| Author | Message | ||
     Videoninja |
Does anyone have this or know where its available? I am thinking just the pegasus. | ||
| Blake |
Highly proprietary copyrighted material. What you are asking is for someone to commit a crime. Ask Erik Buell Racing, if they are willing, then you're good to go. If not, then you'll be obliged to do without. | ||
| Videoninja |
No I am not asking anyone to commit a crime I was asking about availability of a logo. Something that it is not uncommon for a company to make available. If I had said "hey I need some one to print me 100 shirts with this logo so I can make a profit from them." then I would have been asking someone to commit a crime. Or even if I had asked someone to make the logo and then in turn I gave them money. But all I did was ask if and where it may be available. | ||
| Nillaice |
Erik Buell Racing is not running parts sales til next month, while they are busy with the 1190's. let's not jump to conclusions, and toughen our skins. this is the interwebz after all | ||
| Videoninja |
I am also going to say that the logo most likely isn't copyrighted but it is trademarked. Which also make quiet a difference in the legality of everything, especially if it isn't a registered trademark which I have to assume it isn't from what I see on the Erik Buell Racing website. | ||
| Blake |
The difference being that to my knowledge EBR do not make their logo available for public use. I don't know any large corporations that do. If any company were to do so, they would risk rights to enforce their copyright. Also, the quantity of merchandise matters not. The solution is simple, ask the good folks at EBR. | ||
| Blake |
>>> I am also going to say that the logo most likely isn't copyrighted but it is trademarked. Isn't it amazing what you can find said on the internet? The willingness to "say" something, regardless of veracity a common affliction. We can do better. A good start would be a brief overview of copyright and trademark law.  | ||
| Videoninja |
The number I used was arbitrary, I understand it doesn't matter. I was just trying to point out to you what I was doing was not criminal or even close. BTW is badweatherbikers.com or BadWeb a registered trademark? | ||
| Blake |
Vninja, If this is for purely personal use, it might help to clarify that. Lacking any declaration of intended use can raise suspicions. | ||
| Videoninja |
I didn't expect anyone to loose it and accuse me of trying to commit a crime. I guess I should have known better than expect the best from people. But yes its for personal use. | ||
| Blake |
Not "registered", no. There is no need. Copyright law covers it. Many are ignorant thinking that lack of "registered" status opens the door for trademark infringement. It doesn't. A quick overview of the law might prove beneficial, certainly educational. Hint: Our logo and web site domain have been in easily verifiable public existence for over ten years, and we've never allowed the unauthorized use of either. We did once defend our copyright to "BadWeatherBikers" as a domain name. The result was being gifted the ".net" ".us", and ".org" versions of the domain space. The law is clear with plenty precedent. Why do you ask? | ||
| Videoninja |
I saw a few places on the site where you use the "®" and I was just curious as to whether or not it was actually registered.  | ||
| Court |
>>>A good start would be a brief overview of copyright and trademark law. And if you need them I've got plenty of books. Essentially . . when a person "acts" like they own it . . . they essentially do. I generally, as a couple folks here well know, cover myself by doing silly things like mailing myself notes to get a postmark on them to establish "date of first use". To clear this up. Yes, the vector art exists. It is currently being modified. The ONLY legal way to get it to avoid "imperial entanglements" is to write Erik Buell Racing and request permission. That should clear that up . . . | ||
| Videoninja |
Thanks Court! | ||
| Blake |
Unfortunately our experience is rife with hucksters and greedy folks with poor ethics. Good to know you're one of the good guys.  . I hope you can understand my concern. Good luck with your project. | ||
| Court |
>>>Unfortunately our experience is rife with hucksters and greedy folks with poor ethics. There does seem to have been an inordinate amount of that during the past year. It's unfortunate that the guy seeking to make one belt buckle for himself gets caste with the thief . . . but there is certainly good cause for concern lately. | ||
| Pkforbes87 |
Can someone clarify something for me..? I'm under the impression that personal use of a company's logo is 100% legal and the off-limits part is making a profit off of the sale of merchandise with that logo. I had 2 E.B.R. stickers made at work for my personal use just a couple weeks before E.B.R. started selling them. Would this be considered illegal too? | ||
| Court |
No Just like the .pdf manuals. . . I'm willing to bet that anyone doing anything unethical or in violation of any laws/regs . . . is well aware. "De minimus" use . . for personal use . . won't get anyone's hackles up. It's the folks that copy things like tank decals, .pdf manuals, and other items subject to IP that go awry . . Again . . . I'm willing to bet that no one, in their heart, has any doubts at the time. Common sense was great back in the days we used to have it. | ||
| Blake |
I'd clarify that the "profit" part isn't the deciding factor. >>> the off-limits part is making a profit off of the sale of merchandise with that logo. Any unapproved use that could be shown to degrade the value of the logo would be illegal. So if someone were giving them away or selling at no profit, or employing the logo in a problematic fashion (think back to the porno shoot at a particular H-D dealership)... still illegal. | ||
| Davegess |
Blake has that right about the legal aspect of it. BUT, if you use it personally and don't call attention to the use and the use is not causing the trademark and or copyright holder any pain they are unlikely to care or even notice. If you are making a cool key chain I say go for it. If you are making a sticker for the truck; Erik could use the money, buy one. The art in question is copyrighted at it's creation. Trademark only work if you register them and you have to pay to register them for every product to want to use them on. AND even if you register the use but don't actually produce the product the trademark and be void FOR THAT PRODUCT. In other words if your trademark the Erik Buell Racing Pegasus for use on water bottles but you never actually make any water bottles some one could challenge this and they may win. The phrase "Erik Buell Racing" can be a trademark (it likely is) but I doubt if it can be copyrighted as short phrases are exempt. | ||
| Court |
>>>Erik could use the money, buy one. That's an accurate statement. I've got a listing of the current status of 274 Buell Trademarks.
| ||
| B00stzx3 |
Edited after reading more.... Good to see you're not trying to sell bootleg stuff on ebay!!! (Message edited by b00stzx3 on May 18, 2011) | ||
| Ratbuell |
Common sense was great back in the days we used to have it. ....and then our legal system bred it out of the species, by training society at large that there was always someone ELSE to be blamed. When we lost the sense of personal accountability, it was all downhill from there. If we all proclaim to "like" Erik, and his bikes, and his Values...why not just ASK the guy for permission? I've met the man - he won't get mad, he won't get rude...and even if he says 'no', he'll probably make you feel good about it while he's doing it I guess what got folks' hackles up here is, he's a nice guy. Genuinely NICE. So do him the courtesy of asking HIM for his product. | ||
| Videoninja |
I did email Erik Buell Racing still waiting on a reply the guys are busy and that is why I asked here first. A lot of questions can be answered on this forum with out bothering the people we are supporting. I just didn't realize I would bring on this shit storm by asking a simple question. Next time I will be more cautious about what I ask. I have met Erik as well and I agree he wouldn't get mad and would probably allow me to have what I need. | ||
| Blake |
>>> ... this shit storm... Huh? I thought this was a very informative and helpful discussion. Ratbuell nailed it. | ||
| Court |
I sure don't see the shit storm but I also agree that there likely won't be any answer for a while . . . . things, for the next several weeks, are 100% focused . . . no orders, no e-mails, phones off . . . myopic. The answers, I'd be willing to guess are that someone has it. Erik doesn't and that they can't allow it to be distributed. Honest answer to an honest question. | ||
| Ratbuell |
I did email Erik Buell Racing still waiting on a reply the guys are busy and that is why I asked here first. Then open the post with "hey all, I tried emailing Erik Buell Racing but they're understandably busy right now so I thought I'd see if anyone here could help". Y'know, just to avoid the "shit storm" from all us oversensitive types  |
