
Progressives my *(&^, more like Oppressives'. They won't be happy until we are all miserable. Now that, to them, is fair... | ||
| Guell |
How about i keep the taxes i pay into social security, meicare/cade, senior care programs etc and i just have the opportunity to not use them? Id be happy with that. I can do better investing my money than the govt obviously can. (Message edited by Guell on August 06, 2011) | ||
| Cityxslicker |
social security is a ponzi scheme of grand proportions, perpetuated as criminal from day one upon many generations. You were NEVER intended to collect on it. The original pay out underwritten beneficiary period was 10% higher than the median age of the contemporary populus - and as long as there was a good war at hand, nobody was the wiser. Gen X knows its bankrupt. PS - My HS senior paper that nearly got me expelled corrolated the SSN digital tattoo that follows you from cradle to grave on par and as indelible as the Nazi numbers that they branded the Jews with. its a failed system, and was designed to be 'redistributive' from the very beginning. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
The point is that these programs are intended to "raise people out of poverty". What they have done is provide a standard of living on the dole that is on par with those who work for a living. Why would you get up early, strap on, and go out and fight for your part of the American Dream if you can just have it delivered to your mailbox once a month? | ||
| Ducbsa |
Here's another good one: http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2011/07/doorbell.php (Message edited by ducbsa on August 07, 2011) | ||
| Oldog |
The point is that these programs are intended to "raise people out of poverty". Social Security ?? did you mean welfare? My understanding SS is to supplement retirement savings // pensions Welfare, should come with drug testing, and a time limit. | ||
| Sifo |
SS was a program to address poverty for the elderly. Brings up an interesting question... Does one "retire" from welfare? | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Social Security, from the very mouth of FDR himself, was NEVER intended to be a cradle to grave benefit for retirement for ALL Americans. It was meant to provide a basic benefit so that the poorest didn't reach retirement and starve to death. The original retirement age of 65 was when the life expectancy was 67. It was NEVER intended to do what it's doing now. So yeah, I mean Social Security in the big picture, but in this example, I'm talking strictly about medicaid, wellfare, Section 8, Food Stamps, and all the other benefits designed to give the poor a "hand up". It's become a job just to work the system. I want OUT of Social Security. Give me half my current payroll tax to invest as I want to for my own benefit. I want out of medicare as well. | ||
| Guell |
^^ bingo! | ||
| Blake |
Bill Whittle is wonderful. Spread the word about his YouTube videos/channel. | ||
| Blake |
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| Oldog |
Thats great and were I 20 years younger I would completely agree, heres the rub SS/medicade is not the only social engineering project the states/ federal have under taken, I was robbed of most of my retirement by the court system where it is viewed that in a divorce 1/2 of my retirement savings were hers by ?? "Divine right" I paid for several years of hidden shopping, gave up a house I was paying for etc I have had a costly education.... I took the meager balance from the investment pros at RBC CENTURA bank for general incompetence, and silly charges accessed to my account when they were loosing money. I have paid into SS for ALL of my working life, hence my feelings of entitlement, I would happily manage it my self if they want to return it to me no interest 30+ years it should be a tidy sum... I would have preferred perhaps a federal tax free savings account that I put money into and was paid interest on that could not be touched for any reason except a scant few,( serious illness, home purchase ) and no social experiment engineering could touch, perhaps the balance could be left to a spouse, and I could add to as elective also tax free and congress could not touch, As I understand it SS had lotsa money but the congressional whiz kids of a few decades ago decided that they needed it for some or another reason I expect to have issues when I can no longer work and the money that I paid the feds is not available, likely I will be homeless..... medicade // medi care is going broke for the same reasons the medical insurance premiums are going thru the roof, Plus all of the bilking government programs get If I am un-employed I will maintain catastrophic insurance with say 5-k deductable that limits my exposure in a serious incident // illness last time I purchased it the cost was about 250.$$ a month, VS $850.00 for the BCBS | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Jim, I am not advocating stripping you of your SS benefits, and I would oppose ANYONE who would advocating any such action. You are too far down the line to change course. I want them to draw a line in the sand and say over this line, you get full benefits. A second line farther out would provide limited benefits but lower SS taxes. Farther out no benefits and no taxes. You're on your own. I advocate raising the SS age for the middle group and raising the wage base for all tax payor to fill the gap and finish off the egg through the snake. | ||
| Two_seasons |
I'm 57. I'd gladly give the gov't all the money I paid into SS for the last 40 years. They can have it. But no more from me. I'd have more money at retirement running my own show than I'll ever see out of SS. | ||
| Velocity |
"If the US Government was a family, they would be making $58,000 per year. They spend $75,000 a year, & are $327,000 in credit card debt. They are currently proposing BIG spending cuts to reduce their spending to $72,000 a year. These are the actual proportions of the federal budget & debt, reduced to a level that we can understand." = An accountant I know told me this. Scott | ||
| Guell |
id like to be in the no benefits category. I'm for stripping some ss benefits. Id never gamble my future on the govt. (Message edited by Guell on August 08, 2011) | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
If you really want to work the system, become an ordained minister. Ministers can opt out of SS and Medicare. | ||
| Blake |
>>> Ministers can opt out of SS and Medicare. I don't believe that is accurate. | ||
| Blake |
However, my understanding is that government/public employees do not pay SS or Medicare. | ||
| Oldog |
Blake X father in law was a govt employee some of these folks ( most ) perform some useful service He was attached to the Dept of agriculture IIRC they have NO SS bennies, his wife may not be able to draw either, I would be suprised that ministers could opt out, AFAIK they can draw... Jeremy I would support such a plan that would end the system and lighten the tax burden, or change it to a system like I outlined above, where you could have an IRA that the feds could not wreck Sadly years ago I thought of it ( about matts age ) did not know then what I know now, On the bright side other than the house and bike I am debit free and have some savings.. I have paid a high price for my education I wish I could find some way to save young folks the grief I went thru (Message edited by oldog on August 08, 2011) | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
I don't believe that is accurate. See Section 1402(e) of the Internal Revenue Code I was being facetious in my original statement, but ordained ministers CAN opt out of the self employment tax for wages earned as a function of ministerial service. http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f4029.pdf | ||
| Blake |
Jeremy, That isn't just for ordained ministers, and not for just any religious faith. According to the document...
So only folks of very particular faiths that have been in existence since 12/31/1950. Which one(s) I don't know. Not any of the mainstream ones I don't think. | ||
| Blake |
Oldog, The retirement benefits offered gov't employees in place of SS are a lot better than SS. It's just one more way the Progressives have managed to entrench big gov't into America. I don't see how it is constitutional. It creates a privileged class. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
So only folks of very particular faiths that have been in existence since 12/31/1950. Your reading foo is no good grasshopper. Title 26 if the Internal Revenue Code was enacted in 1954. Title 26 includes Section 1402(3) which governs the minister exemption. The 1950 date was established as the go forward date for all denominations that have been in continuous existence since 1950. | ||
| Ducbsa |
Here's another good one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=958v6tD8Vw8&feature =player_embedded | ||
| Doubled |
That is an inaccurate statement. State/county/city/municipal employees are not exempt nor do they have the choice. Federal? I dunno. | ||
| Cityxslicker |
I know after November 84 they take it out of your military pay.; unless it is overseas, double bonus for danger, sea, language, and spec pay. I miss those fat checks. | ||
| Blake |
>>> Title 26 if the Internal Revenue Code was enacted in 1954. Title 26 includes Section 1402(3) which governs the minister exemption. Then why did you offer form 4029 as evidence for your statement?  I'm still not seeing the specific exemption for ordained ministers. Subsection (e) of section 1402 of the codes states... (e) Ministers, members of religious orders, and Christian Science practitioners(1) ExemptionSubject to paragraph (2), any individual who is(A) a duly ordained, commissioned, or licensed minister of a church or a member of a religious order (other than a member of a religious order who has taken a vow of poverty as a member of such order) or ... Sounds like anyone who is a member of a religious order can apply. See the full text at http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/26/usc_sec_26_00 001402----000-.html |
