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R100rs
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2011 - 09:31 pm: | 
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http://www.firstthings.com/onthesquare/2011/01/the -reasons-the-heart-wants |
Eaton_corners
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2011 - 09:38 pm: |
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"The Case for Christ" by Lee Strobel
"Mere Christianity" by C.S. Lewis
"The Case for Creation" by Lee Strobel
"Miracles" by C.S. Lewis
These men can speak more intelligently on the subject than anyone else I can think of, certainly better than me or anyone I know personally. I have read all of these books and would invite anyone who claims to be an atheist to do the same. If you are not willing to do so, I cannot accept that you are sincere in learning the truth.
I hope you are sincere, as it truly is a matter of life and death. As the Bible says; Do not fear that which destroys flesh, but He who is able to destroy both the flesh and the spirit. |
Blake
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 18, 2011 - 07:54 pm: |
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I've read Lewis' Mere Christianity, and it blew me away. His clarity of thought and presentation are amazing. What a privilege to be able to read such genius. |
Kenm123t
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 19, 2011 - 01:07 am: |
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Good link R100 |
Blake
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 19, 2011 - 02:05 am: |
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Rick,
This is intended to be a serious discussion and a respectful discussion. I removed your post; it was neither. |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 19, 2011 - 08:01 am: |
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You suckered me back into this thread with the CS Lewis reference. 
If you haven't read it, "The Screwtape Letters" is also very enlightening. |
Superdavetfft
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 19, 2011 - 09:13 am: |
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>>Rick, This is intended to be a serious discussion and a respectful discussion. I removed your post; it was neither.
* * Blake now you're just showing yourself to be a complete hypocrite. According to your own statement, quoted above, you should remove your own posts, unless you consider name calling and personal insults 'respectful'.
You shouldn't censor other people by guidelines you yourself can't, or won't, abide by. What other posts have you deleted or modified? You can't have an open debate when you silence the opposing viewpoint for any reason.
Before I just considered you another unfortunate person that's been brainwashed to the point of no return, now I see you're just self righteous and hypocritical. |
Rick_a
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 19, 2011 - 11:55 am: |
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I was trying to lighten the mood some.
Bummer.
Very Christian of ya, though 
(Message edited by Rick_A on January 19, 2011) |
Blake
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 19, 2011 - 01:38 pm: |
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I know you didn't intend anything malicious Rick. |
Blake
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 19, 2011 - 02:06 pm: |
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>>> * * Blake now you're just showing yourself to be a complete hypocrite. According to your own statement, quoted above, you should remove your own posts, unless you consider name calling and personal insults 'respectful'.
Which posts of mine are name calling and wage personal insult?
As I stated earlier in this thread
It was not my intent to offend you. My intent was to concisely counter your falsehoods and bewilderingly ignorant statements.
You tell us that you are an atheist, one who believes there is no God. Then you went beyond unbelief, you delved into rejecting and attacking my faith, my God, his word, then you lectured me, a Christian, that to be a Christian I must believe a litany of nasty things about the Bible and God, and that I must support all kinds of outrageous religious justice, like the killing of people if they work on Sunday.
Well, I am a Christian and I do not hold to the ignorant false assertions which you try to peddle about God, and the Bible and the Christian faith.
You pretend to know more about Christianity than those of us who are Christians?
You've preached willfully ignorant falsehood and shown a malicious desire/willingness to proselytize (on my own web forum no less) your egregiously false perceptions of Christianity, our Bible, and God to any who will listen.
Then when confronted on it you run away.
How cowardly.
You've done a very poor job of reading and understanding the Bible. Try again.
If you are embarrassed or feel offended, you should be. An honorable man admits when he is wrong and accepts truth.
>>> You shouldn't censor other people by guidelines you yourself can't, or won't, abide by.
I agree. And that is one reason we have a whole group of custodians at your disposal should you feel wronged. You've stated repeatedly that what I believe is truth is "fairy tales", that I believe in a God who endorsed rape and murder, that for me to be a proper Christian I must kill those who I see working on Sunday. You claim to have read the bible, but you post blatantly falsified scripture, then you are offended when called on it? Huh? How would you have me characterize such a presentation if not ignorant?
>>> What other posts have you deleted or modified?
If I modify any post, it will be indicated by a "Message edited by Blake" followed by the date.
>>> You can't have an open debate when you silence the opposing viewpoint for any reason.
I've done no such thing. To claim so is to bear false witness. That said, I absolutely reject the idea that we must allow any and all commentary a respected place here. Debate, if it is to be productive and thoughtful, must adhere to some level of rules and decorum. Please note that "thoughtful" doesn't mean "unconditionally kind" or "with deference to all." Thoughtful debate means that we stick to the topic, criticize ideas not people, avoid ad hominem. Yes, "criticize ideas" includes pointing out falsehood and ignorance (lack of knowledge), especially if said ignorance and falsehood are repeatedly willfully clung too despite clear evidence to the contrary.
Why not accept the olive branch and take up thoughtful discussion? Why not? Your ideas not up to the challenge? Are you afraid that the truth might shatter your preconceptions and force a re-evaluation of your beliefs? Why would that frighten you away from debate? Why not seek truth? |
Blake
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 19, 2011 - 02:09 pm: |
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Bill,
The Screwtape letters are amazingly insightful. So easy to read too. |
Drkside79
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 19, 2011 - 02:20 pm: |
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As far as the bible being fairy tales i find that to be a partially true statement. I do not question the existence of God or the desire of the human heart to react strongly on the subject. The problem i have with the bible is that it was in no way written by God. Many of the books were based off of actual events and then embellished or sugar coated. Do i blame God for this? Absolutely not I blame man I blame powerful men who used such tactics to control others. In fact one of the beefs i have with some of todays politicians is that they twist the words of the bible to suit there needs.
In general the bible represents both the best and the worst of humanity. If you follow its teachings it's a darn good way to live your life. Do I believe that a man lived in a whale no do i believe in Noah's ark NO. Do I believe Noah existed and had a boat sure. Do I believe in the story of the good Samaritan yes i do and it may be the best thing in the bible. |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 19, 2011 - 05:39 pm: |
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I can't remember if this is CS Lewis or GK Chesterton, but either could have said it..
The quote was along the following lines...
"The Bible is either just literally true, or its even more true than that."
Putting this into a motorcycle context...
I can say "My Ulysses is a nice bike". That is a literally true statement.
Or I can say "My Ulysses is a wind that brings a refreshing wind to my face and draws great friends to my back". That is more than just literally true, it is a poetic expression that captures a rich and complex collection of literally true facts.
Just because it is expressed as a poem or parable doesn't mean it can't be true... if you look at a poem and choose to deliberately parse it in such a way as to make it is false, you aren't proving its false, you are just proving you are dogmatic and stupid. You have to look at a parable or poem on it's own terms and see what it has to say, and then try and prove that true or false (it can be either).
Don't sell yourself short by artificially constructing a small God. |
Blake
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 19, 2011 - 08:53 pm: |
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Andy,
>>> Many of the books were based off of actual events and then embellished or sugar coated.
How do you know this? Please explain.
>>> the bible ... was in no way written by God.
Not even inspired by God? |
Blake
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 19, 2011 - 08:54 pm: |
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Your objection to the use of the Bible for selfish aims is right in line with the trouble Jesus himself ran into with the temple authorities. You're in good company. |
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