| Author | Message | ||
     Littlebuggles |
No trouble codes blinking... I've got a data cable for ECM Spy, but I can't seem to find the proper port to plug into... Not being able to reach my dad, who is my usual go to guy for basic sorts of stuff I thought I'd consult Badweb and pray for the best. Switches are all suspect I suppose... There are no apparent burned wires or posts. It worked before we left town, but is not doing more than lighting up those indicator lights. Indicator lights for the range and the oven both light up but no heat from any of the elements. Should I just be checking for continuity between posts to find the break in the circuit? Help?    | ||
| Fahren |
Built in fuse? I think it would be weird for all the switches to fail at once. Is there some weird anti-tip safety switch or something (a sort of bank angle sensor for stoves)? Here's what yahoo has to tell you: "Put Circuit tester at the 220 volt cable first. If it has power then it's the stove. Terminal block possibly but before you attach the cable, see if there is continuity in the terminal block with a continuity tester. Add previous entries and begin a slow but safe process of trial and error. Don't ignore the cylindrical tube shape fuses at the panel. They can look fine until you take them out and shake them to see if one of the them has blown. Again, turn off power to the panel first. If there is any doubt about doing this safely call an electrician." http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=200904 04170457AAnGef6 | ||
| Rwven |
Where the cord joins the stove check for 220-240 volts between the black and red wires and 110-120 volts between the black and white and the red and white wires. It looks to me like you may have lost one leg of the 220-240 volt circuit. The indicator lights are 110-120 volts so they would still light, but the elements are all 220-240 volts so they would not. That's the first thing I would check. If the power coming in is OK then you are dropping a leg of the 220-240 volt circuit somewhere in the range itself. (Message edited by rwven on December 29, 2010) | ||
| Baybueller |
Possible manual reset hi temp safety? Small device with push button and 2 wires going to it. | ||
| Iamike |
Did you check your circuit breaker in the service panel? Even though it's a 240v system one side of the breaker could have opened which could fool you because the indicators may just be 120v. Switch the breaker off & on a couple of times and then try again. | ||
| Littlebuggles |
Thanks, never would have thought to check yahoo for that sort of info! | ||
| Littlebuggles |
K, so big thanks for all the input so far. I can only figure this is the breaker(the box behind the rheostat) it appears to be a splitter or distributer:   It came apart easily, and all the contacts looked burned, not melted but there was a lot of black on the contacts. Here they are cleaned with a q-tip, then a fine tooth needle file:   Then I reassembled it and plugged it in, and... nothing. Hmmm. Maybe there is a replacement part available? Checking with GE online (stove is a Hotpoint) now that my clever wife pointed out several product labels that I missed. | ||
| Littlebuggles |
So as Rwven and Iamike mentioned. 110 seems to work while the 220 side is not getting power... "dropping a leg of the 220-240 volt circuit somewhere" Baybueller, can't find anything resembling the hi temp safety you've described, but the carbon and smoke residue seem to indicate the breaker switch thingy. | ||
| Littlebuggles |
Their website shows this little part (#14 on the diagram) at $124.25. https://genet.geappliances.com/IPCNet/Dispatcher?R EQUEST=IPCNETGETPDF&file=00000000/00000900/0000099 7.p01.pdf Maybe I can add a little solder to each of the connections just to make sure they are making contact? Seems like I might cause constant contact that way, and the resulting problems might cost a lot more than 125 bucks to fix. | ||
| Xbduck |
Sometimes the power cord will burn out inside the vinyl plug. It will look fine most times, but if you look close you might see burn marks around where the prongs go into the plug head. | ||
| Littlebuggles |
I understand what you are saying Xbduck, thank you for your suggestion. Continuity test between the individual prongs and the main block all show good. Tester is a cheap pocket digital Radio Shack multi-meter. It just beeps for continuity. Should I be looking for something else, measuring resistance? | ||
| Xbduck |
Your continuity check should be good enough, did you check to see you have 220 power at the outlet? The 220 is on the angled sides. Also check to make sure you breaker didn't trip one leg. The easiest way to check the breaker is to turn it off then back on. | ||
| Xbduck |
Also don't buy one of those switches just yet, I may find one tomorrow at work. it would be used but the price would be right. | ||
| Littlebuggles |
Didn't check the circuit breaker since I think the dryer is on the same circuit and it's working fine. But I'll toggle the thing and see if it gets me anywhere. Used and working is much better than used and broke. Thanks. | ||
| 86129squids |
What's the matter with your stove? | ||
| Xbduck |
Your stove should be on it's own breaker. It will be a double pole breaker just like the dryer. The stove should have a 50 amp service and the dryer a 30 amp service. | ||
| Littlebuggles |
I have no idea what I'm doing. Black wire into the block and ground show 120V, red wire and ground show 25.3 mV, and black and red checked at the same time yield a 83.2 mV reading. WTH? | ||
| Xbduck |
I'll check how things have progressed in the morning. I've got to get to bed. Good Luck! | ||
| Littlebuggles |
Okay, a moment of clarity, carefully guided by all of you all, (except squids  who failed to read the original post...) That 120 reading (yeah, it started to make sense) along with your last post Xbduck, told me I needed to flip the breakers for sure. Couldn't find one marked 50A so toggled all the double pole breakers I don't have marked. Got heat to the range again. YAY!! Did I over-complicate a simple matter? None of the breakers appeared to be tripped, none even felt any different but the stove works now so that must have been it. | ||
| Littlebuggles |
Oh yeah, so seriously, all contributors to this thread, THANKS!!  Badweb rocks. | ||
| Toona |
My background: I was a self employed appliance repairman for 18 yrs. UNPLUG THE STOVE WHILE DOING ALL CONTINUITY CHECKS. USE EXTREME CAUTION WHEN DOING POWER CHECKS. Check power to the stove. The center terminal where the cord attaches to the stove is neutral. The black and red are your 110v each making your 220v. So from black to white is 110v, red to white is 110v, black to red should be 220v. if all is right. I can't tell you how many times I've ran into a bad breaker or blown fuse not supplying the correct power to the wall outlet behind the stove. The good part is your stove is a simple design, no printed circuit boards with relays etc to diagnose. The thermostat is a simple make or break continuity switch. You should have continuity across the main heavier gauge wires- I can see one red wire, can't see the other color. Should you find that you have correct power supply to the stove and continuity across the thermostat (heavy gauge wires). You should have 220v to the red and yellow wires to the lower baking element. With power disconnected, you should have continuity across the terminals on each of the bake element (bottom) and broil element (top) You will have to pull one of the wires off the back of the element to check it. You can't check continuity with both wires on the element. | ||
| 86129squids |
OK, here's some deeper knowledge... "So the things to do when working on a motorcycle, as in any other task, is to cultivate the peace of mind which does not separate one's self from one's surroundings. When that is done successfully, then everything else follows naturally. Peace of mind produces right values, right actions produce right thoughts. Right thoughts produce right actions and right actions produce work which will be a material reflection for others to see of the serenity at the center of it all." Robert M. Pirsig | ||
| 86129squids |
No, I read the original post, and everything since- you lost me when you tried to plug into ECMspy to fix this...  So- stove won't heat? $cheep from your recycled/used appliance joint... | ||
| Littlebuggles |
Yeah Squids, I was trying to be funny there, but was a bit distracted by my general confusion. I also figured someone would make a joke regarding the ECM or complain about this being a motorcycle site and to take my questions elsewhere, so wanted to head both of those conversations off before someone attempted to start the. So - Stove wouldn't heat, but will now. I was freaking out about having to buy a new new stove, and totally spaced the whole used new appliance side of the spectrum. Thanks for the reminder there, cuz I should know better; and the deeper knowledge was a useful reminder to not loose my mind when things stop working.  Toona, good points - the simple wiring pleased me, but then when what I thought was a stove problem wasn't I became frustrated and out the window went that "peace of mind which does not separate one's self from one's surroundings" and so lost I the "serenity at the center of it all". I did, however, remember to unplug the stove and was pretty careful/nervous checking the power once I'd plugged it in (tester probes wouldn't reach far enough so had to plug the stove in then check power at the block). I appreciate your explanation of the 220V thing too, I didn't know how that worked. So if I bothered to check power (now that stove is working) I'd be more likely to find 220 than 240V since the reading was 110 on the one side. Thanks again guys I sure do appreciate the help.  | ||
| Just_ziptab |
Turn gas valve,light match..works for me.......  | ||
| Bluzm2 |
What Zip said. Get a gas range.... Seriously though.. When ever you do troubleshooting of ANYTHING, start with the easy stuff. The easiest being power. In this case if you had metered the inputs to the stove as Rwven had suggesedt you would not have had to disassemble anything. Next step would have been the breaker as IAMike posted. So,,,, did ya learn anything? That's the important part really. Brad | ||
| Littlebuggles |
Yup, learned a fair bit I think. I didn't know 220-240 was split in half, so was lead to believe (by my lack of knowledge) that I did have power(lights worked), not that half of it was missing. I've known and attempted to start with the simple stuff, but sometimes knowing which is the best place to start can be difficult (see above). Ummmm, flip the breakers (I need to sort out what the unmarked breakers are for. I started that project at one point but got sidetracked before the job was complete). Once again, I'm reminded not to "loose my mind" when a bit of drama I don't understand pops up. (That's gonna be useful as my daughter gets older, I need to keep practicing inner peace). Understanding comes with patience, you can't force it, impatience doesn't really help a bit. Frequently helpful advice from friends is the best thing ever. Gas is not easily routed to the kitchen in my little condo. When I buy a home in the next few years I hope to have a gas range; they are also my preference. | ||
| Kenm123t |
Check the breaker terminal lugs not having the wiring tight will cause it to heat up. Heat rise in a termination is cumulative.Hot terminal equals loose wire loose wire more heat. Also check the breaker lugs where its snapped in the panel. | ||
| Dennis_c |
+ 1 for Kenm123t | ||
| Just_ziptab |
Of all the problems we have with tons of machinery at the plant.......up to 480 volts,loosing a leg is the most common. Cycling the power brings back up a lot of the PLC controlled stuff......and then there is the all too common.......WIRED backwards. I replace a motor and the electrician re connects the wires.A centrifugal pump runs fine backwards........just doesn't move very much product.DAMHIK..too many times. | ||
| Ducbsa |
Repairclinic.com has diagnostics. | ||
| Kenm123t |
Reverse rotation is one of the many reasons I never let electricians do any final wiring and start any thing! | ||
| Iamike |
Buggles, Glad to see you got it fixed, cheap. I learned about the breaker opening the hard way on the fridge while on a 2-week vacation. It didn't trip, just opened. Really stinky house when we got back. BTW - just measuring continuity and voltage without a load can fool you. There can be a high resistance contact that will not pass current with a load on it. |
