| Author | Message | ||
     Cityxslicker |
From EVERY according to their capability to the NEED read the original source text, the NEED is not reflecting back onto to every, but to a singular neuter elipsed object... and subsequent text the GOVERNMENT determines and Assigns the NEED. and has in a 5year plan since the inception of the Soviet Socialist Union. Forced contracting, manufacturing, consumption and allocation. The only true Communist society is of a single individual on a deserted island. There communism will work. | ||
| Blake |
Aren't there agricultural communes in Israel that work okay? But those are entirely voluntary. Big difference to a state/nation cramming its ideology down our throats. | ||
| Eboos |
That video is too funny Sifo. It sounds like Marx trying to defend his ideas against history, yet again not having a real grip on reality. The people that believe this stuff must be incredibly naive. | ||
| Reindog |
Rocco, You are being silly. -Reindong. | ||
| Kenm123t |
Rocco thinks every one is like he is thats why he thinks every one is evil and and cheats his employers. As he accuses employers of cheating American workers. Hate is comsuming him the problem is not with every one else He needs to do some soul searching and come to grips with why he hates everyone. Want a better life improve yourself! before you try to bring others down. Sheeple that think they cant make it with out the union. Unions will learn they have no ability to create only to limit and destroy. Those with the ability to create will do it with unions or inspite of them. UNIONS KEEP IT UP and you will lose BOEING! Boeing will leave and or shut down. As a stock holder if they need to leave the US inorder to do business with out being extorted Ill send in my proxy to move out of the US. and leave the union extortionists behind. If the unions will work in cooperation with companies as a team great I would have no problem with them. But they cannot control theier envy and greed. The IBEW destroyed its self in SO fla with extortion tactics so did the Sheetmetal workers and roofers. They rioted and tore down a building under construction and put the car dealer out of business. Insurance doesnt cover labor riots. Unions act like professionals and you will be treated that way act petty and like animals and you will be treated that way. Oh and if we are so mean and hateful why do you even come here. Your attacks are sad like a trapped animal snapping and biting at every one and thing in reach. | ||
| Reindog |
We are his guilty obsession. Rocco secretly likes us.  -Reindong. | ||
| Kenm123t |
LOL Rein may be its a cry for help! Froggy Blake new section please CAN THIS PROGLIBDEMON BE SAVED ?  | ||
| Strokizator |
I found this to be interesting. A few years ago I did a construction job in Vonore,TN. Beautiful area. Guess which group of people represented a large contingent? Retired UAW workers. I thought that was strange. If some corporation wanted to build cars in Tenn using non-union labor they would have been up in arms. But when it was their decision on where to spend their money then they had no problem leaving a high tax state and spending it in a right-to-work state. I guess the last UAW guy who was loyal to his union and retired in Michigan was Clint Eastwood. Wait, that was just a movie. | ||
| Kenm123t |
Union memebers will pay guys on the side to do work on thier houses. But will scream like a stuck pig if they scuff a boot on the job. Like the BS I get to pay them 4 hours to go flunk a prehire drug test! I paid 20 hours plus benes to hire one guy that could pass the drug test. I needed 1 fitter this took 3 weeks to accomplish. and then the guy could only weld down hill turns out a dc down hill pipeline fitter. Ended up welding it myself let him fit it and I welded it couldnt wait any longer. BTW there were 300+ on the bench. | ||
| Court |
Be mindful that the I.B.E.W. Folks currently doing time in prison were convicted of providing non-union labor and allowing the contractor to ignore union rules while billing NYC for union rates. Rocco is not an evil individual. He's a nice guy who's tried to extrapolate using inferential data from a small population. He's working with flawed data. The good news is that the more he and Dana say they are leaving forever ...... The more time they spend here. I enjoy hearing the diversity of opinions. Being a 3rd generation union guy I was fed, and bought, the same line of bullshit for years. There used to be a good reason for both unions and spark advance levers on steering columns. | ||
| Sifo |
I was looking for an instance where communism actually worked. All I could come up with was a small group of blue people. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Want to see some interesting accidental demographic studies? Go to a Predators hockey game when they are playing Detroit. The stadium is 50/50. Nashville is the Red Wings second home field. Between the defunct Saturn plant and the Nissan plant and headquarters, we have quite a few people from Michigan. I guess they go where the jobs are. Those jobs are NOT in Michigan. | ||
| Aesquire |
Communism has never worked on a scale larger than a commune. And seldom for any time. A few communes have endured, for a time, but only by purging those who will not work hard, try and overthrow the leaders, etc. The Original Surviving American Colony was Communist, before the word existed. It failed, and just before they all died from starvation, figured out it doesn't work, and went on to be running dog capitalists. Then we went to the Moon, and no one else has. ( there's a few centuries in between..... but you get the drift ) Pity they don't teach history anymore. | ||
| Kenm123t |
The UA leaders should be in Jail for Looting the pension to build a hotel for the off chance Fla will allow casino gambling. Killed off Ulico insurance all illegally with my pension and annuity money. then got a pass from Dept of labor and DOJ. Tired of fools still playing the union rah rah game telling me I owe them a living. If you dont like it quit change careers or start your own company. But stop the name calling hatred and whining. Funny thing in So fla the nonunion a/c fitters make about 60% more than the union guys do and have real insurance When you start a merit pay system to compensate your top performers you get a nasty gram from the local telling you to stop! | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
The really sad part of this discussion is the fact that the government is coercing private companies to deal only with one group to the detriment of another. Evidently to some there are "good" Americans and "bad" Americans. If you are union, you are "good". If you are not, you are "bad". The insestuous relationship between government and unions is the worst form of corruption. If you are ok with it, you are part of the problem. | ||
| Reindog |
Rocco, care to chime in? | ||
| Kenm123t |
Thats Roccos pension fund too probably having a stroke. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Hit and run. | ||
| Dobypaw |
Let's say you work for a company that has many factories around the country and they have a national union with national vote to that one contract. Now say the company made a net profit of $14 billion and did not have to pay taxes on those earnings not to mention they have been averaging $15 billion in earning every year with the CEO taking his $14 million bonus during the rough spots the last 3 years and they came to the employees and said they want to change your health insurance, take away pension, have new employees make $10 less an hour and a laundry list of other take aways. How would you feel about that capitalist company? I work for GE and that is what they have made and what they are doing. They are complaining that benefits nationwide is to high and it hurts their bottom line. Whether you like or dislike unions we still need them to keep these greedy companies from putting people into poverty level pay rates and terrible health care. But if your a business man or have been working non-union and are brained washed by those greedy companies you will never understand that whatsoever. GE energy where I work specificly the plant I work in has made a profit every year including threw the great depression and threw our current national problems. When a company can still make that much money we need unions to keep them in line and not screw the employees over that make them that money. | ||
| Reindog |
Dobypaw, Congratulations on having a job! I trust you are doing everything in your power to bring extra value to your employer. It sounds like your CEO is worth every penny he is paid. However, if you are that angry at your greedy, capitalist employer, then I suggest you leave and start your own company. But beware. Eventually, your employees will start looking at you as a greedy capitalist once you are successful. -Reindong. | ||
| Hootowl |
It is interesting that you're complaining about GE specifically. Immelt is so far up the left's ass when they have chicken for lunch, he has it for dinner. It's just a bit ironic, I think. | ||
| Xl1200r |
Dobypaw - my girlfriend had a job, the pay was lousy, the bennefits were lousy and the hours were worse. You know what she did? She didn't bitch and moan and go to her union rep (yes, it was a union job), she quit and found better work somewhere else. All you've shown in your example is that, despite you being in a union shop, the evil corporation is still greedy. | ||
| Sifo |
GE is a very diverse company. Not every subsidiary will be making money every year. You should be proud that your subsidiary has been so consistently profitable. Your lack luster comrades thank you very much for carrying them in their non-profitable subsidiaries. A good socialist should be happy to share their success with the less productive members. You are sounding very capitalist with your ideas that you should get something simply because your area has been consistently successful. Learn to be happy that your needs as, defined by your overlords, are being met. You really must learn to not be greedy. That is capitalistic and evil. | ||
| Sifo |
All you've shown in your example is that, despite you being in a union shop, the evil corporation is still greedy. It's even more so in union shops. The adversarial relationship between employer and union make it so. It's the nature of a union shop. Find a good non-union shop and things can be very different and profitable for all involved. Union lifers will never understand that. | ||
| Johnnymceldoo |
Part of GE's new green campaign is to reduce worker consuption through reduced pay. Does msnbc own GE or is the other way around? They Doin you dirty like they did keith olberman. | ||
| Court |
So much time and effort expended on the envy of someone, something of somebody who appears to have a better deal.. If you are relying on a union to provide for your comfort, success and security ..... You are indentured. I depend on me. I own the successes as well as a spectacular collection od royal •••• ups. It's worked out better than could ever have wished for. The things the union offered provided none of the elements that contribute to my happiness. Self reliance, on the other hand, has always made both the good times and the bad times better. | ||
| Buellerxt |
Hootowl! quote: Immelt is so far up the left's ass when they have chicken for lunch, he has it for dinner. unquote  Sifo, great explanations and plays on posts! Great stuff and spot on. A major problem this country has is the large number of poorly educated folks who have for generations been able to go to the steel mill, or paper mill, or textile mill, auto plant, steel plant, etc., and with a union card have a good standard of living though they had no skills to offer elsewhere. As the world has gotten a lot smaller, and competition has gotten much more fierce, too many of those people have clung to the past, refused to face reality, and have tried to get others to carry them. Those folks will now have to get educated, compete for a good job, or have their standard of living reduced significantly. The good ones will suck it up, ENSURE that their kids get good educations, and face the new reality that a good life isn't handed to you, your son, and your grandson at the mill down the street. The slugs, and their are far too many of them, will whine, protest, and seek ways for the rest of society to carry them. I certainly empathize with the good ones who will take personal responsibility and realize they have to adjust and carry their own load. I have zero use for the ones who want to be carried. | ||
| Reindog |
I was a Teamster parcel sorter and truck loader at UPS and looked forward to being such for as long as I wanted or until the technology made sorters and loaders obsolete. One day, I decided that was not good enough so I hopped on my motorcycle and got an application to San Francisco City College and started taking classes. Imagine not studying math for eight years and then diving into calculus. Ouch. Now I have a Masters Degree in Electrical Engineering and design state of the art Integrated Circuits that have gone into F-18s, set-top boxes, and future stuff that I can't tell you about. Stop yer whining and hop on yer motorcycle and change yer life. Stop bitching about greedy capitalists who provide you with unlimited opportunities. It is getting MORE than tiring. 10/4 on the f***ing things department that Court mentioned. I have my own scrapbook of failures. Oh well. | ||
| Cityxslicker |
gonna go out on a limb here, but the only time I have ever seen a team, unit, company, entity survive, excel, and grow without profit motivation was in the military. For the most part, and e-5 is making the same as every other e-5 out there; there is very little option to add to your pay (without say having kids and up your BAH rates -which for my part is a beyond stupid reason to have kids, but I have seen it enough) there is the language flip pay, the deployment pay for sea duty, the hostile zone pay, and maybe the per diem if you were attached to the command eschelon (which I was on several occasions) but really those are exceptions and not the rule. But the gang in the military, I have yet to have met and talked with one that was successful that did it for the money. The common good of the team based on performance, merits, longevity, and proficiency to the benefits of the team, unit, company, battalion - it works; when the motivation and the attitude is forward Gung Ho;.... get into a station with no vision, no motivation, and just punching the clock..... and you will see how bad it gets as well. (headfone linguist jobs are very much time clock sensitive) | ||
| Sifo |
I understand the need for unions in heavy industry where they protect workers from dangerous situations and ensure they aren't worked to fatigue that can be dangerous. The union that really gets under my skin it the teachers union. They are probably the most powerful union in the country. WHY? Who ever heard of a teacher getting their arm torn off when their chalk breaks? Who ever heard of schools forcing teacher to work double shifts (kids aren't in school that long!!!)? Teacher are well paid and most tend to just go through the motions. Even prior to getting tenure there is little incentive to really do a good job. Then the union works against any legislation that can get objective data on their effectiveness through standardized testing. They claim that will lead to teachers teaching to the test. ISN'T THAT THE FREAKIN' IDEA!!! If they could teach the kids the basics that's on the test I wouldn't be too upset about most other things they may want to teach. Teachers and their union want to put the other stuff ahead of the basics though. That's just wrong! |
