| Author | Message | ||
     Sifo |
For those that really think we will be better off with high gas prices, consider that it is basically a huge tax on the poor. It taxes the rich to a much lesser extent. It will also raise prices on everything that you buy, not just gas at the pump. Again this is a minor inconvenience for the wealthy, but can make or break the poor. BO suggesting that if you can't afford gas, you just need to by a new car really is a "let them eat cake" moment. I'm not suggesting we dust of the French guillotines, but I would like to see leadership that has a freakin' clue. | ||
| Johnnymceldoo |
If we applied my idea to coal and other sources of energy think of the global impact we could make. By raising the cost to produce energy will reduce the ammount consumed. Our leadership has some tough choices ahead that may not seem like a good idea at first or be very popular but we need some fundamental change in our country. | ||
| Aesquire |
By raising the cost to produce energy will reduce the ammount consumed. That's called poverty. Poor people don't use as much gas. because they are broke. Our leadership...... What tough choices? Your leadership has already decided to cause massive inflation, raise the cost of energy, and tell us we can live on unicorn farts and moon beams. You are right, It's not a good idea. It's not popular. ( among those with a clue as to market forces, and the wild success of centralized planning ) The fundamental change is to the failing social democracies of Europe. A few problems. Europe is going broke, even with us to carry the defense load. ( face it, right now the Russians are freaking out. "We didn't take Europe because of Nato???! Damn it!!! We'd be in Paris now, instead of Moscow!" ) Europe has been living a socialist pipe dream, and they just ran out of other peoples money. ( except, funny enough, ours. And we borrowed it ) When fuel prices rise, oil companies get richer, you get poorer, and everything that gets shipped gets more expensive. The transformation of food into fuel is fuelling not your car ( ok, 10% ethanol. Mandatory NY, Poorer mileage, corrosion problems, separation issues. etc. ) but unrest throughout the planet, because food cost too much for poor people. Every "it's for their own good" idea seems to screw the poor, tax me extra, and somehow, "The Rich" get richer. Could that be because Congress is made of rich guys? I drive an old van, 16mpg. VW TDI 40mpg, Cyclone 55mpg. I bet I tread lighter on this Earth than many, perhaps greener than thou? ( like it matters ) and way less energy use than Al Gore, Barry, Harry, or Nancy. By an order of magnitude. You want ME to pay for their "sins"???? | ||
| Aesquire |
Oh, and lay off the natural gas for cars, we need it for homes. All power plants that run on coal & nat gas, should convert to pebble bed nuclear. Coal should be converted to diesel and high test. Also a space program so we can have orbital solar. Where you don't need water in the desert to wash the panels. | ||
| Gregtonn |
"So what if we inflate our cost on gasoline? Auto makers in turn make smaller more fuell efficient cars so we all keep driving to work. We also will buy less oil from other countries and emit less pollutants." That is so ignorant on so many levels. Maybe I'll address it later. In the mean time you should turn off the electricity, heat, A/C and hot water until I get back to you. Hope you don't have anything in the fridge and freezer that you can't eat before it spoils. Oh by the way, good luck cooking on that wood fire. You do have lots of wood don't you? G | ||
| Moxnix |
Algae based biofuel. | ||
| Cataract2 |
Greg, burning wood puts out pollutants. Should just use a magnifying glass to cook with. | ||
| Cityxslicker |
met a guy tonite that is running his truck off an auxilary hydrogen battery fuel cell adaptation. The technology is over my head, but he uses it on his Ford F 250 and seems happy with it. He said he was working on trying to get the city to pony up for the equipment rather than buying priuses.... anything to keep more of them off the road, sounds like a good idea to me ! | ||
| Whisperstealth |
>>>If we applied my idea to coal and other sources of energy think of the global impact we could make. By raising the cost to produce energy will reduce the ammount consumed. I try not to be a smart ass, but really? WTF? You eat an extra huge bowl of "Lefties" this morning? Or are you the product of our awesome mind bending process Err.. educational system? >>>Our leadership has some tough choices ahead. Agreed! >>>that may not seem like a good idea at first or be very popular To them. Easy or a good idea to them. Honesty and Integrity is a mirror they won't look in. >>>but we need some fundamental change in our country. Agreed! BUT! - F'ing over the average man, while the elite continue as before has always been the road to perdition and subjection. Go visit Russia. To see the effects, as well as the brain washing. - Many there long for a return to commie-ville. How F'ing sick is that? How corrupt must things be? Aesquire - Nailed it! | ||
| Cityxslicker |
umm, capitalism is alive and thriving in Moscow. Ru. Hell, they're even HIRING. | ||
| Hootowl |
So Johnny, are you saying that energy prices would necessarily skyrocket?  | ||
| Gregtonn |
"Algae based biofuel." Okay...Where are these algae ponds? How many gallons of fuel do you get per acre of pond? Is energy needed to convert the algae to usable fuel? If so what percent of the final energy yield is used in this conversion? G | ||
| Hootowl |
It's actually pretty high. There are strains of algae that live in sea water that are up to 50% oil by weight. We've got plenty of non arable land that can hold tank farms. Just have to convince the environmentalists that the sand flea population won't be adversely affected. It's an interesting technology, and one that I personally believe holds the most promise, as the resulting energy can take advantage of our existing transportation infrastructure. | ||
| 99savage |
Really would like to see a tax on OIL, not energy, OIL. With still more tax applied to imported oil. BUT - BUT - Written into law that income tax rates are reduced to make it "revenue neutral". - More oil tax revenue, less income tax paid. If we are worried about "the poor" (I am), have nothing against the idea of adjusting the income tax rates in a "progressive" manner. | ||
| Johnnymceldoo |
Yes hootowl energy costs would "necessarily skyrocket". We are just like any other country but we consume so much more. Its time for us to use less, produce less and learn how to live more harmoniously with our other friends on earth. If it takes a good nudging to accomplish than that's what it takes. | ||
| Sifo |
Really would like to see a tax on OIL, not energy, OIL. With still more tax applied to imported oil. BUT - BUT - Written into law that income tax rates are reduced to make it "revenue neutral". - More oil tax revenue, less income tax paid. If we are worried about "the poor" (I am), have nothing against the idea of adjusting the income tax rates in a "progressive" manner. You say you are concerned about the poor, yet would support a tax code change that would shift the tax burden from the wealthy to the poor. You might just want to rethink that whole tax code change thing.  BTW, one of the best ways to promote wealth development (helps the poor) is cheap energy. | ||
| Sayitaintso |
From what I understand they are even setting up algae farms at existing power plants to run the CO2 emissions through the algae tanks and let the algae "scrub" the CO2 while at the same time increasing the growth rate of the algae. Seems like a good thing from the eco-folks point of view. | ||
| Cityxslicker |
Any time somebody comes along saying it is for the good of us all, or we should all get along' I am ALWAYS amazed at how quickly they will exclude themselves from the very same process, regulations, taxation, limitations, or litigations/imprisonments/repossessions/seizures/f orfeitures. If I knew for a certainty that a man was coming to my house with the conscious design of doing me good, I should run for my life. Henry David Thoreau | ||
| Moxnix |
>>>Okay...Where are these algae ponds? Algae ponds? Nope. >>>How many gallons of fuel do you get per acre of pond? 20K to 60K gallons per acre, per year, depending on configuration of growing system. >>>Is energy needed to convert the algae to usable fuel? Sure. How much would be a question for a commercial refiner. >>>If so what percent of the final energy yield is used in this conversion? See above. When I'm not being a post ho' here, a portion of my time has been spent R&D'ing an algae growing system after being approached by a group operating a hospital and school in Buchanan County, Liberia who needed biodiesel for generators and as a marketable product for self support. Other specific information is proprietary, but thanks for your questions. A ton of algae sludge for the pharmaceutical or cosmetics trades is currently going for about $9000. High protein dried cake after processing can be a byproduct for human (in Africa) or cattle consumption. | ||
| Pwnzor |
Ummmmm..... NO. Its 2:30pm, my day is only half over, and I have already put $184 in my gas tank. YOU can pay euro-prices for gas all you want. In fact, at those prices, I will deliver it to you at no extra charge. How does that sound? | ||
| Sayitaintso |
High protein dried cake after processing can be a byproduct for human (in Africa) or cattle consumption. I couldn't help but laugh at my first thought.... its Soylent Green. | ||
| Johnnymceldoo |
Based on most of the responses thus far its clear this plan would need to be stealthy implemented. | ||
| Sayitaintso |
You gotta fill the biggest hole..... who gets the "extra" money? To me your goal is noble....your method is madness. Reducing consumption of ANY natural resource is usually good, actually doing it is hard as hell even more so when its something everyone depends on.. | ||
| Bigblock |
My local gas station is charging close to 4.50 now, is that stealthy enough for ya? Just another way to bleed the poor and middle class and make the rich (i.e. oil co. execs) and the gov't richer. The state, at least here in CA makes as much or more per gal of gas as the oil co. | ||
| Hootowl |
I'm trying SO hard not to ruin this thread for you Johnny. I'm getting a good laugh out of it though. | ||
| Cowboy |
Dont you realize these gas prices is Obama's dream come true. that muslim bastard is hell bent on bankrupting America and every one in it. | ||
| Blake |
Master of sarcasm. Tip of the hat to you Johnny boy.  | ||
| Ferris_von_bueller |
I'm lucky there wasn't a spoon lying nearby when I clicked on this thread or I might have gouged my eyes out. | ||
| Aesquire |
http://www.teefury.com/archive/1148/Unprocessed_So ylent_Green/ Cowboy, Obama is not Muslim. He's a member of the church of liberation theology. You know, marxist. The Muslim thing is, I bet you, a ploy BY Obama's minions to make you look bad. ( and a lot of other people, none of whom like him. make you seem foolish, and they take your voice. ) I'm all for algae based biofuel. Corning would love making thousands of miles of glass pipe. I'd be happy to run little critter biodiesel in my car and tractor. ( truck too, when I can afford to buy a diesel truck ) No need to take up desert, you can built the pipes over existing industrial structures. Pump the slurry and you could even make fuel in winter. Obama wants higher fuel costs. Only artificially high prices will let very expensive "alternative" fuels compete. Some of these fuels, like alcohol, have become subjects of very foolish, and harmful gov. regulations. Mandatory alcohol production? A very Soviet thing. With high food and energy costs. A rich guy may use lots of energy. jet fuel, big cars, big house, outdoor heat for the patio and parties, etc. See Al Gore. He uses as much power in a month as I use in years. But rich people don't care. The percentage of their wealth that goes into fuel is much much much smaller than a shlub making $35k a year. If the Gulfstream cost you 20 million, Gore actually has to think a few seconds about buying one. The thousands for JetA mean nothing. To him. You not only have to consider the thousands for a car, but the hundreds for fuel. To fill my Van ( winter & heavy haul use mostly ) takes over a hundred dollars. That's a major part of my budget. The VW TDi only takes 50 bucks a fill up, and goes at least as far. So I have a choice of McDonalds OR driving to work in my budget decisions. Also consider. Saudi Arabia needs gas to be expensive to keep in power. If you like the Saudi's, fine, but the same math works for other dictators. If you love Hugo Chavez and his utopian dreams of dead reporters and eternal rule, high oil prices are what you want. If you want to screw the dictators, make oil cheap, HERE, by doing biodiesel, coal-to-diesel, and coal to synfuel. Crank the price HERE to say, $70bbl. ( twice what it should be, but about right to make synfuel, algae fuel, etc. profitable. ) make that the ceiling price. ( that would mean that we drill in Alaska and the Dakotas ) It's doable, and we don't have to export. I'm not a fan of centralized planning. It fails far more than it succeeds, and when it does work, it's more expensive than freedom. A lot. Still...... http://www.abndigital.com/page/multimedia/audio/39 7238-Oil-finds-100-floor-on-Saudi-politics-output- costs indepth, but i have not fact checked. http://www.rslissak.com/content/saudi-arabias-econ omic-needs-and-price-oil-joseph-mann | ||
| Firebolt020283 |
It just cost me $13 to fill my little ol buell you Can Kiss my Butt on this higher Gas price bull Crap... |
