| Author | Message | ||
     Kc10_fe |
Free trade needs to go away. The only items flowing freely outward are American jobs and greenbacks. The only thing flowing freely into the US are illegals and cheap contract labor to replace you. If or when we experience austerity measures like Greece, I hope you are prepared to be shocked beyond belief. 43 million Americans or 1 of every 7 are on some sort of assistance. These are very sad times. I spent over 15 years of my life flying US Aid to other countries in peril from whatever you can imagine going wrong. Very few countries outside Europe value life as we do. Nobody can come to our aid but ourselves. | ||
| Kenm123t |
Diversion of topic is done when the liberal has no real postion other than what they feel. The reason we are out sourceing jobs and oil production is because we have allowed people that live in fear to unlimited influence. liberals always live in fear or disgust. They are perpetually unhappy. For a time they lived in a free country now look at the actions of the Proglibdemon infested nut jobs They are totally incapable of handling freedom they want to be controlled and every one else to be as well. Friend has a dog big sweety he is fine on his leash etc his big upset is seeing another dog walking along without a leash. goes nut till he see s the other dog is leashed. Similary PRLDNCs are afraid of freedom and dont want any one else to be free! If you want to know what the constitution really means read the Federalist papers Once you do you will realize the fact the US is a country is a miracle As for Obama and the debt debate he is a Kidnapper LOOK GRANNY GETS NO CHECK IF I DONT GET THE MONEY! And its your fault! I had to do its on you! If you can't see the connection may be you should refrain from voting. Mentally we have a criminal or a 9 year old. operates from Poor me the race card or extortion. | ||
| Sifo |
BO continually blaming everything on Bush is not good leadership either. The irony is that the fault that Bush does carry in this mess is over spending. The loons claim that tax cuts were the problem, but tax revenues when up under the Bush tax cuts, just as predicted by the Laffer curve...  What we have is a straight forward spending problem. We are addicted to spending beyond our means and like any addict we will have our day of reckoning. Just ask Amy Winehouse. | ||
| Kenm123t |
Good one Sifo | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Free trade needs to go away. What does this mean? | ||
| Kc10_fe |
Exactly what I said. Free trade is as free as freedom that wasnt fought for. Free trade = cheap trade at your expense. Free trade has made us ever weaker as a nation. Internationally resourced production? Look up Boeing 787 to see how well thats come together. Shop Rite grocery stores sells garlic grown in China. WTF? China that uses coolant in toothpaste and produces kids toys loaded with toxins is growing your veggies. What other nation on earth with our resources has done so much damage to itself by not maintaining self control in the name of profit margins? Special interest groups in Washington have lobbied us into this mess while most of America was asleep at the wheel planning Disney cruises or hoping theres a paycheck next week. A nation without an identity is what we have become. I just hope our kids never have to experience what Ive witnessed in Africa. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
My question is what does "go away" look like? What alternative do you propose? | ||
| Whatever |
Has the debt ceiling been lifted a hundred times since its inception? Is not a Minority (T partisans) attaching unreasonable (INSTANT) demands to it? Isn't that called a filibuster? Let's say for sake of argument we were heading in the wrong direction... is the way to solve it to hold the debt ceiling hostage until the economy collapses? That is the question. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
For progressives, the government cannot EVER be too large. The folks elected in the 2010 mid-term elections were elected SPECIFICALLY on the ideal of shrinking the size and scope of the Federal government. The debt ceiling provides the optimal back stop to force meaningful changes in the size and scope of the government. The real question here is whether progressive leadership is willing to bring the economy to a halt and risk default just to protect their own bloated programs and overgrown bureaucracies? Conservatives aren't saying they WON'T increase the debt ceiling. Even the hated Sarah Palin says that an increase in the debt ceiling is a foregone conclusion. Conservatives are simply saying we won't increase the debt ceiling without a corresponding reduction in the size of government. Consider the raising of the debt ceiling as a refinancing of existing debt rather than a new $2.4T credit card with a zero balance. | ||
| Reindog |
Without substantive change, we will unequivocally collapse. Now is the time to force the issue. 2010 was a clear mandate. Next stop to flush this Socialist garbage: 2012. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
My sincere hope is that every single piece of progressive legislation will require those advocating it to crawl naked over the political equivalent of Tobasco soaked glass. No compromise. No surrender. Article 1, Section 8 Tenth Amendment | ||
| Whatever |
Why are analysts saying the debt ceiling needs to be raised to pay for Past Appropriations? Why does Congress go through an actual budget approval process if the point of the debt ceiling were to leverage demands on opposing viewpoints ? Is not the budget approval process meant to determine how much is spent in the future ? +1 on what kc is saying... I wouldn't want to live in a deregulated China type country | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Why are analysts saying the debt ceiling needs to be raised to pay for Past Appropriations? Because analysists are looking a quarter or two ahead not the next 50 years down the road. They put out the closest fire. Right now it's the short term impact of refusing to increase the debt ceiling. Past Appropriations are specifically what the Conservatives are looking to cut. The issue is that Progressives do not want ANY past appropriations to be cut nor do they want to have the capacity to enact new appropriations to be curtailed. Why does Congress go through an actual budget approval process if the point of the debt ceiling were to leverage demands on opposing viewpoints ? Is not the budget approval process meant to determine how much is spent in the future ? Sure. The issue here is that an actual budget hasn't been passed. There wasn't one passed by the previous congress nor was one permitted to be passed by the current congress. The last budget passed was in 2009. Progressives don't really want ANY budget that might prevent the passage of another government program. We are in this mess partly because the budgetary process has been abridged. +1 on what kc is saying... I wouldn't want to live in a deregulated China type country Unfortunately, progressives see the world only as all regulation or no regulation. There is no middle ground. No one is saying throw out ALL regulations, but there is such a thing as overly restrictive regulations. The regulatory process should be decentralized and pushed back to the states where the Framers intended it to be. I can't imagine that someone who makes a living from government regulations would ever want to see LESS regulation.  | ||
| Court |
Be mindful that many of these analysts are the same ones who missed last months economic results by LIGHT YEARS. The big o came out bragging about how he was putting things on track . . come to find out . . when the errors were corrected things looked the worst they have in years. They, the ones required by law to produce a budget every year, haven't done one in 800 days. Pure and total incompetence. Try not paying your taxes for 3 years. | ||
| Sifo |
Char, It's true that there have been may hikes to the debt ceiling. GDP has also gone up during that time. It's the ratio of debt to GDP that's important. That ratio has been relatively steady for many decades. It's been moving in a bad direction, but at least at a slow pace. During the past couple of years spending has gone right out of control. See for yourself. A picture explains it best...  See the sharp upturn in debt vs. GDP? That's a huge problem. I'm guessing the analysts you are listening to are some of the same folks that thought that massive spending would keep unemployment below 8%. Or as Court points out, the same ones that missed last months economic results, or the month prior to that. Some of these analysts have a pretty poor track record. Other analysts have predicted higher unemployment along with the massive spending, voiced doubt about the posted growth numbers of recent months, and say that we need to start cutting taxes in a big way and stop the spending. These folks seem to have a much better track record. | ||
| Whatever |
Well Court... no budget IS f'd up... | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Why wasn't a budget enacted by the outgoing Congress of 2010? The reason is two fold: 1) None of the Democrats fighting for re-election wanted their name on a budget with their specific "projects" spelled out in black and white. 2) A budget would force an accounting of the $1T+ slush fund that has virtually NO oversight. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Is the truly illegal war prosecuted by Obama still going? Where is Code Pink when you need them? The best thing Obama can hope for is defeat in 2012. Impeachment is looming for him otherwise. | ||
| Court |
I see part of the problem . . . I just watched someone in the House of Representatives named Jim McDermott. He assures us that all of the present drama is contrived just to make the big o look bad and that there is no problem. The good part is that he tells us it's insane to try to pass something so quickly without having time to read, study and debate it . . in his words . . . "governing from the back of a galloping horse"., Yep . . . the same guy who insisted folks sign obamacare before the bill was printed. Every time I think . . . "no, that can't be this stupid" . . . I am proved wrong. | ||
| Kenm123t |
Raising the debt ceiling is only part of the issue. Obama wants to spend even more so do the demos These are the folks Franklin warned us about. Demons want unlimited access to the countrys treasury and no accountablity or budget. Dealing with demons is like dealing with children. Spoiled Bratty children that threaten to do something bad when they dont get their way. | ||
| Kenm123t |
Look up what happened when Smoot Hawley was passed in the late 20s the great depression. American Companies need to less gov interference and red tape | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
It was Obama who recently said that there is no reason why someone who has "excess" income that they don't need should keep it while there are people who need grants and student loans didn't have them. It's great to know the master plan is to determine what constitutes "excess" and confiscate it. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
End of "free trade" = Smoot Hawley | ||
| Cityxslicker |
yep... and look what happened when they repealled Glass Steagall - that was the writing on the wall. Every historical economist knew it. I divested of insurance, credit, and banking that month - never happier. You put financial derivatives hedged against deflationary assets against unsecured, unmitigated risks - you get a crash. Every time. And it is about to happen again with the health care 'Exchanges' 2016 looks to be very interesting. (ie O gets reelected, look for him to avoid a 3 term limit for that election) | ||
| Sifo |
Is the truly illegal war prosecuted by Obama still going? Would that be the bombing in Pakistan, Libya, Yemen or Syria? | ||
| Reepicheep |
Having Glass Steagall was a problem, and not having it was a problem also. I'd like to see something like it that is more focused on transparency and accountability, rather than just saying what businesses a company can and can't be in. And maybe an insurance or bond requirement for companies that could be declared "too big to fail", and the insurance provider has to be backed up with enough actual money that they could survive large economic meltdown. | ||
| Rocketsprink |
Yep. It's all Obamas fault. Keep drinking your nut job Kool aid. For people that THINK they're smart, ya sure buy into the rightwing bullshit. There hasn't been a "legal" war here since WW2. Both parties are equally at fault. I hope you all have enough money to help out your elderly or disabled family members. But don't worry, the millionaires that you're all so worried about protecting will be just fine. Maybe they'll "create" a job for you to help offset your rising costs.  | ||
| Ferris_von_bueller |
FUBAR | ||
| Cityxslicker |
Glass Stegall was repealled under Clinton - it wasnt a good Idea then. (and technically INSURANCE companies are REQUIRED by law to have reserves to cover policy failures and payment to a ratio basis outliner) HOWEVER when you could now combine Financial 'securities' and 'investments' that were based on stocks, markets rather than bonds, annuities and munis - you had them shifting money from the left pocket to the right pocket, and hedging their losses in a speculative bid against cyclical market fluctuations (7-11 years) and with the hype on the dotcom bubble and over investment in that sector without any real assets - it crashed. The same way housing crashed, the same way healthcare will crash, the same way the US dollar will collapse. PS he did 'create' a job- its just that mine is overseas. | ||
| Court |
>>>>Yep. It's all Obamas fault. Interesting to hear you say that. I'm not sure I believe it. Can you back it up? |
