| Author | Message | ||
     Fast1075 |
If there were no WMD's...I reckon Insane and Chemical Ali killed all those Kurds with Taco Bell Burrito Bombs.... | ||
| Drkside79 |
Sifo, I believe the point in the Iraq debate is this.... Was Saddam an awful human being YES. Was he any worse than half of the rest of the problem children? NO So why then were we attacking Iraq when we allow the rest who were probably more unstable to run rampant. For example half of the continent of Africa or NK? Am i glad Saddam is gone. Sure our military did a great job an I am proud of them. Were they and I lied to before they got there absolutely. To quote Court we need better leaders an in all honesty I think we got one. Flame Away boys... | ||
| Scooter808484 |
All I'm saying is Bush went to war in Iraq, and sold it to the American public based on huge stock piles of WMD. Then they couldn't find any, in anywhere near the quantities the had earlier claimed. If Obama, or Clinton, had done the same, most of you defending Bush would be calling for his head on a pike. Need to be fair. Oh, and while remembering dumba$$ vice presidents. Anyone remember Dan Quayle, or Sarah Palin for that mater. | ||
| Cowboy |
I have never seen so much misinformation in my life all invasions were right on target the only thing wrong was all this nation building. there is no way we will ever make them like us. The only thing a Arab understands is a cuff up side his head.The ans is. Go in kick his Ass and go home. Put the fear in them and stop trying to teach them any thing It will never work. | ||
| Sifo |
Sifo, I believe the point in the Iraq debate is this.... Was Saddam an awful human being YES. Was he any worse than half of the rest of the problem children? NO So why then were we attacking Iraq when we allow the rest who were probably more unstable to run rampant. For example half of the continent of Africa or NK? There's not a single difference, but numerous smaller and bigger differences. A couple of big ones are that we were already militarily engaged with Saddam and he had for 12 years failed to live up to peace agreements and useless UN resolutions. President Clinton also claimed Saddam had WMDs. This was the assessment of many intelligence agencies around the world. Without knowing what was shipped in the military convoys heading into Syria just days before the invasion we will probably never know if they existed for sure or not. One thing I do know for certain, I have NEVER heard any theory on what was being shipped to Syria that makes as much sense as WMDs. The point being made though is that the decision to invade Iraq was not a good decision. I would like to hear from any of the nay-sayers what they feel would have been a better way to handle Saddam. The status quo wasn't going to stand, as there was a growing political movement to end the sanctions and no-fly zone, claiming IIRC 250,000 deaths per year due to the sanctions on Iraq. So I will ask again... What would you (anyone feel free to jump in here) have done with Saddam back in 2001? | ||
| Sifo |
Back to the original topic... It's been released that we got information on plans to attack trains in the US in September of this year. I haven't heard of arrests being made regarding this plot, so I have to assume these terrorists are still on the loose. Is it really wise to notify the terrorists that we are aware of their plans before we have actually stopped them? | ||
| Cowboy |
I do not mean to or want to hijack this thread but as we have discussed every thing here any way I want to inject this. As we would like to have a friend in this regen Think and comment on this. Just recent ther is shots being fired between India and Pakistan. We know that Pakistan is not our friend. Next has any one have any evidence of a Hinda or a Budist being a teroist? They both have nuclar capabilits. Lets just see what BHO will do, I am willling to bet He will back the Muslin side I think we could contain them through India and never have to send a single troop.(speak up) | ||
| Scooter808484 |
So I will ask again... What would you (anyone feel free to jump in here) have done with Saddam back in 2001? Nothing. As I said before. Finish the fight in Afghanistan. As someone else said, we leave despots sitting around all the time. Right now, NATO is bombing the cr@p out of Libya, but in Syria the police are shooting the demonstrators in the streets and we're not doing anything. Why is that? We defend Taiwan from China, but do little for Tibet. You can't bomb the cr@p out of everyone all the time, so you have to make a choice. My choice, in your hypothetical situation, would've been to finish bombing the cr@p out of the Taliban and leave Saddam to rot. | ||
| Scooter808484 |
One more thing then I promise I'll shut up... Right inside this very long thread we've had people blasting BO for going to Ground Zero and meeting with families, as a pure political photo op. Next page we have folks saying what a great thing it was for Bush to announce " End of Combat." So meeting with victims' families at GZ is a photo op, but flying to the deck of a carrier in full flight suit from a helicopter in front of blazing network cameras is not a photo op????? Come on, just tiniest bit of objectivity would help here. | ||
| Sifo |
Nothing isn't an action. I have to assume that you mean you would have pulled out from defending the no-fly zone. That is exactly what Saddam was hoping for so that he could restart his WMD programs. We know this from documents that were obtained as a result of the Iraq war. Contratulations, your option would have left the world with a much more powerful despot that has a history of being willing to use WMDs. Let's just say I'm glad we didn't follow your choice. What do you consider "finishing the fight in Afghanistan"? Afghanistan is the war that will go on endlessly. The tribal war lords of Afghanistan have shown this to be true time after time throughout history. So when is it "done"? Right now, NATO is bombing the cr@p out of Libya, but in Syria the police are shooting the demonstrators in the streets and we're not doing anything. Why is that? I still have no freaking idea why we are now in Libya. I wish Mr Teleprompter would explain to the people exactly what our interests are in Libya that he claims we are protecting. | ||
| Sifo |
One more thing then I promise I'll shut up... Right inside this very long thread we've had people blasting BO for going to Ground Zero and meeting with families, as a pure political photo op. Next page we have folks saying what a great thing it was for Bush to announce " End of Combat." I think you are misrepresenting any discussion that has occurred on that topic. I sure didn't see what you describe. You are free to support what you say with timestamps from the comments you speak of though. | ||
| Xl1200r |
Afghanastan is where empires go to die... | ||
| Sayitaintso |
Afghanastan is where empires go to die... Sad to say, but that has more or less been the historical pattern. | ||
| Blake |
You cannot consider Saddam's regime in Iraq in 2003 in a vacuum. The man had known ties to al qaeda. He agreed to play nice with them. He had vast experience and supposed stockpiles of very nasty chemical and biological weapons agents. After 9/11, given those facts alone, he and his regime absolutely had to be taken out. When you then recall SH's bewilderingly miscalculating behavior, his invasion of Kuwait, attacks against Saudi Arabia and Israel, both allies of ours. You say he was no different than any other tin pot tyrant. Bullshit! When did Kim Jong Il invade and wage war against our allies? Be honest. What other tyrant was committing genocide of two entire indigenous peoples in his own nation? Kurds and the Shia swamp arabs. Please name another malevolent tyrant in this time frame with such a history of invasion, warmongering and terrorism. The man publicly, in the Iraqi news media, praised the 9/11 attackers! Get real! Get honest! No responsible American patriot who has sworn to defend us from all enemies could have ever allowed the mass-murdering, warmongering, terrorist, tyrant to continue in power. Period. Get honest! | ||
| Sifo |
It just dawned on me what we are doing in Syria... We're  | ||
| Reindog |
That would be most entertaining. Be forewarned, I attended Antioch College in Yellow Springs, Ohio in the seventies and lived in San Francisco for seven years. I literally have heard it all but fire away. Before Antioch became insolvent, heterosexual couples had to have a written agreement concerning what they were about to do to each other before engaging in sex. The dude could be hauled in front of a student committee if there were deviations from the contract. I believe homosexuals were exempt. I attended Antioch at a happier time when we had coed showers and Wednesday was LSD night. I just noticed that the number of posts on this thread now requires nine bits. Not bad for less than a week. Sorry to go off topic. (Message edited by reindog on May 06, 2011) | ||
| Scooter808484 |
OK, I'm convinced... Trump/Palin 2012!! | ||
| Ferris_von_bueller |
NO So why then were we attacking Iraq when we allow the rest who were probably more unstable to run rampant. Containment of Iran Create a forward operating base for our military outside of Saudi Arabia | ||
| Buellboiler |
WMD - How many months did the U.N. play their stupid game of words? Well more than long enough for the Russians to come in and remove most of the stock. Doesn't anyone remember Powell showing the satellite images of Russian truck convoys? I'm just guessing that they were not hauling play sand back home. | ||
| Aesquire |
There were none. Yes, there were. Some were found. How many is more than none? The Poles were rightly proud of their find. Your opinion does not fit the actual facts. ( true, If I were Bush I would have put poison gas shells on display in the Rotunda of the Capital. Bush sucked at self promotion. ) Then they couldn't find any, in anywhere near the quantities the had earlier claimed. False. 2 points. we found some. We found the Yellow cake Uranium. We found Anthrax, etc. True, not in the quantities we expected. The quantities "earlier claimed" were the counts from the UN weapons inspectors. When, under threat of war, Saddam let the inspectors back in, they went to the places they had put seals on the bunkers full of poison gas. Empty. where did they go? The answer to that question has not been given to the American people. Nor do we know who murdered my fellow workers with Anthrax. Or where it actually came from. "The Iraq Debate" is bogus. Perhaps we should not have gone to war with ground troops in Iraq. That would not have been my choice. big hairy deal. Maybe the next guy will ask me. Once the Prez sends our troops off to war, it's real. repeated lies about motivations, facts easily disproven, and the constant parroting of propaganda from not only Bush's political enemies, but the enemies of the nation, does not serve you well. Now that Barack has sent us into another war, I can, with honor and conviction, argue about how to do it better. I can, with honesty and integrity state that I disagree with going to war with this particular dictator. My reasons may be humanitarian, practical, or emotional. I'm not going into a rant on "why do we kill Gaddafi's kids, when the Kims in Korea are far worse?" There's some sense to that...but it's bogus in that we are bombing Libya, and not Korea, and the Prez has ( badly IMHO ) stated his reasons. They make sense, he's doing what he thinks practical. He's not giving the parameters of his decision making process. I'm split on that. I want to know, but don't want our enemies to know. If you seriously are asking "why do we attack X when Y deserves it more" I have to assume you are either asking us to attack Y, or being disingenuous. ( that's polite for an excess of fecal matter, common in leftists, Klanners, and politicians. ) I have never seen so much misinformation in my life all invasions were right on target the only thing wrong was all this nation building Agree. The way to go is to remove the existing leadership, ( of the bad guys's nation ) and wait for the phone call from the new guy with an offer of friendship. Repeat as needed. Pakistan. Some of the guys are good, some are fascist nutballs, too many are old fraking medieval monsters. We need to either have weird but "friendly" relations with them, or take them out. Just don't trust them. Odd, how leftists will protest anything American while ignoring mass crimes elsewhere. The explanation is, if they went to, ( say ) Syria and protested that mass murdering dictator, they'd be killed, and here, they are safe. Insert coward insult here. | ||
| Aesquire |
There is a war thread. This is the Bin Laden's dead thread. I'm sorry for digressing. I have a question. When we buried Osama at sea..........did we Chum first? | ||
| Aesquire |
http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/osama-bin-laden-raid -al-qaeda-playbook-revealed/story?id=13544154 Am I the only one who thinks this is an election thing and not smart strategy? | ||
| Sifo |
Yes. With pig parts. | ||
| Kenm123t |
I hope they filled his baggie with lard | ||
| Moxnix |
"Naturally the common people don't want war... Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders... All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism." ~ Herman Goering As a chronic conspiracy theorist, I, too, expect another bout of trouble on the horizon, fed by the the death of bin Laden. First, the economy is in shambles, unemployment is sky high, price inflation is excessive, and the US military has been co-opted into an attempt to assassinate Gaddafi. Second, our money is being destroyed before our eyes. The wars are not going well for the ruling elite, and Obama's ratings are horribly low at the beginning of his presidential crusade. One very important factor is that criticism of these wars is growing at an accelerated pace. Dislike of the insidious TSA is also becoming much more evident. We are told that the scourge of the east was dead. One would think that the head of the monster had been forever severed, and that the war would end, but that will not be the case. The politicians and talking heads in the media immediately went on the offensive, and stated that we should be even more vigilant in the war on terror because there will be more attacks due to bin Laden's death. All that is now necessary to prosecute the next war by the US is an attack or threat of an attack. What the triggering event will be is not easy to discern in advance, but whatever it is will be obvious once it occurs. Any event that heightens the terror alert or brings calls for retaliation should be examined carefully. It could be a downed airliner, an attack on a US embassy, a bomb inside our borders, or any number of other things. Regardless of the type of aggression, I'll take heed, but won't assume anything. We need not fear any foreign invader. Just ask our government which chooses not to profile people entering this country, chooses not to bolster our southern border, not to keep anyone out unless they are on "the list." The government lies continuously, no matter which party is in power, and any attack is in this government's, and its corporate partner's best interests. I'd much prefer to see a new "cold war," fought on the sly, full of clandestine machinations. Of course, there's not a lot of money to be made, nor heroic speeches by our politicians. Hot wars keep the newsies flapping their jaws and politicians collecting lobbyist's money into election coffers. The only cold war I conjure up in my ultra-vivid imagination is the one against the American people by our leaders in government and industry. | ||
| Ezblast |
"..The only cold war I conjure up in my ultra-vivid imagination is the one against the American people by our leaders in government and industry..." That is no joke. EZ | ||
| Cityxslicker |
What I would have done.... (and this is why I dont have the finger on any big buttons) Dome of the Rock; Cruise missile and hot pickle. Mecca, Medina, Neutron Baghdad Palace Hot Pickle Iranian 'Research' Nukes... hacked, hijacked, and off line. Somalia - Glass Afghanistan - Agent Orange the Poppy Fields, and a good dose of Laissez Faire to let the Russians back in and finish the job they wanted to do And finally. OPEC - done. F'em, if we are there for oil, then lets get the oil. MTV, Porn, and Reality TV piped into Arab countries on rotater; all tarrif duty free export of booze, cigarettes and and all DEA drugs seized are now air dropped into Iran/Iraq Tis the will of the Sitch oh and that Bahrain causeway, turkey shoot. ( I also Like embedded plastique into 'donated' monitors to terrorist entities... build your forums and your Youtube sites... one of these days taht monitor becomes claymore ) dont even get me started on what I would do with that pourous southern border. | ||
| Moxnix |
See, there is a way to fight terrorism. | ||
| Johnnymceldoo |
I haven't heard the announcement that were going to turn oba ...I mean osamas...I mean usamas mansion into a christian recreation center. | ||
| Steveford |
I really don't care which administration this happened under but I would like to say thank you to everyone who persevered over the years. Good riddence, Bin Laden, you evil bastard. I always thought that guy looked like Gumby, by the way. My late wife bought a flag for our house right after 9/11. I've since remarried and moved. The house came with a flagpole in the front yard but I never hung anything up on it. I bought a flag for our new house right after I heard Bin Laden was fish food. The flag looks good. I love that picture of Bin Laden's burial at sea (floating sandal) and wonder if his name will come to be reviled in the Muslim world. (Message edited by SteveFord on May 08, 2011) |
